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Item Pricing Weirdness?

HawkwinterHawkwinter Member Posts: 14
edited April 2019 in Builders - Toolset
What causes this? The in-the-game prices are much much lower than the toolset prices. (I've ruled out game difficulty, and anything to do with appraise)

Post edited by Hawkwinter on


  • HawkwinterHawkwinter Member Posts: 14
    edited April 2019
    FYI, I "Fixed" this bug.

    Drop the attached .2da into override and items with charges will be priced correctly in-game, but at 5x property price in the toolset, as opposed to priced correctly in the toolset but at 0.2x property price in the game.

  • WilliamDracoWilliamDraco Member Posts: 152
    Beamdog updated the limit of charges on items, like wands - up from 50 to 250.
    They did not change the actual number of charges on any items, so this wand in store has 50 charges.
    The determination of store value in-game includes a recognition of "less-than-full-charges".
    Given the wand in-game has 1/5th it's maximum number of charges, it's store value is 1/5th of the items set value.
    Hence the 'bug' isn't so much a bug but an unintentional side-effect of the increase in max-charges which needs to be adjusted for.

  • HawkwinterHawkwinter Member Posts: 14
    It's a *bug* in that:
    1. Item prices where it applies in shops are now 1/5 what it says they should be in the toolset
    2. Item prices where it applies in shops are now 1/5 what it says they should be in the D&D rules
    3. Item prices where it applies in shops are now 1/5 what they are if you craft them via feats.
    4. It totally throws off the price ratio between items with charges, single use consumables like potions, x/day items, and unlimited use items.

    It's not a feature, it's a bug. Yes, I can see how it happened, it was a mistake that they overlooked the side effect of raising max charges from 50 to 250. But until Beamdog fixes their arithmetic error in the engine such that ingame prices match toolset prices, the only fix we'll get in-game is the one I did with a 2da edit.

    "Unintentional side-effect" = bug.

  • WilliamDracoWilliamDraco Member Posts: 152
    It's not the same balance that it used to be, and it's not balanced against the other options available, but nothing happening here is an "arithmetic error in the engine". The engine is calculating things exactly correctly, using the numbers it has been given. The ingame prices DO match the toolset prices, given that the toolset price is for a max-charges wand and that ingame wand is a 1/5th charges wand.

    I agree that beamdog should change the balance of charge-costs to reverse the unintended imbalance of the max-charges change (much like you have done with your 2da change), but that is a balance change, not a bug.

  • HawkwinterHawkwinter Member Posts: 14
    edited May 2019
    All bugs are the result of the computer doing something "with the numbers[/instructions] it has been given" They're bugs when the computer is doing unexpected or undesired things as a result.

    >"the toolset price is for a max-charges wand"
    >The toolset price doesn't update when you change the number of charges.
    Well how about that! I could have sworn it did.

    "Balance changes" are intentional. This effect was not intentional. "Unintentional balance changes" are a kind of bug. Beamdog has acknowledged it as a bug.
    "thanks for taking the time to report this. We've verified the issue in the latest build, and it's been advanced to the programmers to analyze. When we have it fixed, we'll make this available in the next-released dev build (and later to stable, once proven to work out)." - Bill Harper, Beamdog.

    If it wasn't a bug, they wouldn't have agreed to 'fix' it, or referred to it as an 'issue' to be verified, they would have said it was intentional, and closed the bug report.

  • Grizzled_DwarflordGrizzled_Dwarflord Member Posts: 168
    I reported on this a year ago. You can call it a bug, error, oversight, whatever. It ain't right.

  • HawkwinterHawkwinter Member Posts: 14
    edited May 2019
    It ain't right.
    You saw the part where I fixed it, yeah?

    Use that 2da instead of the vanilla one (throw it in your override, put it in a hakpack for a server, or stuff it back into the appropriate bif - and you're done.

    Like, having them fix it officially would be great, but in the meantime, you can fix it for yourself

  • Grizzled_DwarflordGrizzled_Dwarflord Member Posts: 168
    Aye, I saw that. Shader comes first, they said, to which I understand. I'm just cantankerous old man who doesn't like things to be "fixed" when they weren't broken. But yes, I might make that 2da adjustment. Thanks for sharing, Hawkwinter.

  • HawkwinterHawkwinter Member Posts: 14
    Also: I sent my fixed 2da to beamdog as a proposed solution to bug 37900. They passed it along to Bill Harper to check. Hopefully it gets rolled out in the next patch.

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