@Ruckus3 That's true, it is a bit ridiculous, especially the latest iPad that came 6 months after iPad 3, which I bought and damn I was pissed when I heard it was already a generation behind...
But XBox 360 and PS3 is still very powerful, even after all this time, whereas the original iPad was handicapped from the start and is unsupported by a huge host of games and apps already. It just can't compare with later generations.
I've also got an iPad 2, and as far as I can see, it can do everything my iPad 3 can do, so it's going to last a whole lot longer in regards to app and game support I think.
But I absolutely agree with you in principle. It's just that the iPad 1 is a special case, as it was the first of its kind, and seriously flawed because of the low amount of RAM. As I stated before, I'm amazed at how many people apparently have one still.
I have an ipad1. I won it as a door prize at my company Christmas party 3 years ago. It's nice as a webbrowser and ebook reader, but I'd never fork over $500 for one of these things (I mean a new iPad in general). That just aren't that useful and really not worth the money. The only reason I have this one is because it was free.
I've been watching the forums and waiting for the iPad version to get released. Although I'm a bit disappointed to see the original iPad isn't supported, It's not a big deal for me. I still have mt original BG install disks and it runs fine on Win7 (along with BG2, and IWD1& 2). The iPad version was just going to be a novelty purchase for me.
I have an ipad1. I won it as a door prize at my company Christmas party 3 years ago. It's nice as a webbrowser and ebook reader, but I'd never fork over $500 for one of these things (I mean a new iPad in general). That just aren't that useful and really not worth the money. The only reason I have this one is because it was free.
I've been watching the forums and waiting for the iPad version to get released. Although I'm a bit disappointed to see the original iPad isn't supported, It's not a big deal for me. I still have mt original BG install disks and it runs fine on Win7 (along with BG2, and IWD1& 2). The iPad version was just going to be a novelty purchase for me.
-Skeld
If I'd only ever used an iPad 1 I would agree with you, but it's a whole other ball game with the later iPads. I hardly ever use my PC for anything at all anymore, mostly it's used as a music and movie media center...
I use mine to make music on, with real instruments as well as digital.
Reading and posting on forums, using mine for writing this.
Reading books on it.
Surf the web, stream music, listen to radio streaming to my speakers in my living room.
Watching BBC, Eurosport, Netflix and other steaming services.
A whole host of other stuff.
That's besides playing BG and other games of course.
Even if I need to write longer texts, I use a Bluetooth keyboard and Pages and save to my Dropbox account.
There's some things a dedicated computer is better at, but there's so many things one can do on the iPad, sprawling on the couch.. :-)
In fact, think it was an asshole move on Apple's part to put that little RAM in the iPad 1, I had trouble just surfing the web because it just didn't have the memory to keep more than one, sometimes (if I was lucky) two pages open at a time.
Well, I don't know if I'll attribute it to malice, but it was clearly a mistake. If you needed any confirmation that releasing the iPad with so little RAM was a mistake, just look at the fact that the iPhone 3Gs can run iOS6, even though it was released a year before the iPad.
In fact, think it was an asshole move on Apple's part to put that little RAM in the iPad 1, I had trouble just surfing the web because it just didn't have the memory to keep more than one, sometimes (if I was lucky) two pages open at a time.
Well, I don't know if I'll attribute it to malice, but it was clearly a mistake. If you needed any confirmation that releasing the iPad with so little RAM was a mistake, just look at the fact that the iPhone 3Gs can run iOS6, even though it was released a year before the iPad.
Yeah, what I meant to say, is that Apple knew without a doubt that it needed more RAM from the start, and it was of course one of the big selling points on the iPad 2... It's a devious way of forcing people to upgrade their device, and a device that wasn't exactly cheap.
@Ruckus3 That's true, it is a bit ridiculous, especially the latest iPad that came 6 months after iPad 3, which I bought and damn I was pissed when I heard it was already a generation behind...
But XBox 360 and PS3 is still very powerful, even after all this time, whereas the original iPad was handicapped from the start and is unsupported by a huge host of games and apps already. It just can't compare with later generations.
I've also got an iPad 2, and as far as I can see, it can do everything my iPad 3 can do, so it's going to last a whole lot longer in regards to app and game support I think.
