[BG2:EE] Druids revised?
chebmeh
Member Posts: 20
Now, the following is simply my opinion on the matter, so please don't berate me for this: 2nd Edition AD&D is too restrictive, particularly so with druids. Yes, BG is more flexible than PnP, but the simple fact is that for all druids get, you may as well take ranger/cleric. Druids just aren't that pretty, and while there are plenty of PnP reasons why they have such a steep experience curve, it just deters people away from the class in BG2. While clerics, mages and even ranger/clerics are shooting off into level 20, you'll have just squeezed past level 14, which I think is really disheartening.
The shapeshift forms are particularly bad, including the forms from the shapeshifter kit. You sacrifice spellcasting to become a walking sponge, in the grand scheme of things. I admit that the BG2tweaks change to the shapeshifter kit was kind of overpowered, but here's the thing: it was playable! You still weren't as powerful as a well-kitted out cleric with a decent weapon and magical full-plate. That and you'd still take damage, frequently.
I believe it was also bg2tweaks that introduced changes to the experience tables of druids and made them mirror that of a cleric's. I'm not saying Overhaul should use these changes, but perhaps just create their own experience tables. Druids do have their strengths, but much less so than many other classes. They're not the worst class in the game, of course not. Bards could potentially win that competition. However, I don't like the idea of having so many underwhelming abilities that sound great, but aren't, and having a very long period of waiting while the rest of my party exceeds me by 6 levels.
Since combat is the core of BG, and roleplay really only bubbles down to the player's choices and stat distributions, I think one or two PnP restrictions should be lifted from the original game in order to provide a more pleasurable experience.
Show nature some love!
The shapeshift forms are particularly bad, including the forms from the shapeshifter kit. You sacrifice spellcasting to become a walking sponge, in the grand scheme of things. I admit that the BG2tweaks change to the shapeshifter kit was kind of overpowered, but here's the thing: it was playable! You still weren't as powerful as a well-kitted out cleric with a decent weapon and magical full-plate. That and you'd still take damage, frequently.
I believe it was also bg2tweaks that introduced changes to the experience tables of druids and made them mirror that of a cleric's. I'm not saying Overhaul should use these changes, but perhaps just create their own experience tables. Druids do have their strengths, but much less so than many other classes. They're not the worst class in the game, of course not. Bards could potentially win that competition. However, I don't like the idea of having so many underwhelming abilities that sound great, but aren't, and having a very long period of waiting while the rest of my party exceeds me by 6 levels.
Since combat is the core of BG, and roleplay really only bubbles down to the player's choices and stat distributions, I think one or two PnP restrictions should be lifted from the original game in order to provide a more pleasurable experience.
Show nature some love!
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Comments
Yes, the Shifter needs some work. The forms aren't getting the bonuses they're supposed to have, which make the GWW garbage at high levels since it can't hit anything (even with the fix it couldn't hit things requiring +4 or higher, but that's still a massive increase in usability over what it currently does, and having it's proper regeneration rate would do wonders for it's damage sponge-ness).
The Avenger though is already brokenly powerful. They give a F/D a run for their money in shear ass-kicking. And are much more powerful in melee then even the GWW form would be if it was fixed (not as tough, but much higher melee damage)
Totemic summons could also use a little buffing, let them hit as +2 and +3 at higher levels, and give them some magic resistance so they can soak spells more effectively...maybe require +1 to hit at higher levels.
Level though isn't really that big of a deal though. They end up just as high level as mage and sorc at the end, they just have a rather nasty early game xp jump at 14. Though on the other hand, they level MUCH faster then clerics for the first 12 or so levels.
I guess if you consider the druids spellcasting equal in power to the clerics they should both follow the same xp and casting progression. Clerics have turn undead and better equipment options though so maybe the druids animal forms should scale just a bit too.
I am not sure that's the case though. Druids have stuff like iron skins, insect plague, conjure animals and natures beauty.
Clerics have some great stuff too, but are their spells that good?
I wouldn't of minded the original developers implementing Druids as close to PnP as possible and not make them a playable class. That really would of opened things up for story telling.
Still though this does seem to be broken in SoA, will it be effective in ToB? I worry about the druids mediocre thaco. Any advice for ToB?
Sorry about the avenger derail guys.
1st It was buggy and didn't work as intended.
2nd Even if it did work as intended, it would still be weaklish.
Druid/Mage
Druid/Ranger
Fighter/Druid/Mage
There was also Ranger/Mage but that doesn't count here!
If we can get these, especially druid/Mage, we'll have a lethal character more dangerous than Cleric/Mages with access to Sequencer and Contingency druid spells... how much Greater Malison/Doom/Nature's Beauty spam = GG