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Someone Fill Me In on the Drama That Has Been Happening on This Forum

I have had a very busy week and I have hardly been back here at all. I have been waiting patiently for SoD and was about to buy the game that has just come out, so I could sit back and relax after a stressful few days. However, upon Googling, it turns out the game has been getting some very negative publicity.....

Can someone tell me why all of this has been happening? I find the outrage from both sides absolutely baffling, but it has been enough to drag the game down already. I want some answers before I invest my money.

Please keep the discussion CIVIL. I'm sure all of you have many differences when it comes to social politics. That is irrelevant to this conversation. All I want to do is try and understand the mindset of the people causing this outrage. It's concerning to me.

Also, try and keep spoilers to a minimum.
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Comments

  • bradbrad Member Posts: 32
    It's all completely contrived. Somehow gamergate decided to pick SoD to use as a rallying cry to fabricate a "scandal" because of a line making fun of GG that Minsc says, a poorly written trans character, and some other completely made up crap.
  • megamike15megamike15 Member Posts: 2,666
    people also misinterpreted corwin's daughters line and thought it was a feminist thing when it was more. " my mom is awesome."
  • bradbrad Member Posts: 32
    Point is: there isn't anything that's deserving of this stupid banter flooding the Internet and choking out fun or meaningful discussion of the content.
  • IllustairIllustair Member Posts: 877
    edited April 2016
    Mostly boils down to 2 things -
    1. Minsc said 1 line "Really, it's all about ethics in heroic adventuring" that apparently insulted others
    2. A minor character that easily opens up that she's a trans.

    That the franchise is allegedly ruined because of the inclusion of political agenda. Everything else is just an offshoot of those two.

    Oh yeah, also a "she (referring to Corwin) can take care of herself" or something like that as a response from her daughter.
  • TStaelTStael Member Posts: 861

    people also misinterpreted corwin's daughters line and thought it was a feminist thing when it was more. " my mom is awesome."

    And even if it were feminist, what's the prob?

    I am myself a bit baffled. I had low expectations to protect myself from disappointment, but I am really happy with SoD.

    Pretending to hate it on flimsy grounds is hardly gaming solidarity in my opinion, but I doubt many will lend ear to the reactionary crowd, and just get on with gaming.

    Just getting Minsc back alone would be worth it, but this title really had my at first narration! (original narrator is back)

    When I heard voice of Irenicus I could hardly contain my mirth. I thought that was fantastic idea and great fan service, as he is such a great villain.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited April 2016
    The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • bradbrad Member Posts: 32
    Yeah.... I've gotta disagree about Beamdog sucking for this. So they made fun of people who deserve to be made fun of? Big deal.
  • FinnTheHumanFinnTheHuman Member Posts: 404
    Ratcliff said:

    There is a culture war going on in video games.

    Beamdog picked a side and fired shots.

    The other side is firing back.

    It's all a mess, and both sides suck.

    All I know is war is hell, man. All those posts. Man, I cant refresh without seeing "16 new". INCOMING
  • Diogenes42Diogenes42 Member Posts: 597
    JiveOne said:

    SoD includes a pointed wizards hat with great caster bonuses. This should convince you to purchase the game.

    My friend, truly you have uttered some words of great wisdom this day.
  • AlmateriaAlmateria Member Posts: 257
    Gamers are huge babies who cry whenever someone touches their toys
    That's it really
  • wraith5641wraith5641 Member Posts: 500
    I find it sad that the gaming industry has been reduced to this. It really is a pity. People wonder why the gaming industry has gone downhill in recent years. It's because of stuff like this, and opportunists using the popularity of the industry to promote their own agenda, with no regard for the artistry and creativity that goes into creating a universe. The people complaining about petty issues such as the ones perceived in this game aren't gamers at all. They're leeches. Provocateurs that had found a niche market goldmine in gamer controversies. There are a plethora of numb-headed gamers, so why wouldn't you exploit that to your own ends if you had absolutely no principles?

