I'm surprised they cut the line "there are others, I can show you, please!" That was an important hint to the story of the whole series before the game even started.
Can someone actually explain why they dislike the new intro? I haven't really heard a convincing argument, other then "It looks cheap!" which has debatable truth depending on the credit you give to style (certainly looks more expensive then reusing the old one would, though). Cartoonish is certainly not a good one, given the now incredibly lulzriffic quality of the old one.
Can someone actually explain why they dislike the new intro? I haven't really heard a convincing argument, other then "It looks cheap!" which has debatable truth depending on the credit you give to style (certainly looks more expensive then reusing the old one would, though). Cartoonish is certainly not a good one, given the now incredibly lulzriffic quality of the old one.
I think what they dislike is that it is not the exact same as the original to be honest. I personally quite like the new ones in terms of style (but, again, cutting that line was a mistake).
the thing i loved about the old intro, and made me very very slightly disappointed in the new one is this....
in the old one, it was a cobblestone road, and the blood flowed along the groves in the stones.....and then hit the intro, which became the focus. Not sure why, but i loved watching that part over and over again then and now. The horns looked cheesy but the old intro wasn't bad.....
i've never liked comic book style, but that's not what they were going for i think. I remember the manuals to the adnd books, and most of the art was drawn in a style like the new movies, in my opinion anyways. as for the differences, no comment til my 3rd playthrough. that's when i'll be able to judge them n their own merit, rather then looking through the glasses of the past.
My only dislike with the new movies is the animated parts. I love the style, but I think it would've been a thousand times better if they skipped on animating it (like the part where he got choked on the intro) and did it fully like a comic book with some zoom in/out and lighting changes only.
But it's definitely a lot better than the old ones. While I loved the old ones 'back in the day', it's embarrassingly outdated now. It had to either be replaced or just simply go.
There's two things wrong with the intro: the cut dialogue and the blood not flowing through the cobblestone, turning golden and creating the Baldur's Gate writing.
I would have liked the original Nietzsche quotation in there, but so far I like the new cutscenes, including the intro. A proper CG remake of the old intro would have been incredibly expensive, so this was a good compromise, and I like the art just fine.
The old videos are very low res (they look appalling on my 1920x1080 screen) and are incredibly dated - I definitely think they would put off newcomers to the game.
@agentmulder You know what? That Nietzsche quote was never even there in the localized German version. I just checked, and here I sat wondering since yesterday evening about that quote everyone was going on about.
It certainly is a shame it took me 14 years to notice that, and really, it gives that intro a different spin.
@agentmulder You know what? That Nietzsche quote was never even there in the localized German version. I just checked, and here I sat wondering since yesterday evening about that quote everyone was going on about.
It certainly is a shame it took me 14 years to notice that, and really, it gives that intro a different spin.
If that is true, change "Nietzsche" to "Unknown" and we have a deal
I thought the new intro was alright. I like the artwork in the new cinematics but would have preferred it if they were a series of still pictures. The motion comic style is just awkward, but frankly I find anything better than the original cinematics. Those low resolution, low detail, stiffly animated CGI scenes would look terrible if they were upscaled to fit present day displays. They were alright for 1998, but it's not 1998 anymore.
On the other hand, I think it would have been nice to have the option to use all of the original CGI cinematics, unmodified, instead of the few new replacements we got for those who want them. Sure they'd be really small in comparison to the new ones, but most of the people who want them are probably used to that anyway from using BGTutu and/or Trilogy for years.
@Wissenschaft As am I. However, I would suspect the logic behind it is for new players, who will be less confused. I mean, Nostalgia or no, old games have always been a little confusing.
Eh, I like the new intro. Sarevok is like ten times more menacing than he already was. Though, yeah, the cut lines are unfortunate, and the lack of a close-up on his chuckling face when he's crushing the guy's neck is also a regrettable loss.
Can someone actually explain why they dislike the new intro? I haven't really heard a convincing argument, other then "It looks cheap!" which has debatable truth depending on the credit you give to style (certainly looks more expensive then reusing the old one would, though). Cartoonish is certainly not a good one, given the now incredibly lulzriffic quality of the old one.
Why do you need others to do what you can do youself?
Can someone actually explain why they dislike the new intro? I haven't really heard a convincing argument, other then "It looks cheap!" which has debatable truth depending on the credit you give to style (certainly looks more expensive then reusing the old one would, though). Cartoonish is certainly not a good one, given the now incredibly lulzriffic quality of the old one.
Why do you need others to do what you can do youself?
..just open your eyes!
Believe it or not, somebody can watch the intro and not see anything "wrong" at all. It's a good intro, it's just not an exact duplicate of the old one. Nostaglia strikes again!