But I absolutely agree with you in principle. It's just that the iPad 1 is a special case, as it was the first of its kind, and seriously flawed because of the low amount of RAM. As I stated before, I'm amazed at how many people apparently have one still.
Well, if I'd known that at the time I probably wouldn't have bought it, but when my friend comes over and is like "Check this crazy shit out!" I was pretty much blown away, especially for $350. Either way, that's what I'm working with, and with my son and everything I don't see myself getting anything newer for a little while.
Yeah, but four generations of apple is 1/4 of a generation for Xbox, or playstation. 4 every two years or one every 10?
Apples and oranges. Consoles are sold at low margins or at losses early on. Hardware manufacturers need the consoles to be viable long term to turn a profit. Apple goes for high margin, and will only include as much hardware as margins allow. Tablets are also mobile devices, so computing power is constrained by battery life. Keep in mind that Apple also did not know the level of risk or the use cases where the iPad would succeed. An Apple has never been a leader in computing power.
If you want a tablet that has the power to last many generations, get an Intel based Windows 8 tablet. But you will be stuck with 4 hours of battery life.
It is admirable that the team is trying to get a first gen iPad build out the door, considering how many developers have abandoned the platform. As a first and second gen iPhone owner, I can attest to a history of Apple mobile devices being phased out quite quickly.
Few honest words. I was dissapointed by lack of iPad 1 support, even created a thread here about it. That said, i must admit that after seeing how BGEE works on iPad 2 (not mine) and how much the ZOOM feature is really necessary, i'm afraid that iPad 1 (no zoom there) will be less playable....
I don't have fat fingers and that zoom is really crucial...
FIrst, on the iPad 1. Guys & Gals remember that the iPad 1 was a crap shoot -- no one in there wildest dreams thought it would do what it did, so Apple kept the specs down to keep the price down, hence the low amount of memory. Sure it would be great for everything to be backwards compatible but there's got to be a cut-off somewhere, and the iPad 1 is seriously under-spec by today's standards.
Second, Baldur's Gate works on the iPad 1. They said so. It works -- for about 45 minutes. And probably after a power off-on to remove any programs running in the background. The problem is that Baldur's gate leaks memory. It allocates stuff that is should be releasing and isn't, and over time that builds up until it overwhelms the iPad 1 memory and it crashes. Eventually it'd probably get the others as well, but not for days. This is a fixable problem, but it's a programmer's ultimate nightmare -- well other than maybe a date -- with a real girl. But I digress.
Could it be fixed? Sure. Should it be fixed? Not so sure.
It's be nice to solve every memory issue, but it just isn't practical. This organization just doesn't have the resources available. They might find a silver bullet that fixes a major leak and allows the iPad 1 to work, but it would be luck. They have to look at their own long-term goals, and that's to continue to crank these puppies out, and to make a few dollars. Yes, they chop some of their market if they exclude the iPad1, but whether or not this actually gets fixed depends strictly on the bottom line -- does it make them money to put effort into a very major fix.
And believe me here, it's a huge fix. I'm dating myself here, but I coded as far back as Apple 2 and Dos, and even had to write my own memory manager for a project to access a 64MB file in 640KB (For those of you who don't know, KB is thousands of bytes -- that old!). I spent more time on the memory management than the rest of the system, and my system wasn't anything like the complexity of this one.
As for jailbreaking whiners -- you broke it, you fix it. Not their problem. I've got a hackintosh and I don't whine to apple every time something doesn't work. It goes with the territory and I agreed to it when I build it, so I deal with it. The solution is simple -- iOS6.
Few honest words. I was dissapointed by lack of iPad 1 support, even created a thread here about it. That said, i must admit that after seeing how BGEE works on iPad 2 (not mine) and how much the ZOOM feature is really necessary, i'm afraid that iPad 1 (no zoom there) will be less playable....
I don't have fat fingers and that zoom is really crucial...
According to what I remember, zoom is included in the iPad 1 Edition, but without the use of filtering. So it'll be a bit more pixelated when zooming, that's all.
Yeah, but four generations of apple is 1/4 of a generation for Xbox, or playstation. 4 every two years or one every 10?
