Suggestions for my Beastmaster/Cleric?
toanwrath
Member Posts: 621
Hello all!
So after much internal debate, I have decided to make a Ranger/Cleric. I will start as a Human Beastmaster, then dual over to Clericafter I have found some Tomes of Wisdom (It only took me about 5 minutes to get this roll, but I don't want to push my luck...)
The two reasons that I chose Beastmaster are because I enjoy having a familiar (and bonus HPs ROCK!), and because, like a Cleric, Beastmaster is limited in its weapon selection so the 'disadvantage' of Beastmaster synergies (synergizes?) with Cleric very well.
Here are my stats:
Strength: 18/71
Dexterity: 18
Constitution: 18
Intelligence: 10
Wisdom: 14
Charisma: 12
I rolled again, because I wanted a higher Wisdom. believe it or not, I achieved this WITHOUT using Ctrl+8, though it did take about 15 minutes.
OMG 18/00!!!
And the rest are pretty awesome. Pretty 'power-gamey', but I enjoy having the main character be the best character (and if you know the story, it makes sense...)
I was pretty happy with this roll, but I can always go back and change it. and I don't really want to change it (I LOVE THAT 18/00 without CTRL+8!!)
My big questions are:
1.) My first question is, can Beastmaster even dual over to Cleric? I have heard rumors that Stalker and Archer cannot dual currently (a bug perhaps?) or maybe I am just remembering incorrectly), and I hope that is not the case for Beastmasters.
2.) Are these stats manageable?Or should I hope for better wisdom so i don't need all three tomes?
3.) What weapon style should I go? My only real choice here is between Quarterstaff and Club, but I can't remember if Clerics can use clubs. My dilemma here is, if Clerics can use clubs, reach or style? If I go Quarterstaff, I get a higher reach and I can just focus on Two-handed weapon style. If I go club, I have to decide between using a Club and Shield, or Single Weapon style and Two Weapon(s) style. I will definitely also have a few points in sling at some point (though probably with my Cleric levels).
4.) What level is ideal for dualing over to Cleric? I have never played a Ranger/Cleric before, so I am interested to hear your thoughts.
5.) Any other thoughts/suggestions? I have a feeling this character will be very fun, but I want some help from those Ranger/Cleric experts out there.
Let me know!
EDITED: A few times to fix typos, and to update two-weapon fighting possibility, and for my new stats
So after much internal debate, I have decided to make a Ranger/Cleric. I will start as a Human Beastmaster, then dual over to Cleric
The two reasons that I chose Beastmaster are because I enjoy having a familiar (and bonus HPs ROCK!), and because, like a Cleric, Beastmaster is limited in its weapon selection so the 'disadvantage' of Beastmaster synergies (synergizes?) with Cleric very well.
Strength: 18/71
Dexterity: 18
Constitution: 18
Intelligence: 10
Wisdom: 14
Charisma: 12
I rolled again, because I wanted a higher Wisdom. believe it or not, I achieved this WITHOUT using Ctrl+8, though it did take about 15 minutes.
OMG 18/00!!!
And the rest are pretty awesome. Pretty 'power-gamey', but I enjoy having the main character be the best character (and if you know the story, it makes sense...)
I was pretty happy with this roll,
My big questions are:
1.) My first question is, can Beastmaster even dual over to Cleric? I have heard rumors that Stalker and Archer cannot dual currently (a bug perhaps?) or maybe I am just remembering incorrectly), and I hope that is not the case for Beastmasters.
2.) Are these stats manageable?
3.) What weapon style should I go? My only real choice here is between Quarterstaff and Club, but I can't remember if Clerics can use clubs. My dilemma here is, if Clerics can use clubs, reach or style? If I go Quarterstaff, I get a higher reach and I can just focus on Two-handed weapon style. If I go club, I have to decide between using a Club and Shield, or Single Weapon style and Two Weapon(s) style. I will definitely also have a few points in sling at some point (though probably with my Cleric levels).
4.) What level is ideal for dualing over to Cleric? I have never played a Ranger/Cleric before, so I am interested to hear your thoughts.
5.) Any other thoughts/suggestions? I have a feeling this character will be very fun, but I want some help from those Ranger/Cleric experts out there.
Let me know!
