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[Bard Kit] Charlatan v2.7 [IWDEE, EET, BGEE, BG2EE]

RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716
edited March 10 in General Modding
Introducing a new Bard Kit, coming directly from The Complete Bard's Handbook:

The Charlatan

Component 1 brings us the kit:

CHARLATAN: The art of swindling others with the tools of illusion, misdirection, enticement and impersonation is an age-old practice, though none master all four traits better than the Charlatan. They are the masters of manipulation and the idiosyncrasy of the con. Using their superior intellect, understanding of human psychology, confidence and self-control, they place their mark upon the foolish, the overconfident, the greedy and the naive.

Advantages:

- Starting at level 1, may use the Charm and Truth Perception abilities at will.
- Starting at level 3, may cast Friends as a special ability once per day.
- Starting at level 5, may use the Impersonation ability once per day.

CHARM

The Charlatan charms their mark for one turn. To be successful the target must be humanoid, non-hostile and fail a save vs. Death with a -1 penalty for every three levels of the Charlatan (maximum -3). There is a 5% chance that the mark will uncover the Charlatan's intentions and go hostile. To keep up the facade, the Charlatan cannot cast any spells or use PRO_HISHER bard song for 1 turn.

TRUTH PERCEPTION

The Charlatan is a professional cheat and liar, knowing all the tricks of the trade and how to identify them. Using this ability, the Charlatan has a 5% chance per level of dispelling hostile Illusion spells within a 120 foot radius area.

IMPERSONATION

The Charlatan can act and improvise to become anyone they wish to be. Using this ability, there is a 10% chance per level (maximum 50%) that the Charlatan receives the benefits of a specialist Warrior of the same level (up to level 13) with any weapon PRO_HESHE is wielding, including boosting PRO_HISHER Strength to 18/50. There is a 5% chance that the performance will fall flat, making the Charlatan become Frustrated, suffering a -3 penalty to damage, thac0, saving throws and armor class. Both effects last for 5 rounds and can be dispelled. During the act, the Charlatan can't use PRO_HISHER Bard Song, cast spells or use special abilities.

Disadvantages:

- Minimum of 16 Charisma
- Alignment restricted to non-lawful
- Can only wear up to and including studded leather.


Component 2 will give this kit to Eldoth - I searched for this kit at the Complete Bard's Handbook because I think that it fits his personality perfectly. The whole Skie "rescue" quest can be read as both her and Charname being manipulated by him.

Link to Download

Thanks, @fluke13 for helping me with the text!

Enjoy! :)

Post edited by Raduziel on
GusindaZaghoulGrammarsaladFina92WarChiefZekebooinyoureyesLoldrupfluke13Kurona
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Comments

  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 4,071
    Nice. :) The only bard kit I had pictured Eldoth to be from the CBH.

    Raduziel
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716
    edited January 2018
    Ok, some big changes here.

    I was using the Probability wrong. Infinity Engine calculates every Probability separately so the Charm ability was bugged. It is fixed now.

    I introduced a new ability, Pretend, adapting one feature from the Complete Bard's Handbook to be a little combat-oriented without losing the kit's flavor. Now this kit won't be a dead weight during battles. At least for 5 rounds.

    Pretend have a chance to boost your Charlatan, prejudice him-her or do nothing. The chance of getting the good effect is 10% per level and the bad one is a flat 5% (both effects were tested).

    Despise my best efforts I couldn't get the Reputation Lost from Friendly, but I have no reason to believe that it is coded wrong. If anyone gets this Rep loss, please, report here (the odds are only 5%).

    Friendly is not working as intended, but nothing that will prejudice your gameplay. I'll try to understand better how Opcode 108 works and I'll update a new version fixing it. In the meantime, you can use this kit without fear of losing your Reputation :)

    Hope you guys enjoy it.

    Gusinda
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 4,071
    Is the Pretend an adaptation of the masquerade ability? What are your thoughts as to the benefits?

    Raduziel
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716
    Zaghoul said:

    Is the Pretend an adaptation of the masquerade ability? What are your thoughts as to the benefits?

    Yup, an adaptation but much more oriented to combat as BG(2)EE doesn't have skills or attribute checks. Had to improvise and decided to do so by making this kit more useful on something that was nothing RP or social.