Apples and oranges. Consoles are sold at low margins or at losses early on. Hardware manufacturers need the consoles to be viable long term to turn a profit. Apple goes for high margin, and will only include as much hardware as margins allow. Tablets are also mobile devices, so computing power is constrained by battery life. Keep in mind that Apple also did not know the level of risk or the use cases where the iPad would succeed. An Apple has never been a leader in computing power.
If you want a tablet that has the power to last many generations, get an Intel based Windows 8 tablet. But you will be stuck with 4 hours of battery life.
It is admirable that the team is trying to get a first gen iPad build out the door, considering how many developers have abandoned the platform. As a first and second gen iPhone owner, I can attest to a history of Apple mobile devices being phased out quite quickly.
*shudder*
Ok, I agree with your concepts but *shudder* on your recommendations. Microsoft is WELL KNOWN in the mobile world for producing bloatware just like they do on the PC. When you can put a terribite drive and 16G of ram into a quad core intel machine with 2 video cards, you can afford to run their bloatware.
It's one of the LARGEST reasons that MS has NEVER done well in the mobile computing world. Recommending a BRAND NEW windows device first entered into THIS mobile computing world right now is like recommending a hot off the line program car that's never been crash tested to a family of 10. No matter HOW GOOD it is, I wouldn't touch a Microsoft tablet or windows phone at this point till the next version of it comes out...PERIOD.
The next XBox? ABSOLUTELY...that's a tried and true system.
And back onto the gaming / cost thing: I hate to agree with Wake on this one, but...yea...he's right.
Gaming is what pushes computing hardware. Always has. MS Office and Internet Explorer is never going to drive someone to buy a new PC. Assassin's Creed III is.
WIth as quickly as graphics hardware and PC hardware revs, and as quickly as both the hardware and software manufacturers obsolete, expecting ANY computing device (mobile or otherwise) to last you more than a couple years is not realistic.
While I also take issue with the "Just buy a new iPad" mentality, anyone who owns an iPad 1 should be looking strongly at replacing that device at this point. It is end of life, it is no longer supported by apple and no one should expect ANYTHING to be made to work on it anymore. Owners of iPad 2's should be quickly looking around before the end of 2013 for they're next replacement as well.
At the end of the day, if you are a gamer, (just like with every OTHER hobby out there) you need to be willing to drop money on that hobby...and gaming is a lot more expensive than most others out there.
Capability aside, 3 - 4 years is pretty much the extent of any computing platform you will own if you're a gamer. Going beyond that leaves you in a situation where you WILL be left out.
Comments
That's true, it is a bit ridiculous, especially the latest iPad that came 6 months after iPad 3, which I bought and damn I was pissed when I heard it was already a generation behind...
But XBox 360 and PS3 is still very powerful, even after all this time, whereas the original iPad was handicapped from the start and is unsupported by a huge host of games and apps already. It just can't compare with later generations.
I've also got an iPad 2, and as far as I can see, it can do everything my iPad 3 can do, so it's going to last a whole lot longer in regards to app and game support I think.
But I absolutely agree with you in principle. It's just that the iPad 1 is a special case, as it was the first of its kind, and seriously flawed because of the low amount of RAM.
As I stated before, I'm amazed at how many people apparently have one still.
I've been watching the forums and waiting for the iPad version to get released. Although I'm a bit disappointed to see the original iPad isn't supported, It's not a big deal for me. I still have mt original BG install disks and it runs fine on Win7 (along with BG2, and IWD1& 2). The iPad version was just going to be a novelty purchase for me.
-Skeld
I hardly ever use my PC for anything at all anymore, mostly it's used as a music and movie media center...
I use mine to make music on, with real instruments as well as digital.
Reading and posting on forums, using mine for writing this.
Reading books on it.
Surf the web, stream music, listen to radio streaming to my speakers in my living room.
Watching BBC, Eurosport, Netflix and other steaming services.
A whole host of other stuff.
That's besides playing BG and other games of course.
Even if I need to write longer texts, I use a Bluetooth keyboard and Pages and save to my Dropbox account.
There's some things a dedicated computer is better at, but there's so many things one can do on the iPad, sprawling on the couch.. :-)
It's a devious way of forcing people to upgrade their device, and a device that wasn't exactly cheap.