Why do you need others to do what you can do youself?
..just open your eyes!
Because I'd like individuals to actually justify their feelings or admit that it is just a baseless opinion? Ekster, for example, has a great point. The new intro treads the middle line between animation and stills a little too much.
After playing BG EE for some time now, I don't really see how OG can improve on BG II, as it seems they can only make it far worse, they simply won't have the budget nor the required understanding of quality ensurance.
Any old puppetteer would have least made some walking motion when he exits the door, instead of smooth hovering and least included the txt quote.
OG has simply defiled an old masterpiece, like giving a Stradivarius to a conservator and get back a cardboard version ..but we tryed to paint it in a nicer color, but we couldn't afford the required amount of paint so we had to cut some conors..
@Wissenschaft As am I. However, I would suspect the logic behind it is for new players, who will be less confused. I mean, Nostalgia or no, old games have always been a little confusing.
Its called foreshadowing. Your not expected to understand its significance until latter in the story.
I'm sorry to say that but the old intro was poor quality and sloppy for today's standards. The graphic animation that we get now is much better in my eyes. It still shows well enough what the game is about truth be told.
Besides, Sarevok hardly looked in a metal armor back in 1998.
I agree that artistically the new movies are poorer, and their numbers have been culled too. But the old ones had a very poor resolution, so they had to be replaced.
After playing BG EE for some time now, I don't really see how OG can improve on BG II, as it seems they can only make it far worse, they simply won't have the budget nor the required understanding of quality ensurance.
Any old puppetteer would have least made some walking motion when he exits the door, instead of smooth hovering and least included the txt quote.
OG has simply defiled an old masterpiece, like giving a Stradivarius to a conservator and get back a cardboard version ..but we tryed to paint it in a nicer color, but we couldn't afford the required amount of paint so we had to cut some conors..
So what I'm gathering from this is you're just here to whine.
Anyhow, regarding the cut line, I've been running this one over in my head a bit. Honestly, the scene works both ways and just depends on what you want. The new version actually leaves a bit more ambiguity about what's going on (as well as removing some complaints/questions about how this guy knew other people) by concealing his Bhaalspawn nature and the implication of there being more. The older version foreshadows a bit more.
Can someone actually explain why they dislike the new intro? Of course. What I like about it: -That it starts with a book illustration we're sucked into. -The style - I actually like the 'animated graphic novel' feel, it reminds me of Gabriel Knight 1 and Thief 1 & 2, which I deeply love. -The art - it is very pretty
What I don't like:
- they cut the quote, which sets the tone for the game and is one of the most memorable characteristics of BG1 - they cut the line, which was one of the main points of the intro, as it worked as very subtle plot exposition - "there are others, I can show you, please!" Now we are left with only "you will go first", which is only half of the message, (it could easily mean that Sarevok was going to go on a killing spree through the city, killing at random. The 'there are others' clearly indicated that there are some specific targets out there). - they butchered pacing and immersion. Everything happens too fast, there is no drama, it's just "The tower, the man, the other man, the murder, the blood, ON TO THE GAME!". To this day I feel for that poor guy from the original intro: beaten, hunted, swaying with exhaustion, running and then begging for his life, slowly choking, falling, bleeding. In the new one? Meh. Some guy gets thrown around, looks kinda sad, gets killed. There's nothing for me there to connect with him, and even he doesn't seem to care about his situation, so why should I? - they cut Sarevok's 'badass' moments - first one when he bursts through the door, the second one where he breaks a freaking iron railing with the poor guy's body, just so he can dangle him over the street and drop him. It showed how insane and insanely strong he is. In the new one that message doesn't come across half as well.
The 'Meh' moments: - the perfect round puddle of blood. Eh, ok. I get that they wanted it to become the Bhaal symbol. Looked somewhat strange, but I can live with it. (Even though I'd prefer if it formed the symbol by filling it, like it used to in one version)
All in all, it felt like it was aimed at the kind of audience who skips the cut-scene if it is longer than 60 seconds. I'm don' t like that.
@Syntia Thank you. It is certainly appreciated when someone actually illuminates their point. I can buy points 3 and 4 in the dislike column (to some degree). 1 and 2 I'm a little more "ehhhhhhh" on.
I haven't played BG until this year (months ago). The intro was terrible, and cartoonier than Reboot. My eyes bled... It was worse than Planescape's CGI. =A=
This new intro looked a lot nicer, but I wasn't expecting AAA movies. I think it fit the budget.
