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[Bug/Mechanics] Incorrect experience reported in dialogue bar

IgneousIgneous Member Posts: 368
edited August 2012 in Fixed
Current behaviour: When slaying things, the experience gain reported in the dialogue bar does not match that recorded on the character record screen. For example, when killing Firebead, though 2,700xp is reported in the dialogue bar, you can see on the character record that, in fact, 2,970xp has been accumulated. Depending on the creature slain, there is approximately a 10% discrepancy between the experience reported and the experience given.

Expected behaviour: Experience reported in the dialogue bar should be consistent with that recorded on the character sheet, or vice versa.

Games affected: BG2, BGEE.

Notes: I believe this to be related to the reports Bhryaen posted about many creatures giving slightly 'off' amounts of experience. Writing this, I now realise this behaviour was also present in BG2, and was addressed by Ascension64's Experience Corrections patch (now part of TobEx). If possible, I would suggest reporting the old, rounder xp values and removing the 110% scaling (as shown on the character sheet) — though this would produce a slight (though not unhealthy, IMO) balance adjustment.

Post edited by Bhryaen on
Bhryaen

Comments

  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 4,732
    edited June 2012
    One thing that they should really fix, is how experience was calculated, in the bg II engine you were actually given an extra random 10% extra XP from everything, which was ridiculous, ( except for CHAR has gained XXXX quest experience) they really need to fix that so if your 6 player party gained 12 000 XP from an enemy everyone in the part gets 2 000 XP not 2 200 XP, and same went for that bg tutu/ bg trilogy thing where you could play bg1 with the bg II engine, oh man the XP was coming out the ying yang, probally because of that extra 10 % bonus thing, in bg 1, doing everything before the mines i will have around 49 000/ 50 000 XP per character before i go to the nashkiel mines, in that tutu version i just went straight for the good stuff and didnt do any extra grinding at all, and the time i got to the nashkiel mines i was already passed 64 000 XP, i would almost want to say that they shouldnt add the thief/ mage XP experience thing in, ( despite the fact it was only 10% of it acutally was) its just way too much XP was too fast, or at least make it so you dont get the extra 10% from everything, i hate killing 4 XP kobolds and somehow my top person gets 2 or 3 XP, hmmmm math is fun apparently

  • BhryaenBhryaen Member Posts: 2,874
    This isn't a bug though. There is a Feature Request (mine) for an Advanced Option that allows you to control this setting, default being No XP. You may have to search the forum to find it, however...

    Anton
  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 4,732
    actually im not talking about how disarming traps/ opening locks/ scribing scrolls being the bug, im saying the 10 % XP boost you get from everything is, for example, be a mage in bg II and just be by yourself with no other team mates, and scribe a scroll and notice your XP before and after, and you will get more than what it says, for example, if you scribe a level 6 spell, it says the party has gained experience: 6000 but when you look to see how much you gained you actually got 6 600, and thats even the same with enemies, the only time you dont get that bonus 10 % is when you get quest experience per character, that 10 % would be something i would like them to fix

  • AndreaColomboAndreaColombo Member Posts: 5,326
    I'm not 100% sure, but I believe CHARNAME was intended to get a 10% bonus to all XP gained as part of his being "special". In this case, it could be turned into an option so that people who find it overpowered or game-breaking can turn it off, as @Bhryaen suggested.

  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 4,732
    i also believe all other party members get that bonus as well

  • AntonAnton Member, Moderator, Mobile Tester Posts: 513
    Only Charname get 10% XP bonus.
    Actually it was supposed to work differently:
    In case if Charname's class main stat >=16 (for example DEX for thief or INT for mages) he receive permanent 10% XP bonus. But currently it applies for Charname no matter what stats he have.

    SterlingArcherCommunard
  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 4,732
    i think it actually applies to everybody because once i get to throne of bhaal (minus the higher quest experience for character thing for the main character) my main character only has about 5 000 xp more at most over my last character (since xp goes down the list when there is leftovers if it couldnt be divided evenly) it might even only be like 2 500 xp actually, and even if that was the scenario, i dont think the main character needs a 10 % boost

  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    edited June 2012
    I thought that 10% discrepancy was explained by being a bonus that the NPC got for being a bhaalspawn. At least I've seen people on the forum mentioning that.