    What're your thoughts on this adaptation, @Zaghoul ? To summarize: his-her Thac0 becomes that of a Warrior of the same level (caps at lv 10), +1 hit +2 damage and the APR progression that a specialist Warrior gains (3/2, 2/1 and 5/2 with melee weapons and the respective values for different missile weapons).

  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716
    Ok, version 1.6 up.

    Friendly now is a once-per-day cast and it's obtained upon reaching level 3. In another hand, I gave up on the Reputation loss.

    I think I'm done with this kit, but I'm always open to suggestions.

  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 4,071
    All of the warrior skills for 5 rds seems alot ,might be a bit much. THACO and bonuses but maybe limit APR. Not sure if that is possible. The swashbucker in RR gets THACO as fighter and specialization bonuses for 2 pips in skills, but not fighter APR. Seems like that could work. Otherwise good.

    ArctodusRaduziel
  • subtledoctorsubtledoctor Member Posts: 11,400
    Yeah I don't see why you would get extra APR.

    Maybe the idea is, your APR would remain the same, but your opponent would think that the your APR was higher, and that the opponent was only getting lucky dodging or parrying blows. (When really those blows were never going to land at all.) It's all a con, right?

    So maybe apply this as a debuff to the opponent, instead of a buff to the Charlatan... the opponent gets freaked out and is negatively affected in some way. The idea being, the Charlatan is not actually a good fighter, but maybe your fighter buddy can take advantage of it and be more effective against that opponent.

    Not sure how to code it. Could do it as a small-radius aura: say, all opponents within melee range get an AC penalty. So it seems like your thac0 is great, when in fact your thac0 doesn't change and it's only the opponents tripping themselves up...

    RaduzielbooinyoureyesLoldrup
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716
    edited January 2018
    Zaghoul said:

    All of the warrior skills for 5 rds seems alot ,might be a bit much. THACO and bonuses but maybe limit APR. Not sure if that is possible. The swashbucker in RR gets THACO as fighter and specialization bonuses for 2 pips in skills, but not fighter APR. Seems like that could work. Otherwise good.

    Removing the APR and altering the duration of the effects is plenty possible. I was doing a small run with this kit and this ability didn't sound overpowered to me.

    Remember that you can have the buff for 5 rounds (50% of the time), nothing (45%) or a huge debuff (5% - 3 points penalty in pretty much everything). The Swashbuckler has his-her bonuses as a constant.

    And even if you succeed you lose something: the ability to cast spells, special abilities or use the Bard Song during the 5 rounds.

    If you transport this to IWD, 5 rounds are nothing. In BG(2)EE its enough for getting an edge on one single fight and probably not during all the battle - and getting an edge is the idea behind using an ability, right?

    Of course, if you play with rest or reload abuse or metagame buff this ability becomes overpower. But what ability does not under these conditions?

    I strongly recommend that you give this kit a try the way it is now. If after doing so you sustain this opinion I can always alter it for a more balanced option.

    Yeah I don't see why you would get extra APR.

    Maybe the idea is, your APR would remain the same, but your opponent would think that the your APR was higher, and that the opponent was only getting lucky dodging or parrying blows. (When really those blows were never going to land at all.) It's all a con, right?

    So maybe apply this as a debuff to the opponent, instead of a buff to the Charlatan... the opponent gets freaked out and is negatively affected in some way. The idea being, the Charlatan is not actually a good fighter, but maybe your fighter buddy can take advantage of it and be more effective against that opponent.

    Not sure how to code it. Could do it as a small-radius aura: say, all opponents within melee range get an AC penalty. So it seems like your thac0 is great, when in fact your thac0 doesn't change and it's only the opponents tripping themselves up...


    No, it's not that you trick your opponent into thinking that you can do something. You're such a good pretender that you actually do things that you have no idea how to do.

    The example in the book shows a Charlatan actually healing someone without having any skill or knowledge in healing, just to sustain his-her facade.

    That's the concept behind the Masquerade ability on the Complete Bard's Handbook and that's what I tried to implement within the boundaries of the Infinity Engine. It's like someone who believes so strongly that has diabetes that actually starts to need insulin.

    Maybe I failed miserably, I'm here just clarifying what's the logic behind this ability.

    Thank you, both @Zaghoul and @subtledoctor for your insights and feedbacks. Hope they keep coming as you play through this!

