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Who is behind the troll invasion of d'arnise keep?

Who is the mysterious mastermind who ordered Torgall?

Was it Isaea Roenall, to take over the keep?
Was it Irenicus?
Was it Nalia, because she was bored and longed for adventure?
Was it evil Bert?


ThacoBellZaghoulQuartz

Comments

  • ChroniclerChronicler Member Posts: 504
    Was it an invasion?

    Always thought it was more of an infestation.

    Like when your keep has a rat problem you don't ask who the ringleader is.

  • UnderstandMouseMagicUnderstandMouseMagic Member Posts: 2,118

    I don't think it has ever been established.
    Lots of theories though.

    Obvious choice is Roenall.

    But I read a theory that it was Illithids and linked to their base in the sewers (the one you get the key for from Tazok). Which would fit with Torgal calling the leader "stronger", coming from underground, and he's refusal to tell you who as he's mind controlled.

    There's a huge and fascinating story to be told linking all this together.
    You could dispense with Irenicus almost altogether and have BG2 the story of charname saving Athkatla/Faerun from a takeover bid by the mind flayers.

    ThacoBellRaduzielborntodieZaghoul
  • ArchGhostArchGhost Member Posts: 23
    yeah he invaded. Torgal mentions somebody in charge and how he doesn't care about something, he's gonna kill you anyway. Working for somebody.

    ThacoBell
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 7,634
    With what little we know about pre-release info, it looks like the intention was either Isae Roenall, or the Mindflayers in the sewers. I lean a little more towards Isaea, as he is closely intertwined with the Keep storyline and the Mindflayers are already involved in 99% of the other cut content in the game.

    StummvonBordwehr
  • megamike15megamike15 Member Posts: 1,175
    doesnt the nalia romance mod go with the Isaea Roenall answer?

    Raduziel
  • jsavingjsaving Member Posts: 322
    Yes it does.

    Unfortunately the devs have forgotten who the "real" culprit was supposed to be and there isn't enough information in the vanilla game to know for sure. Alhoon, the Twisted Rune, and Jon Irenicus have all been mentioned over the years as possibly being behind the invasion, either because they wanted the Flail of the Ages or in exchange for partial ownership of Isaea's under-the-table endeavors in Athkatla. Or it could be Isaea alone, though it then becomes unclear how he managed to recruit the invaders in the first place and why he didn't recruit more during the "stronghold quest".

  • ANOFANOF Member Posts: 41
    edited August 4
    The only logical answer based on the available information is that Isaea was behind the invasion. It fits with Nalia's abduction storyline, and plays into Isaea's obsession with Nalia.

    ThacoBell
  • jsavingjsaving Member Posts: 322
    The one thing we do know is that Tor'gal respects, or is dominated by, the power of the culprit who he refers to as "Stronger". That sounds like a mind flayer to me, especially since we already know Alhoon is trying to assemble other artifacts
    (like the Hammer of Thunderbolts)
    and hence would likely have an interest in the Flail of the Ages. He would likely also be interested in a steady supply of thralls which Isaea would be in a position to provide, laying the groundwork for a bargain between the two of them.

    Raduziel
  • ANOFANOF Member Posts: 41
    edited August 4
    If it's Mind Flayers, why didn't they simply use their powers on Nalia's father or Nalia herself? Or anyone else in Nalia's family? Why go through with an elaborate plot that requires charming a troll, the Yuan-ti, and possibly others?

    ThacoBell
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 7,634
    A high ranking noble with military authority would satisfy the requirement of "stronger" to me.

  • borntodieborntodie Member Posts: 126
    Just did this quest again, the conversation was:

    *sniff* *sniff* *sniff* *sniiiff* I smell you! I do... you gradunk no be hiding from Torgal!

    Stand forth and be judged creature, your reign of terror ends here!

    I rain 'cross many places. What think you gradunk leave here dry? I Torgal, and I trgank lead Rocksmash pack. We serve Stronger, so who traag you to say no?!

    Come now, who could be stronger than you? Who would dare give orders to you?

    He no tell us. Stronger pay in meat and land! Torgal follow what good! You should have follow gold like other grrthed guards! Now you die!


    The bit about guards having been bribed with gold is interesting. Does not sound like something a mind flayer would do. Jon Irenicus lacks a motive. Nalia has a very good motive, as she longs for adventure and was desperate to escape her marriage.. but she wouldn't pay with 'meat and land'. Isaea wanted Nalia and the keep, so why come up with a scheme that ruins the keep and risks killing Nalia? He would have hired an assassin to kill her father instead.

    So that only leaves one suspect.


    Boreksarevok57
  • DhariusDharius Member Posts: 217
    edited August 5
    Well it could be Bert, or perhaps it was the Rakshasa, wanting their flail back...but not bothered to take it back themselves.

    I think Isaea is the most likely suspect though, he's just not man enough to admit it.

  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 3,884
    i actually think it's Isaea's father who ordered the whole ordeal because if you play out the fighter stronghold long enough:

    isaea's father will actually threaten you to take the keep back and if you tell him to go pound sand, he will actually fight you for the keep, isaea never does this

    and if you tell nalia that you dont want the keep, or arent a fighter class, you can go back to the official keep entrance and the isaea's father will be chilling outside saying this place isn't for your kind anymore

    ThacoBell
  • Jaheiras_WitnessJaheiras_Witness Member Posts: 451
    I always thought it was clear that the Roenalls were behind the invasion.

    Isaea doesn’t care about Nalia, his interest is in the title, keep and land. Marriage to Nalia is his way to gain title. With no other de’Arnise heirs, once Isaea and Nalia are married the title passes to the Roenalls, either through Isaea and Nalia’s offspring or to Isaea directly if Nalia suffers an unfortunate “accident” after marriage.

    In game Isaea and Nalia are betrothed but not yet married. There is still time for Nalia (or Lord de’Arnise) to break the betrothal if a better offer comes along. It is also clear that Nalia doesn’t fancy the thought of marrying Isaea and is only going along through respect for her father. Finally Nalia has some fairly unusual (by noble standards) ideas about wealth and class, so she could do something stupid like carve up the lands, give away money or disband the title.

    So the Roenalls decide to force the issue by bribing Torgal’s tribe to invade the keep. One way or another they expect to arrive on the scene as the noble saviours. If Nalia or Lord de’Arnise survive the invasion, the Roenalls expect they will reach out to them for help. If the de’Arnise family all perish, the Roenalls can drive away the trolls, take over by force of arms and possibly use the betrothal of Isaea and Nalia as justification for legitimacy (it was Lord de’Arnise’s last wish to join the de’Arnise and Roenall families through marriage).

    That might all be my headcanon but it’s always the way I interpreted it and no other explanation makes as much sense!

    BorekThacoBellsarevok57Raduziel
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