Fighter/Mage build and party tips in SCS/Ascension
Jimjimathy
Member Posts: 3
Hi all, I've been wanting to do a multi-class Fighter/Mage run for a while now, but keep coming back to the same problems/uncertainties regarding the build. This will be my first time playing with the SCS mod and also with Ascension, so I'm expecting to do some power gaming, but also want to retain some roleplaying fun. I want to use the 'canon' party in BG1 - Imoen (non-dual), Jaheira, Khalid, Minsc and Dynaheir, and what I regard as the 'canon' party in BG2 - Yoshimo/Imoen, Jaheira (romance), Minsc, and Aerie, and then keeping the final slot rotating for various NPC sub-quests, before finally filling it with Mr. ToB. Has anyone played through the saga with these parties using SCS and Ascension, and how did you find the experience? Will I miss a cleric's Command, Hold Person and Animate Dead spells in BG1? How does Dynaheir's lack of Confusion, Chaos, Emotion, and Greater Malison fare against the beefed-up enemies? Will having three multi-classes in the BG2 party affect the difficulty of many encounters with regards to slower levelling? Aerie in particular is a character/class combo I have always liked but never really learned how to use properly. I'm aware of her huge potential later on, but does she cut the mustard in SCS/Ascension, or will she be spending most of the game greyed out on the sidebar?
Also, Mr. PC himself. I'm torn between two possible builds for him. I know I want to be dual-wielding in BG2, I really like the idea of being a self-buffing melee fighter, making myself invulnerable with spells and charging in; however, I just can't decide on the best route to get him there. I'm concerned that early game the protective spells aren't enough to keep him alive in melee for too long and he will die a lot, so my initial idea was to give him Long Sword and Longbow proficiencies at the start, and use him as a kind of 'utility warrior' in combat in early BG1- mainly firing his bow and casting Sleep, and if needs be putting Armour/Shield up and charging into melee. As he levelled I was going to put his level 3 and 6 proficiencies into Two Weapon Style, and have him start dual-wielding towards the end of BG1 once he gets spells like Ghost Armour, Stoneskin, and when Mirror Image produces enough duplicates to be useful. In BG2 he'll put a third point in TWS, and then the rest of his points into Flail for the FoA (and will then dual-wield that and long swords of various flavours). This build has the advantage of keeping him useful throughout the whole saga, and also has a nice 'roleplay' feel to it - he learns bow and sword in Candlekeep, but as he starts to adventure discovers he has a preference for two-weapon fighting; later, once he becomes Lord of the Keep, he starts practising with the Lord's weapon, the Flail of Ages.
My worries with this build are that, firstly, I find using bows all the time a bit boring in combat (only for the PC though, I have no issue with Kivan or Coran doing it); I much prefer smacking things in melee. Also, as a multi-class I won't speed through the proficiency pips - it's going to take a long time to level up, and once I start dual-wielding I probably won't use the bow again (or very rarely) so those pips are essentially wasted in BG2.
The second build is quite simply, forget about the bow, and dual-wield from the beginning. This is obviously much simpler, doesn't faff about, and gets me where I want to be much faster - two pips in Longswords, two in TWS, level 3 maxes out TWS, and then level 6 starts building up Flails. If I want to play it as a self-buffing melee fighter, why not play it that way from the off? Here of course my concerns are similar to those I mentioned above - lacking protective spells early on, I will die a lot, or spend a lot of time kiting or hanging back whilst Khalid, Minsc and Jaheira do all the fighting since they have armour and shields, or in Minsc's case, a really big sword. Also, it feels more 'powergamey' and not very roleplay - it doesn't make much sense to me that you would start off knowing how to fight with two weapons.
Apologies for the length of my ramblings - I've been going back and forth between the two builds for ages now. Dual-wielding from the beginning seems more fun, but I really like the character development idea of the 'roleplay' build. What are people's thoughts on either of these builds, particularly in BG1 using SCS? Is it better to be more cautious and use the bow and be a supporting character at the start, or just shout "Screw it!" and charge straight in? Also, are there any general tips/tricks you can offer on using the Fighter/Mage with the canon party in either game with SCS and Ascension (no need to worry about spoilers, I know what goes on)? Do I need to power game a lot to get through it, or can I afford to take a more roleplay-based approach without having to suffer too many reloads?
Thanks in advance!
