Which Final Proficiency Point for my dual-wielding fighter/mage?

Oxford_Guy

I'm currently running a neutral evil elf fighter mage through BGEE and want to retain the same proficiencies in BG2EE, rather than re-spec, so am planning ahead a little.

Am currently at level 3/3 and have:
Longswords ++
Dual Wielding +++

I've also been using the long bow of marksmanship (+3 THAC0) without a bow proficiency, which is fine, as with the elf +1 THAC0 bonus on top, and only losing -1 for being non-proficient in a weapon as a fighter, I still hit often.

The highest level I can reach in BGEE will be level 7/7, so I will get one more proficiency at level 6 fighter. I'm undecided whether to go scimitars (mostly for Belm in BG2, which gives +1 attack, always to the main hand) or katanas (mostly for the Zerthblade(?) that gives extra 1-4th level spells in BG2), which do you think would be best in the long-run? I will probably use a longsword in my main hand for much of BG2EE, so it's mostly down to what would be best in the off-hand. The extra spells from the Katana are appealing, but I'm concerned that it could be a pain to manage in practice, as I assume you lose the extra spells whenever you change weapon (e.g. to a bow)

Pantalion

Correct, you'd lose the spells.

Secondly.... It doesn't really matter. Your offhand weapon only ever attacks once, at a penalty; you may as well have saved the third point in Dual Wielding to specialise for an extra 1/2 attack wielding your secondary weapon of choice (assuming it works that way, I've never actually checked). If the specialisation doesn't give an extra 1/2 attack, you may as well spend the points in bows or something and eat the non-proficiency penalty.

Oxford_Guy

Pantalion said:

Correct, you'd lose the spells.

Thought so, that makes Katanas considerably less appealing...

Pantalion said:

Secondly.... It doesn't really matter. Your offhand weapon only ever attacks once, at a penalty; you may as well have saved the third point in Dual Wielding to specialise for an extra 1/2 attack wielding your secondary weapon of choice (assuming it works that way, I've never actually checked)

It doesn't work that way, even if specialised in your off-hand weapon, you still only get one attack with it and it doesn't give a bonus 1/2 attack to your main hand either. I put the third pip in dual-wielding as I'd like to at least have a chance hitting with the off-hand weapon, with the elf bonus +1 THAC0 with all swords (including katanas and scimitars), it's only really a -1 to hit with the off-hand with 2 points in dual-wield

Pantalion said:

. If the specialisation doesn't give an extra 1/2 attack, you may as well spend the points in bows or something and eat the non-proficiency penalty.

Well, in BG1 I'm hitting well enough with bows anyway, and can't see myself using bows in BG2 much, given how nerfed they are (no +x damage bonuses etc.) and near useless in the end game (due to lack of high enough +x ammo and another NPC will be using Gesen)

toanwrath

Yes you would lose the bonus spells if you unequip the Zerth blade. However, you could just try and use those spells first. I did that with my Kensai/Mage and he worked out pretty well (prepare the spells you want to cast first in the 'bonus' slots, and then cast those before weapon switching). Also, I think that for just attacking, Celestial Fury (the +3 Katana that STUNS people) is one of the best weapons in the game IMO. My Kensai/Mage used single weapon style and started with the Zerth Blade, but would spam the bonus spells and switch to Celestial Fury and wiped the floor with any enemies. Then again, I also preferred single weapon to two-weapon because of my wimpy AC...

The point is, I would say Katanas are the way to go, because you can get past the Zerth flaw, and Celestial Fury is a beastly sword.

Flashburn

Get that bow proficiency. You'll be able to hit anything like my buddy Coran.

I would start getting those other proficiencies once you import into BG2(EE).

Oxford_Guy

Flashburn said:

Get that bow proficiency. You'll be able to hit anything like my buddy Coran.

I would start getting those other proficiencies once you import into BG2(EE).

I'm really not bothered about getting proficiency in a bow, and as a fighter/mage will level slowly in BG2EE, so want to be pretty set-up to dual-wielding katanas and longswords or scimitars andlongswords from the off...