    The poor reporting on both sides from what I have seen so far has been astoundingly unprofessional. Does anyone care about the content of this game as a whole? Does anyone care that this is the first new game in the series for 15 years? Does anyone care about the effort and love put into this game by a team of avid Baldur's Gate fans? The answer is definitely yes. But we are having our voices drowned out by people that don't care about the series and are only using it as a platform for attention. That has to stop. I want to hear about the honest experiences of people who have played this game thoroughly and can build a constructive opinion on it. That's good for the series, it's good for Beamdog, and it's good for all of us as fans when can identify faults and constantly improve. That can't happen if we are squabbling over irrelevant nonsense.

    Whatever your opinion is on identity politics, keep it out of our beloved series. This game is a part of our lives, and none of us want to see it get dragged through the mud like this. On the same note, these forums are some of the friendliest and most helpful I've had the privilege of going to on the internet. Let's do our best to keep it that way, please.

    Onwards and upwards!
  • skeptik_59skeptik_59 Member Posts: 38
    edited April 2016
    My understanding of this;

    BD "bad" because they hurt the precious feelings of some sub-segment of a sub-segment of the segment of humans who game by appropriating the word "Ethics" that this sub-sub-sub-sub-segment purport to identify with to the point of "ownership". And Minsc said the line! As Col Kurtz would say, "The horror, the horror..."

    BD "bad" because they have a fleeting appearance by a token member of a minority group, present in the real world, also present in this fantasy world. Again, see Col Kurtz... ;)

    Taken together, these two realities have ruined the entire series for a tiny, thin-skinned slice of humanity who, among other things, buy games. Not that they will be missed, but alas, they are gone from the BG family. Unless they, uh, you know, just keep playing the other games in the series and NOT this added one.

    And... the universe continues to expand as it should... :)
  • bob_vengbob_veng Member Posts: 2,308
    Ratcliff said:

    There is a culture war going on in video games.

    Beamdog picked a side and fired shots.

    The other side is firing back.

    It's all a mess, and both sides suck.

    both sides suck?

    people who create, subject themselves to criticism all the time. they invest their talent and a big portion of their lives and they sometimes fall short.

    on the other hand people who consume, they don't put themselves on the line. they only invest the comparatively insignificant amount of money to buy the game, and they don't have to do it - they can not spend it or they can spend it on something else.

    ...while people who create have to create and keep doing it, because their livelihood depends on it. they are condemned to make mistakes. and they are also destined to create what their inherent one-of-a-kind creative vision, their set of skills and limited material resources allow. they can not transform into something or someone they're not, they cannot switch around like the consumers are able to.

    yet without their work, however imperfect as all human labor is, the consumers would have nothing to enjoy. they would have nothing to complain, platform and campaign about either. often they forget that.

    you see, their (the consumers') suckage is not legitimized or normalized by anything. they're free from the creator's plight: they just enjoy something more or less, but no one will criticize them for it. they're free to behave perfectly correctly and fairly. why should their bad behavior be equated with the creators' alleged failings? there's no equivalency there. they can't possibly both suck on the same plane of what it means to suck.
  • minsc4prezminsc4prez Member Posts: 105
    bob_veng said:

    Ratcliff said:

    There is a culture war going on in video games.

    Beamdog picked a side and fired shots.

    The other side is firing back.

    It's all a mess, and both sides suck.

    both sides suck?



    I think he may have been referring to to the Tumblr SJW's and the GGer's, if so then yes they both suck and this whole controversy is beyond stupid and putting a dumb joke or reference to it in the game was a bad idea
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  • HalfwiseHalfwise Member Posts: 78
    Linking a blog post by Brad Glasgow which goes into the review bombers interpretation:

    "Beamdog, let me show you the way out of this controversy."
  • bob_vengbob_veng Member Posts: 2,308
    being so heavily into relativisation and false equivalences must feel like some godly cognitive nirvana.
  • HalfwiseHalfwise Member Posts: 78
    bob_veng said:

    being so heavily into relativisation and false equivalences must feel like some godly cognitive nirvana.

    Things tend to get jumbled on the forums. Can you quote what you are referring to?
  • CurmudgeonCurmudgeon Member Posts: 57
    In essence Beamdog made the egregious error of not including a "trigger warning" for those who believe that their "safe space" was violated by a few innocuous lines of dialogue that seem to have astonishing political significance. The whole tempest of rage is particularly mind-numbing because their opponents are regularly pilloried for indulging in a fatuous addiction to "playing the victim".
  • booinyoureyesbooinyoureyes Member Posts: 6,164
    Oh, wow, one more thread about this topic

    image
  • OsigoldOsigold Member Posts: 117
    Let's not forget the interview in which one of the writers said, amongst other things, that she doesn't care if her writing feels fake or forced. It did.
  • KilivitzKilivitz Member Posts: 1,459
    edited April 2016
    Ratcliff said:

    There is a culture war going on in video games.

