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[(BG1) Firebead Elvenhair's reward from tutorial quest, well, sucks

TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
edited July 2012 in Fixed
Problem: When completing the tutorial quest in Candlekeep, Firebead says something along the lines of "Let me cast this spell on you, it will protect you from what may come tonight" and casts Protection from Evil on you. The problem is that even if you're playing a Monk (which at level 1 already has improved movement) even if you make a beeline to Gorion the spell wears off half-way on the run to Gorion.

Expected bevahiour: Firebead actually casts something useful on you.

Note: The problem appears to come from the changes to the spell "Protection from Evil" from the BG1 engine to the BG2 engine. In BG1 the spell duration was 10 rounds, which is enough for you to reach Gorion. In BG2 the spell duration was changed to "2 rounds per level of the caster".

Not sure if you guys will want to bother with something as trite as this, but a possible solution would be to level up Firebead? He must be something like level 1 for his spell to wear off so quickly.

Post edited by Bhryaen on
Moomintroll

Comments

  • DeeDee Member Posts: 10,447
    It seemed a mite odd to me as well. Honestly, I never really thought it was that useful to begin with, but if he's going to cast a spell on you, it should probably last long enough for you to leave the inn... He casts Melf's Acid Arrow, so he's at least level 3, which means the spell currently lasts 6 rounds instead of 10. I don't think making him level 5 would be worthwhile, though.

    The PnP duration for the spell is as it is in BG2, so I wouldn't mess around with that. I wonder if there isn't a more useful spell that will last longer, though. Barkskin's good, but it's not a wizard spell. What about Armor? Of course, that has a target of "Self" in BG2 - though in PnP rules, it's a range of "Touch". That spell lasts 1 turn, which is 10 rounds if I remember correctly; putting the spell right on the level with its original effect. More directly useful for mages than warriors, but mages are the ones who will probably need it most anyway.

  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    Hmm, maybe someone should level up a Cleric or Mage a bit and see if the duration of Protection from Evil really is increasing with the caster level.

    Though its possible that the BG engine not only speeds up walking but rounds too.

  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    Just checked this situation in vanilla BG1. The spell actually ends during the cutscene with Gorion, so its equally as useless in vanilla BG1.

  • BhryaenBhryaen Member Posts: 2,874
    Yes, was about to tell you about BG1- knew without having to check. So it's normal BG1, but still pointless. "Thanks for nothing, Elfhair!"

    kangaxx
  • DeeDee Member Posts: 10,447
    I think it's primarily intended to protect your low-level self from the assassins within Candlekeep. But as it is, the spell doesn't last long enough to get to where the assassins are - and that's assuming that you go straight to them.

    Medillen
  • HeroicSpurHeroicSpur Member Posts: 905
    I'm surprised you would say that @Bhryaen, this is a classic example of what you've been saying about encouters/memorable people etc. I don't think the point of the blessing (protection) is to actually protect you from anything. I think this is just about the principle, you've helped an old man and he has protected you.

    That said some decent reward would be nice.

  • DeeDee Member Posts: 10,447
    What if he gave you a Ring of Protection +1 instead - and then replace that secret cache's treasure with a scroll of Protection From Evil? It would be a much more meaningful gift, wouldn't unbalance gameplay at all, and would last a lot longer.

  • BhryaenBhryaen Member Posts: 2,874
    @HeroicSpur
    If it's any consolation, I don't require it to change. :-P That said though you'd think the old man would do more than a magic trick for having toiled and slaved and struggled to fetch his scroll from across the yard.

  • KeithSKeithS Member Posts: 623
    I changed it so that he now uses a Scroll of Protection from Evil on the player, which has a duration of 10 rounds.

  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    @KeithS
    Its a nice thought. But like @Bhryaen said, the spell didn't last long enough in vanilla BG1 either so the situation will be the same anyway. Sorry for wasting your time on this >.<

  • KeithSKeithS Member Posts: 623
    It wasn't much time :-P

    And I'm open to better suggestions on this one, for sure.

  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    Lol, maybe a healing potion to heal that 1 HP damage that we take in the cutscene?

  • DeeDee Member Posts: 10,447
    I do think, certainly, that giving the player an item to use as they see fit would be more useful than a short-duration spell that gets cast immediately. A potion of healing, a protection scroll, a magic ring, or a wand of some kind would all be good things to have that wouldn't necessarily unbalance the game.

