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Damage type vs enemies

giosantigiosanti Member Posts: 20
edited August 2012 in Archive (General Discussion)
When choosing a weapon for a tank, I think a lot of players know which ones have the best THAC0 in the game, but does damage type matter?

The best 1-handed piercing weapon that you get relatively early is the Dagger of Venom +2. The best 1-handed crushing weapon that you get relatively early is the War Hammer +2. The best 1-handed slashing weapon that you get relatively early is the Long Sword +2, unless you count Drizzt's weapons.

So, does damage type matter? Do certain creatures have armor bonuses or damage resistances against damage types? I know that Mustard Jellies resist 100% of piercing damage. Skeletons seem to take very little damage from arrows. Are there any other instances of things like this?

These are the armor damage type resistances, according to the manual:
Piercing: +2 vs leather, -1 vs studded, 0 vs chain, -1 vs splint, 0 vs plate, -3 vs fullplate
Crushing: 0 vs leather, 0 vs studded, +2 vs chain, -2 vs splint, 0 vs plate, 0 vs fullplate
Slashing: 0 vs leather, -2 vs studded, -2 vs chain, 0 vs splint, -3 vs plate, -4 vs fullplate

Negative numbers mean that the weapon does worse against that armor type. Looking at these numbers, crushing damage looks like the best type, and slashing damage looks like the worst type.

So, does damage type matter?

Comments

  • CheesebellyCheesebelly Member Posts: 1,727
    edited August 2012
    Actually, there are two different things : Damage resistance and AC against weapon.

    For instance, if you have -8 AC against Missile weapons, arrows won't do 1 damage, they simply won't hit you. If you have 75% missile resistance, arrows can still hit you but they'll do 75% less damage.

    AC is basically how well you dodge (even if that makes little sense for full plate mail, true) while resistances are how much damage you shrink. Mustard jellies, as you said, have 100% resistance to missiles.

    Ultimately, for AC related problems, THAC0 *is* the solution. For resistance related problem, damage is :)

    Edit - also, having super negative AC is better for spellcasters, simply because they don't risk getting interrupted (while with damage resistance they still can get interrupted)
    For tanks, having great AC and damage resistance (through full plate mail, Armor of Faith and Hardiness HLA) makes them not only unhittable but also very highly unlikely to get 20+ damage.
  • Roller12Roller12 Member Posts: 437
    Crushing>slashing>piercing.

    Having high AC and high damage reduction is rather counterproductive because they negate each other. Blocking all the hits makes DR useless for example.

    The core of the problem is, there are very few to none enemies resistant to crushing damage, while there are hoards resistant to piercing. Slashing is in-between.
  • CheesebellyCheesebelly Member Posts: 1,727
    Interestingly enough though, in both games, some of the most damaging weapons are in fact Crushing weapons - Staff Mace +2 and Staff of the Ram +6
  • AnduineAnduine Member Posts: 416
    I know that there have been some misunderstandings when it comes to Armor Class and heavy armor. Armor Class does not necessarily add to "dodging", but rather making blows less likely to hit you and/or be effective against you.

    In the case of my favourite armor, Full Platemail, blows could simply glance off your armor, or perhaps you didn't hit in a "vulnerable" spot. A bit of explanation is sometimes needed in this regard, as it can be confusing when wondering why a Fighter in heavy armor with a shield has a higher AC than a high-Dexterity Rogue in studded leather.
  • giosantigiosanti Member Posts: 20
    Oh yeah I know that damage resistance and AC are different things. I had a hard time explaining myself in the first post.

    Basically, my parties contain as many archers as possible, with one tank, and enough mage, thief, and priest abilities spread across all party members. Anyway, that tank always gets a shield and a 1-handed weapon, while other characters get bows, or slings if that's not possible.

    So my question is about what weapon proficiency is best for that tank to take. It's between Large Swords, Blunts, and Small Swords (I use vanilla BG+TSC). If Large Swords is chosen, then the Long Sword +2 is the tank's weapon of choice for most of the game. If Blunts are chosen, then the War Hammer +2 is the tank's weapon of choice for most of the game, to be replaced by the Staff Mace +2 due to higher damage. If Small Swords is chosen, then the Dagger of Venom is the tank's weapon of choice for most of the game, to possibly be replaced by the Short Sword +3 at the end.