EDITED: A few times to fix typos, and to update two-weapon fighting possibility, and for my new stats
Post edited by toanwrath on
0
Comments
The ideal level to dual-classing to cleric with a Beastmaster, sadly, is 12 (I guess 13 for the extra attack per round but I'm looking at this from the spell casting side). You can't get there in BG1. The issues with trying a beastmaster/cleric build is there's no reason, whatsoever, to go beastmaster over just a regular ranger unless you reach his spellcasting levels. You don't gain his bonus animal summoning spells til you also hit the level required to cast that level divine spell AS A RANGER.
So all you're getting is a familiar, at the cost of being able to use heavy armor and decent weaponry.
I was mainly doing it for the familiar, and to do something along the lines of Ranger dualing to cleric to get the druid spells. However, I did not know that you actually had to get to level 12 to get the appropriate level Animal summoning (I assumed it would work like the druid spells). Bummer.
I most likely will not do a Beastmaster/Cleric then, but I might still try a Ranger/Cleric (and perhaps just a Beastmaster, but I prefer the Stalker over the Beastmaster if I am forced into light armor). Thank you @sandmanCCL for the help.
EDIT: Also, I would probably remake this character anyways if I did decide to go with a Beastmaster or a Beastmaster/Cleric so that I could get the Chaotic Good familiar over the Neutral Good familiar (thought I picked the one with the Invisibility 10', silly me)
Just saying, if you're going for that for BG1 only, it's really not that viable.
N.B. What is the best light armor in BG1EE?
I might be wrong, but the best in Bg:EE to my knowledge is the shadow armor at ac 4, although only thieves can use it. Besides that, my stalker is sporting ac 5 studded leather +2.
I suppose that while a pure beast master might be fun, I would prefer a stalker almost any day (sneak attack!). I really want to make ranger cleric fun for me, so i figure I mix it with something oddball like beast master.
Also, I'm glad someone else uses Garrick besides me
Also, apparently I won't be playing my beast master for a while since one of the friends that wants to play with me and my brother is getting the game for android tablet...and who knows when that will be.
Did you make that up or is that a quote? It seems familiar...
Although some people love to use it because it is interesting and somewhat odd, to put it simply, Beastmaster is kit which also has potential to become one of most powerfull cleric combos, even most powerfull of them all, if you use human Beastmaster.
Lets check what Beastmaster offers:
1) As ranger kit it allows fast creation od character with high abilities cause 4 of them can't be less then 13 (STR, WIS, DEX and CON) which means you need to chase good roll numbers for only 2 other stats (INT and CHA) which usualy can be achieved in only 5 minutes or less of rolling abilities
2) Mentioned high abilities will, in case of human ranger, assure ease dual classing into Cleric with all nice healing, protective and summoning spells which come with that class. Usualy, cleric does not have great range of weapons it can use, but since Beatmaster is also prohibited from many weapon types, in this dual class is no problem at all to use staffs since they are among most powerfull weapons in both Baldur 1 and 2.
The Staff of the Ram +6 is already mentioned as most damaging weapon in Baldur 2, while Baldur 1 has Aule's staff +3 which can be find in Ulgoth's Beard.
3) Beastmaster can Summon Familiar as ability, not as spell. This is important cause for any magic user (Mage, Sorcerer, Bard, Multiclass) which has casted it, can happen for familiar to "get lost", but he can not resummon another because its restricted to only one casting. That goes for Beastmaster too if his familiar is present, but sometimes happens (as it seems randomly) that Beastmaster's familiar does not follow him from one location to other on world map (from role play point of view in can be considered Beastmaster "released it" in nature).
In such cases, Beastmaster can resummon his familiar, getting additional total HP for each resummon. With that, Beastmater can achive HP larger then any other class or combination of classes. If that is repeated enough times, Beastmaster can reach 1000 HP or even several thousands HP if you play long enough.
One might see this as being ovepowered, but if main character is considered to be not ordinary human, but offspring of immortal, it's in accord with general Baldur's Gate story.
Also, note that same effect of plenty of HP can be achieved easer by summoning familiar by Beastmaster at very begging of game, save game, and then import character from that saved game to new game. Character will be imported with incerased number of HP, but will be able to summon aditional familiar adding even more HP. That can be repeated as many times as required, but note that game may remember number of familiars summoned, so if last summoned familiar dies, main character may not lose just one CON stat point, but rather all of them, which would instantly kill him - therefore after such procedure it would be wise to keep your familiar in Inventory for protection (just talk to familiar and put him in backpack).
