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A question about Imoen's dual classing

Hello everyone.

I'm starting another run of the entire Baldur's gate saga and I really wanna play this one with maximum immersion and as much realism as I can. So I have a question for anyone who might've finished SOD by now (and no spoilers please):

I plan to dual class Imoen at 6 into a mage. My character would do that because it just makes sense to me, regardless of whether or not Imoen is a mage in Baldur's gate II. So I wanted to know how is her dualing explained in Siege of Dragonspear if I had already done it in Baldur's gate I? Does it make sense? I do hope it makes sense, because it would suck a bit if she only decided to become a mage after she leaves my party in SoD.

Thanks!

Comments

  • minsc4prezminsc4prez Member Posts: 105
    edited April 2016

    If you are hoping to play with Imoen or consistancy with bg1 in this game, youre going to have a bad time.
  • InconnuInconnu Member Posts: 99
    Iglosnof said:

    Hello everyone.

    I'm starting another run of the entire Baldur's gate saga and I really wanna play this one with maximum immersion and as much realism as I can. So I have a question for anyone who might've finished SOD by now (and no spoilers please):

    I plan to dual class Imoen at 6 into a mage. My character would do that because it just makes sense to me, regardless of whether or not Imoen is a mage in Baldur's gate II. So I wanted to know how is her dualing explained in Siege of Dragonspear if I had already done it in Baldur's gate I? Does it make sense? I do hope it makes sense, because it would suck a bit if she only decided to become a mage after she leaves my party in SoD.

    Thanks!

    Dragonspear does it for you, but my advice is to keep her as a thief in BG1 if you plan on using her at all. Click the spoiler below if you want to know a somewhat major caveat about her involvement that is revealed early in the expansion.


    You don't get to use her in your party.
  • IglosnofIglosnof Member Posts: 119
    Thanks for the info, that actually gives me a very interesting gameplay idea :)
  • IllydthIllydth Member, Developer Posts: 1,641
    edited April 2016
    @Iglosnof

    I'm going to spoiler this because I don't know how much you do or don't know about the original BG game. If you've read any guides for BG (not SoD) or played BG at all before you'll probably know most of this already. There are no story spoilers here.


    At a 17 intelligence and with as semi-useless as Thieves are in Baldur's Gate on their own the VAST MAJORITY of the player community a LONG TIME AGO decided that dual classing Imoen into a mage was the right thing to do.

    Lets touch on both points I made:

    Generally, a single class thief in AD&D Serves as a scout a trapfinder and an assassin. Unfortunately being a CRPG many of those roles simply either aren't needed or don't fit. Having a scout in a game who's contents don't change is somewhat useless and most battles in BG:EE and up are Multi-target, meaning you COULD sneak your Leather Armor clad thief into combat and try to KO one actor, but then you're going to be faced with the agro of all the others in that combat (with a really bad AC and not so good HP) till someone else can pull it all off you. With nothing like an "aoe taunt", your thief tends to have a hard time backstabbing and still coming out alive, especially in larger combats. Combine that with most Mage's AI in all games which tend to almost immediately buff themselves once combat starts (meaning a surprise backstab AFTER combat initiating is practically impossible), and the single class thief struggles to find it's place in BG Games.

    That tends to leave thieves as Trap Finders and Chest Openers, of which you ABSOLUTELY need one in the party...but why suck up one of the precious 6 slots with someone who's job really ends up being a poor man's archer.

    Most players needing a thief in their party do one of two things: Create a Multi-Class Thief (usually Wa/Th or Wa/Th/Mu) or use Imoen...

    And along comes Imoen who, with her 17 Int and Human Race almost becomes a Multi-class character by design. Don't believe me? Even Bioware agreed since they dual classed her in BG2.


    And here we delve into just the slightest bit of SoD Story and how the story treats Imoen.


    To back into your question, then, SoD Explains Imoen's Dual Classing by introducing her as working on her Magical skills. After the intro part of the prolog, we find out that she is being tutored by Grand Duke Jannath, and decided to follow her magical ways because of your shared foster father, Gorion.