Also, Mr. PC himself. I'm torn between two possible builds for him. I know I want to be dual-wielding in BG2, I really like the idea of being a self-buffing melee fighter, making myself invulnerable with spells and charging in; however, I just can't decide on the best route to get him there. I'm concerned that early game the protective spells aren't enough to keep him alive in melee for too long and he will die a lot, so my initial idea was to give him Long Sword and Longbow proficiencies at the start, and use him as a kind of 'utility warrior' in combat in early BG1- mainly firing his bow and casting Sleep, and if needs be putting Armour/Shield up and charging into melee. As he levelled I was going to put his level 3 and 6 proficiencies into Two Weapon Style, and have him start dual-wielding towards the end of BG1 once he gets spells like Ghost Armour, Stoneskin, and when Mirror Image produces enough duplicates to be useful. In BG2 he'll put a third point in TWS, and then the rest of his points into Flail for the FoA (and will then dual-wield that and long swords of various flavours). This build has the advantage of keeping him useful throughout the whole saga, and also has a nice 'roleplay' feel to it - he learns bow and sword in Candlekeep, but as he starts to adventure discovers he has a preference for two-weapon fighting; later, once he becomes Lord of the Keep, he starts practising with the Lord's weapon, the Flail of Ages.
My worries with this build are that, firstly, I find using bows all the time a bit boring in combat (only for the PC though, I have no issue with Kivan or Coran doing it); I much prefer smacking things in melee. Also, as a multi-class I won't speed through the proficiency pips - it's going to take a long time to level up, and once I start dual-wielding I probably won't use the bow again (or very rarely) so those pips are essentially wasted in BG2.
The second build is quite simply, forget about the bow, and dual-wield from the beginning. This is obviously much simpler, doesn't faff about, and gets me where I want to be much faster - two pips in Longswords, two in TWS, level 3 maxes out TWS, and then level 6 starts building up Flails. If I want to play it as a self-buffing melee fighter, why not play it that way from the off? Here of course my concerns are similar to those I mentioned above - lacking protective spells early on, I will die a lot, or spend a lot of time kiting or hanging back whilst Khalid, Minsc and Jaheira do all the fighting since they have armour and shields, or in Minsc's case, a really big sword. Also, it feels more 'powergamey' and not very roleplay - it doesn't make much sense to me that you would start off knowing how to fight with two weapons.
Apologies for the length of my ramblings - I've been going back and forth between the two builds for ages now. Dual-wielding from the beginning seems more fun, but I really like the character development idea of the 'roleplay' build. What are people's thoughts on either of these builds, particularly in BG1 using SCS? Is it better to be more cautious and use the bow and be a supporting character at the start, or just shout "Screw it!" and charge straight in? Also, are there any general tips/tricks you can offer on using the Fighter/Mage with the canon party in either game with SCS and Ascension (no need to worry about spoilers, I know what goes on)? Do I need to power game a lot to get through it, or can I afford to take a more roleplay-based approach without having to suffer too many reloads?
Thanks in advance!
2
Comments
Your party will be very powerful eventually. Most of the early BG1 enemies Sleep can take care of, so (ab)use that. I also prefer playing my PC as a melee fighter of sorts. F/m gains access to Mirror Image quite quickly, so there's your defence; add Shield as well. Extra familiar HP help a lot, since you'll be starting with 20 or so HP. Later on you can use Spirit Armor with AC1 and long duration. Boots of Avoidance + Girdle of Piercing are both early items and combined make you virtually missile-immune. You won't miss much cleric spells in BG1, if any. You get wands to summon monsters so while skellies are great they really aren't needed. Web is 10 times as good disable as a Hold Person.
Dynaheir's lack of Enchantment is bad, there's no going around it but your PC can cast Enchantments (in Sorcerous Sundries you'll find a *lot* of Chaos scrolls, which is the uber disable of BG1). You can also use Slow; with it's -4 penalty it's a tough spell to resist (mages usually use Globes so Chaos is infinetely better vs them).
Aerie in ToB is nigh invulnerable, so she'll do fine.
For your build, I'd go with dual wielding, put pips in bows at level 3, 6, at 9th and 12th flail, 15th 3rd in dual-wield. Simply because it's irrelevant what your THAC0 is if you're attacking sleeping/immobile targets (and you should spam Sleep since it's incredibly powerful in early BG1 - Ankhegs, Droth, Gibberlings, randomly spawned punks - all can be affected by that, and it has a huge aoe).
One thing that I'd dislike with party like this it that you'll need to micro and buff a lot, which gets tedious work. While Aerie is so powerful, she needs a lot of protection. Same applies to your PC, Minsc is nothing but a sub-par overrated fighter anyhow, and throughout the game you'll suffer from poor saves. Oh, and I'd actually start with pips in flails. Long swords have flavour but have zero late game potential.
Blunt weapon rule in this game - armored enemies usually gain bonuses vs slashing (plate, chain, full plate) while very few have bonus AC vs blunt; making elves' sword THAC0 bonus utterly moot compared to blunt power. And frankly, all long-swords' bonuses combined are nowhere close to Ages, so...if u want a long sword, wait for level 9 Black Blade of Disaster, the only long sword worth your while (convinently enough, using it gives you long sword grandmastery as well, making all weapon pips into this proficency wasted).