    Or maybe a cloak that can be used by any character, whose only effect is the protection from critical hits normally granted by a helmet. That would be roughly on par with a short-duration spell, and would be an item that reminds the player of where they came from.

  • CorianderCoriander Member Posts: 1,667
    Having an item that stays with you would be cool. We wouldn't be able to make a new item though.

  • DeeDee Member Posts: 10,447
    edited June 2012
    I can think of a few items, but they're either class-specific or generally too powerful for the beginning of the game.

    I would say either a Protection scroll, or a Ring of Protection +1 - and then change the ring that's hidden in the cache south of the Friendly Arm Inn for something else of roughly equivalent monetary value to an Identify scroll. For simplicity's sake, I'd go with the Protection scroll. That way anyone can make use of it, and they can wait until a little later in the game to put it to use if they know they're going to need it.

  • BhryaenBhryaen Member Posts: 2,874
    One very useful item to get at that point might be an antidote potion since the only one you can get in Candlekeep is a unique (unstackable) one intended for a cow. That said, not sure why Elvenhair would be offering such a thing... Since he's into scrolls, maybe he could offer a scroll of Friends or something. I'd suggest a Healing Potion as well, but you can already get those from the Priest of Oghma- one simply by being nice.

  • BhryaenBhryaen Member Posts: 2,874
    Confirmed Successfully Altered.

    Now he takes all your Identify scrolls (I'd CLUA'd in a few) and not only casts Protection from Evil, but also adds a healing potion to inventory...

    Rethinking this a bit, his dialog upon quest end does state, mind you:
    Ah, I am glad to see that age has not hardened your heart towards an old man such as myself. I'll take all of your identify scrolls - I have a great use for those types of scrolls. Here, allow me to cast a little spell on you. It will protect you from any evil you might meet tonight.
    So he says outright that he's just casting a spell as a reward. Thus the dialog text would probably have to change for him to offer a different reward. I'd be OK with that, but still- this means it's not quite yet fixed. Then again his dialog states that his spell "will protect you from any evil you might meet tonight," but the spell is purged when heading out of Candlekeep at night... Still, it would help against Carbos and Shank, I suppose...

    (Come to think of it, why is it nightfall if leaving "immediately" from Candlekeep in the day? *sigh* Thinking too much...)

  • HeroicSpurHeroicSpur Member Posts: 905
    @Bhryaen: The way Gorion speaks immediately prior to leaving suggests that he has been sorting things out before leaving, and that you intentionally leave at night to avoid drawing attention. That said an extra line in your final dialogue with him that says 'we shall depart under cover of night' might make the sequence less jarring.

    Bhryaen
  • IgneousIgneous Member Posts: 368
    I had a sneaking suspicion about this... I just checked this in vBG1, and Firebead gives you the potion there, too! He drops it into your inventory all quiet-like, the sneaky little bugger. :)

    SethDavis
  • IgneousIgneous Member Posts: 368
    Also, confirmed fixed. Firebead now casts PfE from scroll. The duration is 12 rounds, as the game uses BG2's version of PfE (the scroll's description doesn't reflect this) and the scroll is being used at caster level 6.

  • BhryaenBhryaen Member Posts: 2,874
    edited July 2012
    @Igneous
    Thanks... then

    Post edited by Bhryaen on
  • SethDavisSethDavis Member Posts: 1,812
    @Bhryaen - Just wondering, do "Successfully Altered" and "Not Done a Single Thing" mean I can move it to Confirmed Fixed?

  • BhryaenBhryaen Member Posts: 2,874
    @SethDavis
    Looks like it's a go. If @Igneous says it's good, it's gotta be good:

    Confirmed Fixed.

    Igneous
  • IgneousIgneous Member Posts: 368
    @SethDavis - Yep, as @Bhryaen mentioned, this is 'Confirmed Fixed.' See my second post just above.

  • Avenger_teambgAvenger_teambg Member, Developer Posts: 5,862
    Lol, yes, he slips a healing potion in your pocket in bg1 too. I never noticed that before. I like how this is done, he is very subtle and won't openly give much, but secretly caring.

  • QuartzQuartz Member Posts: 3,834
    Yeah I always preferred to just keep his Identify scroll. Bwuahahaha.

    killingwithasmile
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