    There is a culture war going on in video games in the head of a few very immature individuals who like bullying people online for whatever sense of importance/belonging/satisfaction they can get from that.

    SoD includes a few pseudo-controversial characters and lines - controversial in the sense that in modern pop culture, every attempt at being more inclusive will suffer some form of backlash from a reactionary sect of the audience who doesn't want to be bothered with a shift in the cultural zeitgeist since they benefit from the status quo and human beings can be really entitled/self-centered/selfish sometimes.

    The collateral effect, as many people have already pointed out, was a deliberate effort to sabotage SoD by bombing reviews. Some of those brave soldiers have also decided to tell it like it is in these very boards, much to the irritation of people like me.

    If you're reading this, I apologize if my outbursts have annoyed people or if they contribute to the noise which is preventing other members from having fun discussing the game.

    I am just really, really, really annoyed at what I perceive as an invasion of the boards for which I hold lots of regard. My lizard brain got very defensive and while I'm usually all for debate and dialogue, I feel as if the line had to be drawn somewhere. And in my particular case, this insidious quasi-hate group bringing their hateful rhetoric to an otherwise healthy community is where I draw that line.
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  • skeptik_59skeptik_59 Member Posts: 38
    Osigold said:

    Let's not forget the interview in which one of the writers said, amongst other things, that she doesn't care if her writing feels fake or forced. It did.

    Isn't that her prerogative, as a writer? And isn't it BD's prerogative to employ such a writer if they so choose. Perhaps BD didn't think it felt forced, or perhaps more likely, didn't mind if it did... I mean someone had publishing control over the content submitted - if they didn't want to include content X, Y or Z, they wouldn't have...

    I mean, "[l]et's not forget" that BD hired her and continues to employ her. In the grand scope of things, that seems more relevant than the hurt feelings of some tiny proportion of people who play games....
  • HalfwiseHalfwise Member Posts: 78
    edited April 2016
    Kilivitz said:

    Ratcliff said:

    There is a culture war going on in video games.

    SoD includes a few pseudo-controversial characters and lines - controversial in the sense that in modern pop culture, every attempt at being more inclusive will suffer some form of backlash from a reactionary sect of the audience who doesn't want to be bothered with a shift in the cultural zeitgeist since they benefit from the status quo and human beings can be really entitled/self-centered/selfish sometimes.
    The reaction is not unlike the reaction to:
    -Bayonetta
    -DOA3
    -Hatred
    -Postal 1/2
    -Mass Effect
    -Manhunt
    -The DaVinci Code
    -Harry Potter
    -Dungeons and Dragons (It's devil worship, dont'cha know?)
    -...and many others.

    It's just that recently the idea of crowd-sourcing anger has become popular. But it is certainly not limited to a singular audience or political leaning.

    You drop the right catalyst into the right substrate, and away it goes.
  • OsigoldOsigold Member Posts: 117
    edited April 2016

    Osigold said:

    Let's not forget the interview in which one of the writers said, amongst other things, that she doesn't care if her writing feels fake or forced. It did.

    Isn't that her prerogative, as a writer? And isn't it BD's prerogative to employ such a writer if they so choose. Perhaps BD didn't think it felt forced, or perhaps more likely, didn't mind if it did... I mean someone had publishing control over the content submitted - if they didn't want to include content X, Y or Z, they wouldn't have...

    I mean, "[l]et's not forget" that BD hired her and continues to employ her. In the grand scope of things, that seems more relevant than the hurt feelings of some tiny proportion of people who play games....
    Yeah, she can do what she likes and I hope she has a long and happy career at Beamdog with the rest of the team that give the go ahead and probably feels the same way.

    The point is that it was a controversial thing to say. It's an open admission that the quality of her writing comes second to her politics. That interview is one of the reasons why there has been "drama", as some people put it. I prefer to think of it as friendly discussion.
This discussion has been closed.