If you want a tablet that has the power to last many generations, get an Intel based Windows 8 tablet. But you will be stuck with 4 hours of battery life.
It is admirable that the team is trying to get a first gen iPad build out the door, considering how many developers have abandoned the platform. As a first and second gen iPhone owner, I can attest to a history of Apple mobile devices being phased out quite quickly.
I don't have fat fingers and that zoom is really crucial...
And I guess I just did too.
...except an Alice...
FIrst, on the iPad 1. Guys & Gals remember that the iPad 1 was a crap shoot -- no one in there wildest dreams thought it would do what it did, so Apple kept the specs down to keep the price down, hence the low amount of memory. Sure it would be great for everything to be backwards compatible but there's got to be a cut-off somewhere, and the iPad 1 is seriously under-spec by today's standards.
Second, Baldur's Gate works on the iPad 1. They said so. It works -- for about 45 minutes. And probably after a power off-on to remove any programs running in the background. The problem is that Baldur's gate leaks memory. It allocates stuff that is should be releasing and isn't, and over time that builds up until it overwhelms the iPad 1 memory and it crashes. Eventually it'd probably get the others as well, but not for days. This is a fixable problem, but it's a programmer's ultimate nightmare -- well other than maybe a date -- with a real girl. But I digress.
Could it be fixed? Sure.
Should it be fixed? Not so sure.
It's be nice to solve every memory issue, but it just isn't practical. This organization just doesn't have the resources available. They might find a silver bullet that fixes a major leak and allows the iPad 1 to work, but it would be luck. They have to look at their own long-term goals, and that's to continue to crank these puppies out, and to make a few dollars. Yes, they chop some of their market if they exclude the iPad1, but whether or not this actually gets fixed depends strictly on the bottom line -- does it make them money to put effort into a very major fix.
And believe me here, it's a huge fix. I'm dating myself here, but I coded as far back as Apple 2 and Dos, and even had to write my own memory manager for a project to access a 64MB file in 640KB (For those of you who don't know, KB is thousands of bytes -- that old!). I spent more time on the memory management than the rest of the system, and my system wasn't anything like the complexity of this one.
As for jailbreaking whiners -- you broke it, you fix it. Not their problem. I've got a hackintosh and I don't whine to apple every time something doesn't work. It goes with the territory and I agreed to it when I build it, so I deal with it. The solution is simple -- iOS6.
Ok, I agree with your concepts but *shudder* on your recommendations. Microsoft is WELL KNOWN in the mobile world for producing bloatware just like they do on the PC. When you can put a terribite drive and 16G of ram into a quad core intel machine with 2 video cards, you can afford to run their bloatware.
It's one of the LARGEST reasons that MS has NEVER done well in the mobile computing world. Recommending a BRAND NEW windows device first entered into THIS mobile computing world right now is like recommending a hot off the line program car that's never been crash tested to a family of 10. No matter HOW GOOD it is, I wouldn't touch a Microsoft tablet or windows phone at this point till the next version of it comes out...PERIOD.
The next XBox? ABSOLUTELY...that's a tried and true system.
And back onto the gaming / cost thing: I hate to agree with Wake on this one, but...yea...he's right.
Gaming is what pushes computing hardware. Always has. MS Office and Internet Explorer is never going to drive someone to buy a new PC. Assassin's Creed III is.
WIth as quickly as graphics hardware and PC hardware revs, and as quickly as both the hardware and software manufacturers obsolete, expecting ANY computing device (mobile or otherwise) to last you more than a couple years is not realistic.
While I also take issue with the "Just buy a new iPad" mentality, anyone who owns an iPad 1 should be looking strongly at replacing that device at this point. It is end of life, it is no longer supported by apple and no one should expect ANYTHING to be made to work on it anymore. Owners of iPad 2's should be quickly looking around before the end of 2013 for they're next replacement as well.
At the end of the day, if you are a gamer, (just like with every OTHER hobby out there) you need to be willing to drop money on that hobby...and gaming is a lot more expensive than most others out there.
Capability aside, 3 - 4 years is pretty much the extent of any computing platform you will own if you're a gamer. Going beyond that leaves you in a situation where you WILL be left out.
--Illydth