  • BalquoBalquo Member, Developer Posts: 2,733
    Well it seems TobEx has been added to the new 0615 build. So someone to test :)

  • SethDavisSethDavis Member Posts: 1,812
    Just to confirm, should the experience gain be dropped to the displayed value, or should the display be raised to the actual gain? Looking at the code the difference seems to have been done quite intentionally although there are no comments as to why.

  • BhryaenBhryaen Member Posts: 2,874
    @SethDavis
    I can't wager as to which was intended, but I'd rather the 100% happen than the 110%. The whole "Bhaalspawn advantage" thingy seems overly gratuitous: the advantage to being a Bhaalspawn is being the central protagonist and getting those Bhaalspawn powers, not to mention having an IRL person providing the AI and the ability to reload. So one vote to just make the actual gain 100% (rather than 110%) and have the display reflect it.

    IgneousSethDavisAndreaColombo
  • IgneousIgneous Member Posts: 368
    @SethDavis - I'm with Bhryaen on this one. In my opinion, the 110% experience scaling should be dropped to accurately reflect the xp value displayed in the dialogue bar. The xp value displayed in the dialogue bar should also reflect the actual xp coded into the creature file (e.g., 35xp for a slain gibberling, and so on). This is what TobEx does, essentially.

  • IgneousIgneous Member Posts: 368
    Just to be clear, in BG1 there is no hidden 110% experience scaling present, and the xp reported in the dialogue bar accurately reflects the xp given on the character sheet.

  • AndreaColomboAndreaColombo Member Posts: 5,326
    I agree with @Igneous and @Bhryaen. That gratuitous 10% bonus to XP should be dropped - not only from BG:EE for consistency with BG1, but also from BG2:EE because it makes no sense and the game already offers A LOT of XP with no need for artificial boosts.

  • SethDavisSethDavis Member Posts: 1,812
    edited June 2012
    Potentially fixed - The 110% experience has been removed, which also fixes some truncation issues in displaying experience gained

    Post edited by SethDavis on
  • IgneousIgneous Member Posts: 368
    Confirmed fixed. The correct amount of experience is now being reported in the dialogue bar, and experience is being added on the character sheet with no hidden scaling. Happy, happy day. :)

    Tested with a variety of creatures, locks, and traps.

  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 4,732
    good, i hated that extra boost, it was completely unnecessary

  • moody_magemoody_mage Member Posts: 2,052
    Sorry to rez this. According to 2nd Ed AD&D characters would gain a 10% XP gain if their primary stat was 16 or more. This is easy to gain with single class characters but more difficult for some of the more diverse multiclass characters which had several primary ability scores. Rangers and Paladins also sometimes would have difficulty in getting this bonus.

    Just FYI - there is a reason behind the 10% XP gain...

    AndreaColombo
  • BhryaenBhryaen Member Posts: 2,874
    @decado
    I believe the BG house rule for the 10% was simply the Bhaalspawn status, nothing to do with attributes. That's what was removed. Perhaps the idea of it was derived by the original devs from that DnD source, but it wasn't adapted anything like it: regardless of your stats the party was getting 10% extra. Now, not so.

  • moody_magemoody_mage Member Posts: 2,052
    @Bhryaen
    That's cool, it wasn't clear in the above post and I don't have enough game mechanic knowledge to check myself. Thought it was worth mentioning though in case it did relate to what I was saying in my post.

  • Ascension64Ascension64 Member Posts: 560
    edited August 2012
    Yes is fixed. To clarify, the entire party got 110% of experience. What you probably saw was that it was hard to divide up the experience, so the remainder of experience after dividing by the number of members in the party went to players in order of join, starting with Player1.

    TobEx gives the option of fixing this. It is a tweak settings since removing the boost does slow experience gain.

  • kamuizinkamuizin Member Posts: 3,680
    the 10% +xp from AD&D is related with the multi-class penality for XP in 3.5, no? So it's a base rule from AD&D that try to reward characters that focused on the main requeriment of their class. Easier to do in single classes, and hard to have if you're under more than one main atribute.

    I would prefer to have this problem fixed rather than removed from the game.

  • BhryaenBhryaen Member Posts: 2,874
    @Sarevok57's Bugs thread merged with this Fixed one...

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