    Skatan
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 4,071
    An interesting take on it, affecting opponents from @subtledoctor . The RR blade does something similar with his Weapons display ability.

    As the masquerade from the CHB's fakes his skills and makes it seem like he knows what he is doing it makes sense in a way with the limited fighter bonus's.
    A good fake can be just as good as the real thing, for a time, so 5 rounds in the long run is not to much.
    Guessing it is a x/times a day thing, or unlimited uses?
    I'll be adding it to Eldoth regardless for testing.

    Raduziel
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716
    edited January 2018
    Zaghoul said:

    An interesting take on it, affecting opponents from @subtledoctor . The RR blade does something similar with his Weapons display ability.

    As the masquerade from the CHB's fakes his skills and makes it seem like he knows what he is doing it makes sense in a way with the limited fighter bonus's.
    A good fake can be just as good as the real thing, for a time, so 5 rounds in the long run is not to much.
    Guessing it is a x/times a day thing, or unlimited uses?
    I'll be adding it to Eldoth regardless for testing.

    The problem with @subtledoctor 's approach is:

    i) it's not the logic behind the ability

    ii) if he is not secure on how to code it I will not be crazy enough to try lol

    ---

    About the ability: it's one time a day with a 10% chance of success per level, starting at level 5 and capping at level 9 with 50%.

    So:

    * A lv 5 Charlatan, once a day, has a 10% chance of getting this buff becoming temporarily a lv 5 specialist warrior (and a 5% of getting the -3 debuff)

    * A lv 6 Charlatan, once a day, has a 20% chance of getting this buff becoming temporarily a lv 6 specialist warrior (and a 5% of getting the -3 debuff)

    (...)

    * A lv 9 Charlatan, once a day, has a 50% chance of getting this buff becoming temporarily a lv 9 specialist warrior (and a 5% of getting the -3 debuff)

    (...)

    * A lv 20 Charlatan, once a day, has a 50% chance of getting this buff becoming temporarily a lv 13 specialist warrior (and a 5% of getting the -3 debuff)

    So the probability caps at lv 9 with 50% and the benefits caps at lv 13 with the bonuses of a specialist Warrior of the same level.

    That's why I don't think it is unbalanced.

    Looking forward to your feedback, @Zaghoul :)

    ZaghoulLoldrup
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 4,071
    Ahh, looks much better detailed and written out that way, thanks. I'll be 'test drivin the wheels off' of Eldoth with this kit for certain. B)

    Raduziel
  • subtledoctorsubtledoctor Member Posts: 11,400
    Raduziel said:

    The problem with @subtledoctor 's approach is:

    ii) if he is not secure on how to code it I will not be crazy enough to try lol

    No no, that's easy to code. It's only a question of how you decide you want it. That was just an idea.

    Raduziel
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716
    edited January 2018

    Raduziel said:

    The problem with @subtledoctor 's approach is:

    ii) if he is not secure on how to code it I will not be crazy enough to try lol

    No no, that's easy to code. It's only a question of how you decide you want it. That was just an idea.
    I was just making a joke. The real issue with your approach is the first premise. But I'm grateful for your suggestion :)

    subtledoctor
  • ArunsunArunsun Member Posts: 1,581
    Just for clarification purpose concerning Pretend:
    -Why 10% per level capping at 50% when you get the spell at level 5 anyway (so 50% it works)?
    -As I understand it, the spell essentially has 50% chance to give you a warrior's perks, 5% chance to get the maluses and 45% chance to do nothing. Is that right?


    Nice kit with a great flavour anyway!

    Raduziel
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716
    @Arunsun

    - At level 5 you have 10% chance of success. You won't have 50% until lv 9

    - Up to 50% do give a warrior's perks, at least 45% of doing nothing (those depends on the Charlatan's level) and a 5% to get the maluses.

    Thanks! :)

    Arunsun
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 4,071
    A good kit so far. B) I am using the option that changes Eldoth to a charlatan and I have noticed he is prevented from learning new necromancy spells. Any ideas on why that would be?

  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716
    edited February 2018
    Zaghoul said:

    A good kit so far. B) I am using the option that changes Eldoth to a charlatan and I have noticed he is prevented from learning new necromancy spells. Any ideas on why that would be?