If You don't like reloading game and resummoning familiars because you consider it too cheat like , then just resummon familiars during same game after previous get "lost" (as already explained) and that should still insure that Your Beastmaster has more HP then any other class or combo, and you achived that in complete legite way ! :-)
4) In Baldur Gate 2, Beastmaster/Cleric dual class was only one able to turn to muliclass - if you turn Beatsmaster to Fallen Beastmaster (with party reputation below 6) and when character has larger number of Cleric levels then Beastmater's, then this combo starts to act as multiclass, adding exp for both classes, and giving access not just to all cleric but also druid spells.
5) Even without dualclassing, Beatsmaster is very powerfull, and with additional HP (see point 3) and summoning spells is one of most easest classes to solo
Conclusions:
This great potential of being overpowered is recognized by game developers and is probably reason why Beastmaster / Cleric combo is continued to be nerfed.
In latest patch, one of few flails which may have been used by Beastmater since its woooden (Trasher +2), now can't be used any more.
Also, skeletal warriors summoned by cleric prior to latest patch were leaving +1 long sword after they died, giving practically unlimited source of weapon and gold (by selling of those swords in any shop after you summon and kill skellies, ofc), but now they do not leave any item no more.
Still, if You are interested in playing not that usual class, but still want to have great advantages, then Beastmaster is right class for You !
There a real " Once more into the breech dear friends " leader for you
What are you guys talking about? Of course it's legit. The designers CLEARLY INTENDED for your familiar to spontaneously disappear. It's just like when you can't remember where you put your car keys down. And the fact that getting a replacement familiar gives you another 15 HP is also not an exploit or a bug. I mean, who doesn't feel invigorated when they come home from the store with a new pet?
Furthermore, it's totally balanced. You say that summoning new familiars to get yourself to 1000 HP isn't legit, but have you thought about what happens if one of those familiars dies? You lose 1 constitution PERMANENTLY! And that's enough to drop you from 1000 HP down to, like, 990! That's not even quadruple digits! Aren't you supposed to be a god child?
This mechanic is clearly working as intended for the Beastmaster.
...Now if only they would fix the mage version!
I prefer Eldoth, but only with the Dex gloves, otherwise Garrick
Instead of being a Beastmanster
Your CHARNAME can now be a Boomaster
and have a minature giant space hamster as a familiar
special familiar ability
"" GO FOR THE EYES ""
fail save and target is blinded for two turns
So contrary to what I earlier said, I did end up starting my Beastmaster. My multiplayer character is a multi ranger/cleric instead and he deatroys everything with stupifier and Ashideena... anyways, my beastmaster: His stats are the same as listed above, and my party is:
Ajax: level 4 Beastmaster, wielding the +3 Quarterstaff from Ulgoth's Beard and hide armor (also a ring of princes, gauntlets of weapon specialization, and boots of stealth). Kills EVERYTHING
Ajantis: with a point in scimitar and using Icingdeath, he is a decent tank. After I'm done with Rasaad he will inherit twinkle
Rasaad: until I get Alora and finish his quest, he uses twinkle to stay alive longer
Branwen: healer is useful, I'll replace her when I get Yeslick (slurp)
Garrick: Not having to prepare remove fear is useful, sometimes he disrupts mages with a crossbow, and his spells are cool and neath burrito. I might have to grab Dorn for a bit to give him some elven chain. Oh, and he might get a strength boosting item so that he is even better with the chelsey crusher.
Imoen: once I get Alora, she will most likely dual to Mage (as many people do with her).
Fun game, Rasaad is kind of meh compared to other games I use him in where he rocks. Branwen is useless except for healing, but my main guy is awesome. It was very fun to go into Tazok's tent all invisible thanks to my familiar and hide behind every enemy and kill the Mage before he got a turn.
Response time!
@Oxford_Guy
Garrick unfortunately does not have bonus HP like Eldoth from Constitution which is unfortunate. However, I agree with you that I use Garrick when not relying on gloves of dex for two reasons. 1.) You can get him earlier and if you use max HP/level aka normal difficulty (like the noob I am), he gets decent HP. Also, Garrick does not have a mandatory whiny thief companion (cough Skie cough).