Darkovan

I believe there is a shortsword some place that gives you an extra attack/round, might as well go that way if nothing else is appealing.

Oxford_Guy

Darkovan said:

I believe there is a shortsword some place that gives you an extra attack/round, might as well go that way if nothing else is appealing.

Kundane in BG2? Yeah, but the scimitar Belm does more damage and slashing, rather than piercing, damage, which less enemies are immune to

Madhax

I can't be arsed to swap between dual-wielding and bows in these games, so I tend to just stick with my melee weapons constantly. I voted Scimitar because of Belm in BG2, but I could have just as easily gone Katana for Celestial/Zerth. I've never run into problems losing spells mid-fight due to weapon swaps.

That said, I'm also hoping they adopt the IWD2 method of weapon swapping for BG2EE. In IWD2, each character had four two-spot slots for weapons and shields. So, a single character could have a 2-hander, a sword n' board, a bow, and a pair of knives equipped all at the same time, ready to swap between them without pausing or entering the inventory space. It rocked. If they implement something like that in BG2EE, my answer changes to some type of bow.

Corvino

I'm going to say it.

Flails

Some of the hands down most brokenly overpowered weapons in BG2 are flails, and you're already pretty set for BG1 in weapon terms. 2 flails spring to mind, and if you're a powergamer you know what they are. There are also a couple of nice "utility" flails and morningstars available before you leave Athkatla on with nice on-hit abilities.

toanwrath

@Madhax
I agree almost completely. I used to prefer Katanas to everything, and still do in BG2. But if BG2:EE adds as many Scimitar/Wakizashi/Ninjatao options as they BG:EE did, they might have me hooked.

toanwrath

Corvino said:

I'm going to say it.

Flails

Some of the hands down most brokenly overpowered weapons in BG2 are flails, and you're already pretty set for BG1 in weapon terms. 2 flails spring to mind, and if you're a powergamer you know what they are. There are also a couple of nice "utility" flails and morningstars available before you leave Athkatla on with nice on-hit abilities.

Warhammers also come to mind, but I prefer to save Flails and Warhammers for the Clerics that can't use the swords.

elminster

Katana's, because dual wielding them looks cooler than scimitars (but only just a little bit cooler). Plus we know there are a few good ones in bg2, but I imagine bg2ee will add all sorts of new weapons.

toanwrath

@elminster
Dual wielding Katanas looks very cool, I agree. Dual wielding scimitars isn't as cool, but my Stalker dual wielding two scimitars belonging to a certain Drow (one of them blue) looks damn cool!

Nukenin

Corvino said:

I'm going to say it.

Flails

[…]

Yep. Don't give the flails to some wussy cleric. They got their maces and hammers and such.

Aristillius

I have a elf fighter/mage too. Im going longsword, Dual wield, longbow, katana - in that order.

toanwrath

Nukenin said:

Corvino said:

I'm going to say it.

Flails

[…]

Yep. Don't give the flails to some wussy cleric. They got their maces and hammers and such.

Warhammers sure, but they don't have any good maces. The selection for maces is EXTREMELY limited. I tend to have two Cleric types in the party, so I give one a certain warhammer and one a certain flail. I save the swords for the fighters.

Lemernis

Celestial Fury ftw!

Nukenin

toanwrath said:

Nukenin said:

Corvino said:

I'm going to say it.

Flails

[…]

Yep. Don't give the flails to some wussy cleric. They got their maces and hammers and such.

Warhammers sure, but they don't have any good maces. The selection for maces is EXTREMELY limited. I tend to have two Cleric types in the party, so I give one a certain warhammer and one a certain flail. I save the swords for the fighters.

Viconia in my current game has that stunning mace that Imoen found in one of the inns of Beregost. My halfling barbarian is a warhammer nut, but he's training up longsword now as well (at least I think that's what I picked for him next), because he's got some idiot player who wants him to have the best of both worlds.