    My bad. I gave it the Illusionist usability flag instead of the Jester's one.

    Fixed both in the archive (v 1.8) and at the Github link.

    You can reinstall it to see if it fixes. If not, do the following:

    1) Open the game's Override folder

    2) Locate the file KITLIST.2da

    3) Open it with Notepad ++ - or any other file editor you trust and that can read .2da files.

    4) Locate the row that have "RACha" on the second column.

    5) Edit the eight column from 0x00000400 to 0x00400000.

    6) Save and edit.

    That should solve it, @Zaghoul .

    Thanks for the report.

    ZaghoulSkatan
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 4,071
    I have this mod way back on my install so used the edit you provided which fixed it, thanks. :) Thanks also for the better notepad version (much easier to read with) as well, the standard notepad on windows had 'chicken scratchin' jumbled all over the page.

    Raduziel
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 4,071
    I have been paying particular attn to dialogue between Eldoth and others. The more I see with his new kit in mind the more it seems to be an excellent fit, almost 'built in' when it comes to dialogue with other NPC's. I find it interesting how something like a change in a PC or NPC's class/kit brings notice to things that I did not before.
    Here's just one example between him and Verr'Sza the rakshasha ranger I thought you might enjoy: Heh, Verr nailed that one more than he knew in his last line. B)


    RaduzielMantis37Loldrup
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716
    edited February 2018
    I'm very happy seeing this!

    Since the old BG2 was released I had this urge to give a kit to every NPC - that was the reason I started downloading mods and making my own.

    Before making the Charlatan I used to give him the Gypsy kit (I can't remember if it is from Might and Guile, Song and Silence or Rogue Rebalancing) but something seems out of place to me.

    What is your opinion about the kit's balance, @Zaghoul ? Which level is Eldoth now?

    Thanks!

    Post edited by Raduziel on
    Zaghoul
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 4,071
    Heh, I gave him the gypsy kit a time or two as well from S&S, but like you mentioned, something was still a bit off with that fit for him.
    He's 8th lvl now and seems pretty balanced. The pretend ability I have both hit and failed with so seems about right to me. As his AC and HP are not the best it helps him perform as a backup fighter that does not make him super tough, but much better in a pinch. It helped quite a bit in Dorn's quest/end fight with Simmeon at the BG bridge where I landed a success with pretend. Playing my gypsy along side him gives some heavy charm power.
    Getting ready to start another BG run (restartitis ;) ) and I'll include him again for more testing. I was thinking with that kit I don't need a bard myself as he's much more interesting skill wise now. B)

    Raduziel
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716
    Good to know I'm not a total failure as a modder.

    Now apparently two people like this mod (you and my mom)!

    ArctodusZaghoulGusinda
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716
    Version 1.9 is up with custom icons for this kit's abilities (except Friendly).

    Zaghoul
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716
    Version 2.1 is up with the French translation kindly provided by @Gwendolyne :)

    Also, I changed Friendly to a simpler Friends using SPELL_TO_INNATE (this happened in version 2.0, but I forgot to add here). It's basically the same thing, just a different (and IMO better) way of coding.

    As Friendly did the same thing that Friends does I thought that there was no reason to keep it as a stand-alone special ability.

    ZaghoulYann1989
  • ChroniclerChronicler Member Posts: 1,082
    Looks really cool! Can't wait to try it out!

    Do you think you'll be wanting to add some Elven Leather or something like that to the game, or is it an intended drawback that you'll never be able to wear armor and cast at the same time?

  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,716

    Looks really cool! Can't wait to try it out!

    Do you think you'll be wanting to add some Elven Leather or something like that to the game, or is it an intended drawback that you'll never be able to wear armor and cast at the same time?

    It's an intended drawback. Without access to chain mail you lose access to the elven armor, what means no armored casting.

    Hope you like it :)

    Chronicler
  • ChroniclerChronicler Member Posts: 1,082
    The class has some pretty powerful abilities so it makes sense that the drawback would be a bit worse than it sounds.

    Raduziel
  • Mantis37Mantis37 Member Posts: 1,026
    Song and Silence has some leathers for Bards.

    Chronicler
  • ChroniclerChronicler Member Posts: 1,082
    Do you mind if I ask, is Perceive the Truth a spell? Or is it a modified version of the thieves' Detect Illusion skill?

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