@Rhyme
Sarcasm, trolling, or neither? Regardless, I LOLed.
All the early the druid spells are just absolutely worthless though and really add nothing
I disagree, but not many people share my love of goodberry. It can help when you are traveling a lot and resting without doing anything to make a bunch of berries that will later heal you for a decent amount.
Also, did you use clubs or Quarterstaves? Otherwise I see no way that you could have back stabbed since backstabbing only works with thief-proficient weapons (shame because I would love to backstabbing with the Crom Faeyr in BG2)
Again its more of a fun build rather than cheese but the char ended up being pretty fun and dynamic. I have no intention of importing him into bg2
As it seems that my position about Beastmaster is being put to additional criticism and (in some cases) attempts of row sarcasm, I just want to reiterate that my list of positive Beastmaster's abilities and advantages was not intended to create discussion if something is real ability or game exploit, but rather to give additional options to new players during development of this unusual kit.
That being said, it seems that discussion got life of it's own so I am forced to get more involved after all :-)
Main argument in some of previous forum discussions was that multiple pet casting by Beastmaster during same game must obviously be a bug. However, that bug does not work for other summoners - that is wizzies, bards and sorcerers should be imported in new game in order to be able to cast familiar again.
As Beastmaster's summon familiar does not work completely the same way as for rest of mentioned classes, logical conclusion is that it was indeed intended to work little different - therefore why game developers did not make just a simple copy / paste of wizard/sorcerer summon familiar to Beastmaster in order to work completely same way ?
However, since I know that this rhetorical question will not be sufficient as argument, I am enclosing one link (just for example) to a Sorcere's place site , in part where they describe Beastmaster:
http://www.sorcerers.net/Games/BG2/beastmaster.php
That description is not only consistent with my understanding of Beastmaster, but shows that, if rules are applied fully, this kit would have even greater powers and abilities. I will quote just few sentences from it:
"The Beastmaster's animal henchmen are free to come, go, or act as they will. Any attempt to restrict or regulate their freedom, or ignoring their needs and desires, will result in resentment, sulkiness, and possible abandonment."
As it can be seen, one of feats specialy for Beastmaster is to abandon his animal pets (or pets abandon him) which completeli matches situation when Beastmasters familiar suddenly gets lost during travel between locations on world map, and since its not a spell but an ability, it/s logical there is no limit to ressummon another.
Description in mentioned link also says that (if powerfull enough) Beastmaster can summon horde of creatures which become more powerfull with level and age of Ranger (although only once a year). Logic says that Beastmaster which would have that ability , and with sufficient level, would literally get hundreds of additional HP when they would summon horde of Hippogryphs, Griffons or even maybe few Green or Gold Dragons to aid some important good cause as Beastmaster's familiars.
Of course, probably due to game mechanics, previously BG 2 developers and now BG EE team did not introduce such a powerfull ability, but they probably allowed multiple summonings for a Beastmaster during a same game as replacement to a calling of Horde (although admittedly it seems to work rather randomly during map travels, but that also makes sense cause Your wild pet can abandon You anywhere in wilderness if You are not good to him).
Therefore for Beastmaster can be said that in same time it has great disadvantages and potentials and therefore is fun to play:
a) very limited weapon choices then regular Rangers (or any other fighter type class)
b) Much more HP then other fighter classes
Bottom line is, if You are good player, or just enthusiastic enough, You can find ways to reduce disadvantages and emphasise mentioned advantage.
I hope this has somewhat cleared this isue. For the end, I will say that I am open for constructive remarks (as done by majority of previous commenters) , but some comments are more close to envy/spite zone, therefore I will state that I am definetely not first player to understand fantastic potential of Beastmaster. I rather just took good advices from many other posts and tried to join them to one, for benefit of all Baldur gate players interested in this kit.
If I succeeded in that, is for readers to decide :-)
The ability was clearly tagged on at the last minute to try and make a naff kit slightly less naff, which is why the ability isn't mentioned in the description. Which is where modding the game comes in. There are mods that try to implement Beastmaster pets more faithfully. But what they don't do is perminantly increase your hp every time your pet returns.
If you are a good player you will RP a weak kit for the additional challenge. If you are a bad player you will use exploits to make up for your lack of skill.