I personally like the old intro better. This one just lack the emotional punch that the old one did. Yeah, the old one doesn't look good anymore, but it's not like it couldn't be redone. One of the little thing I liked was that Sarevok pushes the nameless victim through the railing and then later in the game when you're visiting the Iron Throne, you can go up to the roof where it took place and it says something like "It looks like the railing has be repaired recently." or something like that. Took me a couple of playthroughs to notice it, but when I did, it gave me shivers. All in all, the cut scenes (so far) just lack emotion. Sarevok doesn't feel like some monster chasing the other guy. And yet, the worst one, to me, has been the cut scene for The Friendly Arm Inn. The original one has the drawbridge open and draw you in to the safety of its walls, then look up to see the great inn towering over you. It was a bit a intimidating, but a welcome sight after fleeing from Gorion's murder. If anywhere can be called safe, it would be that place. Now... it's just pretty much a static image. Just.. no.
The original opening to Baldur's Gate is nowhere near the high level quality of the original Star Wars movies. Stop being pretentious and dramatic. Baldur's Gate never had a strength in cutscenes or graphics. No one talked about the sick graphics from that game. I remember being underwhelmed by the few cinematics that existed at release.
Some of the true classics of 3D cinematics from the 90's are the following games
Final Fantasy 7-9 Metal Gear Solid Tekken 2-3
MGS and Tekken are outdated now in terms of visuals, but at the time, they were mindblowingly beautiful and memorable. They were definetly the talk amongst the gamers/nerds. FF 8 and 9's cutscenes still hold up today due to visual art direction. These are the true cinematic classics.
Still, do I like the new cinematics from BG EE? Well, I'm still underwhelmed so nothing has changed. I don't mind the motion pictures, but I definetly see ways the visuals could've been easily improved. However, Overhaul Games is a small studio, and this game has a low sale price which reflects their staff-power and how much they can do with their current limitations from contracts and budget. Not that it matters. The original cutscenes weren't any good to begin with, especially when compared to the games I just mentioned, though I'm sure there are many others I've left out.
At any rate, Beamdog definetly can't go back though. The original art source is gone. Forever. And the resolution on the old videos are poorly pixelated. I understand why they freed themselves from the tedious tradition when it wasn't practical anymore. There is a need for the new art direction as they can't go back. I understand that if new DLC is introduced, they may want to do some more cutscenes for the sake of pacing. It's very important to keep a consistent feel.
Besides, if you really want.. You can just mod the old videoes into the game, but do really you care that much? Do you really think the original awful 3D was what made BG 1 good? If so, I think you missed what made the game good. :P
Comments
Can someone actually explain why they dislike the new intro? I haven't really heard a convincing argument, other then "It looks cheap!" which has debatable truth depending on the credit you give to style (certainly looks more expensive then reusing the old one would, though). Cartoonish is certainly not a good one, given the now incredibly lulzriffic quality of the old one.
in the old one, it was a cobblestone road, and the blood flowed along the groves in the stones.....and then hit the intro, which became the focus. Not sure why, but i loved watching that part over and over again then and now. The horns looked cheesy but the old intro wasn't bad.....
i've never liked comic book style, but that's not what they were going for i think. I remember the manuals to the adnd books, and most of the art was drawn in a style like the new movies, in my opinion anyways. as for the differences, no comment til my 3rd playthrough. that's when i'll be able to judge them n their own merit, rather then looking through the glasses of the past.
I LOVE THE NEW ZOOM
But it's definitely a lot better than the old ones. While I loved the old ones 'back in the day', it's embarrassingly outdated now. It had to either be replaced or just simply go.
I miss Nietzsche line too. Can you guys put it back plz?
The old videos are very low res (they look appalling on my 1920x1080 screen) and are incredibly dated - I definitely think they would put off newcomers to the game.
You know what? That Nietzsche quote was never even there in the localized German version. I just checked, and here I sat wondering since yesterday evening about that quote everyone was going on about.
It certainly is a shame it took me 14 years to notice that, and really, it gives that intro a different spin.
On the other hand, I think it would have been nice to have the option to use all of the original CGI cinematics, unmodified, instead of the few new replacements we got for those who want them. Sure they'd be really small in comparison to the new ones, but most of the people who want them are probably used to that anyway from using BGTutu and/or Trilogy for years.
@Wissenschaft As am I. However, I would suspect the logic behind it is for new players, who will be less confused. I mean, Nostalgia or no, old games have always been a little confusing.
..just open your eyes!
After playing BG EE for some time now, I don't really see how OG can improve on BG II, as it seems they can only make it far worse, they simply won't have the budget nor the required understanding of quality ensurance.
Any old puppetteer would have least made some walking motion when he exits the door, instead of smooth hovering and least included the txt quote.