    Given Imoen's sentimentality in most cases for Gorion throughout BG and even some of her Dialogs in SoD, it's no stretch that Imoen chooses to pursue her career as a mage...and it's no stretch at all that, given the connections you make with the Grand Dukes at the end of the original BG, that Jannath would take Imoen under wing as an apprentice.

    IMO, this is one of the things that SoD both needed to do and executed superbly in it's writing. It's just one more loose end between BG and BG2 that SoD Ties up with a neat bow.
    minsc4prez
  • minsc4prezminsc4prez Member Posts: 105
    Well that was insightful @Illydth, if only they could explaine why Minsc isnt a berserker/barbarian and why they chose to make Xan a mage instead of a Fighter
  • IllydthIllydth Member, Developer Posts: 1,641
    @minsc4prez

    I can answer at least something of both of those questions:

    Base AD&D Second Edition, from the Second Edition PHB/DMG did not have the Barbarian as a class. That was added in 3rd Edition, not second. As a matter of fact, (fun fact!) the word "Barbarian" only appears in the Second Edition PHB a single time...under a section on fighter followers.

    Historically, I forget if Barbarian was added to BG2 or if it was Beamdog's release of BG:EE that brought in the Barbarian Kit for Fighters, but it was not there in BG1 to make Minsc into.

    Further, Minsc was intended to be able to fulfill the role of Ranged Support (read Archer) in case CHARNAME was not a ranged focused character. As such, he was pretty much a Jack of all trades, he could go Two Handed Sword and Bow, he could go Dual Wield (being a ranger), he could go heavy armor and Tank or lighter armor and ranged.

    Regarding Xan: If I remember correctly (and I think I do) Lore wise in AD&D his weapon is only usable by elves and I BELIEVE Only usable by an arcane spellcaster. Xan would have fit the multi-class wa/mu PERFECTLY except that would have been considered overpowered given what that blade can do.

    Xan was written as a mage by bioware all the way back in Vanilla, not much Beamdog could have done to change it. :)
  • minsc4prezminsc4prez Member Posts: 105
    edited April 2016
    @Illydth
    It's been a long while since ive played vanilla Bg1 but i seem to remember Barb being an available option,
    Edit: no, youre rigt there was no Barb in vanilla Bg1


    The reason i ask about xan, was i remember someone inquireing about his sword a while back and was told it was a throwback to ab older aplha/beta build of the game where he was originally a fighter
  • IllydthIllydth Member, Developer Posts: 1,641
    No idea on Xan, but I checked on the history for the Minsc question.

    The original BG did not have much in the way of classes outside of the ones in the base AD&D 2E PHB (Players Handbook). There were almost no class kits, and even some of the classes (such as the monk class) didn't exist in BG1.

    BG2, then, brought in a BOATLOAD of new classes when it released. Between the time BG1 and BG2 were written, TSR (At the time, before it was WotC) released a bunch of new source material for AD&D 2E which included things like the Fighters Handbook and the Wizard's Handbook, and the Monk Handbook. All of these created/laid out new classes and new class kits and options for the base classes.

    Bioware picked up much of that work from 2E and built it into their second release of the game...what we know as BG2.

    Unfortunately, that meant if you wanted to play the game with one of the new classes or kits, you couldn't use your same protagonist from BG. I, myself, was in that boat...having played my first ever playthrough of BG with a NG Ranger/Archer and switching over to Monk when the class became available in BG2.

    Enter Beamdog and the Enhanced Editions. One of the biggest things (yes, I realize there were several Mods that did this out in the community prior to Beamdog) they did was to synchronize the classes between BG1 and BG2. With the EE's you could play your Barbarian or Monk through both games.
  • Diogenes42Diogenes42 Member Posts: 597
    Hello friends. Barbarian was not added until Shadows of Amn, thank you for your time. Also Minsc had to be a ranger, otherwise how would he have his animal companion Boo?
  • AzzaraAzzara Member Posts: 184
    I thought Boo was the Ranger and Minsc the companion. You can't be a ranger with WIS 6.
    BTW, they talked about the origin and development of Minsc and Boo here:
    http://thefamiliar.beamdog.com/5.0/#!/article/105661/101336255?loadFresh=true&title=02_12_Six Siders and Space Hamsters
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