    I'd always considered the DOV > L.Sword+2 > Hammer+2, ordered by amount of damage dealt on average. The DOV is special because of the way damage is dealt. However, enemy damage resistances and AC against weapons would change that ranking. For example, if all enemies hypothetically had a 1 bonus to AC against crushing damage, the Hammer+2 would effectively be comparable to the Long Sword +1, and the Staff+3 would be comparable to the Staff Spear +2.
    Roller12 said:

    Crushing>slashing>piercing.

    The core of the problem is, there are very few to none enemies resistant to crushing damage, while there are hoards resistant to piercing. Slashing is in-between.

    This is what I'm talking about. So do you think Blunts is the best proficiency to take in my example?


    I've read about people using in-game editors to look at monsters' stats? Has anything been compiled about their AC against different damage types?
  • SchneidendSchneidend Member Posts: 3,190
    Anduine said:

    I know that there have been some misunderstandings when it comes to Armor Class and heavy armor. Armor Class does not necessarily add to "dodging", but rather making blows less likely to hit you and/or be effective against you.

    In the case of my favourite armor, Full Platemail, blows could simply glance off your armor, or perhaps you didn't hit in a "vulnerable" spot. A bit of explanation is sometimes needed in this regard, as it can be confusing when wondering why a Fighter in heavy armor with a shield has a higher AC than a high-Dexterity Rogue in studded leather.

    This. Heavily armored and/or shielded targets are not so much dodging as just not being hit solidly enough to deal any damage. A greatsword wielder in full plate can essentially use his forearms, elbows, and shoulders as though they were bucklers. Or, if you get past those defense, your blade might just slide harmlessly off their gorget instead of piercing the throat, or your arrow might shatter on the chestplate.

    See, Anduine? We agree on SOME stuff. :P
  • Roller12Roller12 Member Posts: 437
    giosanti said:


    This is what I'm talking about. So do you think Blunts is the best proficiency to take in my example?

    Base damage type is just one of the factors. You said it, dagger of venom grants venom damage. Some long swords grant 50% fire resistance, some bigger swords grant free action. Some hammers in bg2 grant 25 str. But all things being equal, yes i will go for blunt, too many undead in this game. For a tank i would go for slashing weapons because of Drizzt weapon with AC bonus, and give the dagger to the thief where it belongs to lol.
  • AnduineAnduine Member Posts: 416
    Schneidend said:

    Anduine said:

    I know that there have been some misunderstandings when it comes to Armor Class and heavy armor. Armor Class does not necessarily add to "dodging", but rather making blows less likely to hit you and/or be effective against you.

    In the case of my favourite armor, Full Platemail, blows could simply glance off your armor, or perhaps you didn't hit in a "vulnerable" spot. A bit of explanation is sometimes needed in this regard, as it can be confusing when wondering why a Fighter in heavy armor with a shield has a higher AC than a high-Dexterity Rogue in studded leather.

    This. Heavily armored and/or shielded targets are not so much dodging as just not being hit solidly enough to deal any damage. A greatsword wielder in full plate can essentially use his forearms, elbows, and shoulders as though they were bucklers. Or, if you get past those defense, your blade might just slide harmlessly off their gorget instead of piercing the throat, or your arrow might shatter on the chestplate.

    See, Anduine? We agree on SOME stuff. :P

    By Tyr! Excuse me a moment while I learn of the current temperature in Hell. (Haha)
  • beerflavourbeerflavour Member Posts: 117
    edited August 2012
    In general I try to focus a character on a single favourite weapon. But to not loose out too much I let them train to be at least proficient with other weapons as well. So to cover as many different weapon damage types. I let the characters switch weapons whenever appropriate. But in general I have them learn how to use a slashing or piercing melee weapon, a blunt melee weapon and some ranged weapon. So I can switch from ranged to melee and back and forth. Alsways how the situation dictates.
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