OG has simply defiled an old masterpiece, like giving a Stradivarius to a conservator and get back a cardboard version ..but we tryed to paint it in a nicer color, but we couldn't afford the required amount of paint so we had to cut some conors..
Besides, Sarevok hardly looked in a metal armor back in 1998.
But the old ones had a very poor resolution, so they had to be replaced.
Anyhow, regarding the cut line, I've been running this one over in my head a bit. Honestly, the scene works both ways and just depends on what you want. The new version actually leaves a bit more ambiguity about what's going on (as well as removing some complaints/questions about how this guy knew other people) by concealing his Bhaalspawn nature and the implication of there being more. The older version foreshadows a bit more.
Can someone actually explain why they dislike the new intro?
Of course.
What I like about it:
-That it starts with a book illustration we're sucked into.
-The style - I actually like the 'animated graphic novel' feel, it reminds me of Gabriel Knight 1 and Thief 1 & 2, which I deeply love.
-The art - it is very pretty
What I don't like:
- they cut the quote, which sets the tone for the game and is one of the most memorable characteristics of BG1
- they cut the line, which was one of the main points of the intro, as it worked as very subtle plot exposition - "there are others, I can show you, please!" Now we are left with only "you will go first", which is only half of the message, (it could easily mean that Sarevok was going to go on a killing spree through the city, killing at random. The 'there are others' clearly indicated that there are some specific targets out there).
- they butchered pacing and immersion. Everything happens too fast, there is no drama, it's just "The tower, the man, the other man, the murder, the blood, ON TO THE GAME!". To this day I feel for that poor guy from the original intro: beaten, hunted, swaying with exhaustion, running and then begging for his life, slowly choking, falling, bleeding. In the new one? Meh. Some guy gets thrown around, looks kinda sad, gets killed. There's nothing for me there to connect with him, and even he doesn't seem to care about his situation, so why should I?
- they cut Sarevok's 'badass' moments - first one when he bursts through the door, the second one where he breaks a freaking iron railing with the poor guy's body, just so he can dangle him over the street and drop him. It showed how insane and insanely strong he is. In the new one that message doesn't come across half as well.
The 'Meh' moments:
- the perfect round puddle of blood. Eh, ok. I get that they wanted it to become the Bhaal symbol. Looked somewhat strange, but I can live with it. (Even though I'd prefer if it formed the symbol by filling it, like it used to in one version)
All in all, it felt like it was aimed at the kind of audience who skips the cut-scene if it is longer than 60 seconds. I'm don' t like that.
This new intro looked a lot nicer, but I wasn't expecting AAA movies. I think it fit the budget.
All in all, the cut scenes (so far) just lack emotion. Sarevok doesn't feel like some monster chasing the other guy. And yet, the worst one, to me, has been the cut scene for The Friendly Arm Inn. The original one has the drawbridge open and draw you in to the safety of its walls, then look up to see the great inn towering over you. It was a bit a intimidating, but a welcome sight after fleeing from Gorion's murder. If anywhere can be called safe, it would be that place. Now... it's just pretty much a static image. Just.. no.
The original opening to Baldur's Gate is nowhere near the high level quality of the original Star Wars movies. Stop being pretentious and dramatic. Baldur's Gate never had a strength in cutscenes or graphics. No one talked about the sick graphics from that game. I remember being underwhelmed by the few cinematics that existed at release.
Some of the true classics of 3D cinematics from the 90's are the following games
Final Fantasy 7-9
Metal Gear Solid
Tekken 2-3
MGS and Tekken are outdated now in terms of visuals, but at the time, they were mindblowingly beautiful and memorable. They were definetly the talk amongst the gamers/nerds. FF 8 and 9's cutscenes still hold up today due to visual art direction. These are the true cinematic classics.
Still, do I like the new cinematics from BG EE? Well, I'm still underwhelmed so nothing has changed. I don't mind the motion pictures, but I definetly see ways the visuals could've been easily improved. However, Overhaul Games is a small studio, and this game has a low sale price which reflects their staff-power and how much they can do with their current limitations from contracts and budget. Not that it matters. The original cutscenes weren't any good to begin with, especially when compared to the games I just mentioned, though I'm sure there are many others I've left out.
At any rate, Beamdog definetly can't go back though. The original art source is gone. Forever. And the resolution on the old videos are poorly pixelated. I understand why they freed themselves from the tedious tradition when it wasn't practical anymore. There is a need for the new art direction as they can't go back. I understand that if new DLC is introduced, they may want to do some more cutscenes for the sake of pacing. It's very important to keep a consistent feel.
Besides, if you really want.. You can just mod the old videoes into the game, but do really you care that much? Do you really think the original awful 3D was what made BG 1 good? If so, I think you missed what made the game good. :P