Questions about backstab

Wowo

So I've started a Cleric/thief and have a few questions about backstab.

1. How is the attack roll affected by backstab?
2. Would backstabbing with a weapon I'm not proficient in be reasonable?
3. Can I backstab from sanctuary?
4. Can I backstab while wearing heavy armour or holding a large shield?

Cheers

Valen

I'm no expert but from what I know from playing 2nd ED D&D

1. Its a basic THACO cart roll but comes with a multiplier for damage that increases per level.
2. I wouldn't say so. Honestly I don't know how you backstab with a blunt weapon but that's not for me to judge haha.
3. No
4. Shield? Yes but heavy armor ruins move silently. Which is needed to trigger back-stab just like sneak attack in 3.5Ed rules.

Sorry its not much but I hoped this helped a bit. Defiantly a strange combo that would be fun to play.

TJ_Hooker

1) In BG you get a +4 to hit when attacking from stealth/invisibility.
2) I think you might have trouble hitting things unless you buff pretty good.
3) I don't think so
4) Yes, but you can't stealth in heavy armour, so you'd have use a potion/spell to become invisible. Or, if you don't mind cheese, you can stealth and then equip the heavy armour and you'll stay stealthed.

Mykra

Wowo said:

So I've started a Cleric/thief and have a few questions about backstab.

1. How is the attack roll affected by backstab?
2. Would backstabbing with a weapon I'm not proficient in be reasonable?
3. Can I backstab from sanctuary?
4. Can I backstab while wearing heavy armour or holding a large shield?

Cheers

1: You gain a +4 to your attack roll if you are hidden/invisible from your opponent.

2: Dependent on your to-hit. Early in the game, you'd probably miss every attack. Later on, you could probably pull it off.

3: Sanctuary makes you invisible, so yes, you can get off your attack that way. I'm not sure if it was fixed in BG:EE, but you used to be able to use some rogue skills/commit some actions (like opening chests) under Sanctuary as well without losing it.

4: You can backstab while using a shield. Unless you are using a mod like 'Stealth in Any Armor' from BGTweaks, you cannot stealth in heavy armor. However, you can drink a potion of invisibility, or use an item like Sandthief's ring, and then backstab that way.

the_spyder

I am pretty sure the sanctuary thing works as well. But be aware that you have to be BEHIND the person you are Backstabbing. This isn't like it is in Neverwinter where being tangential to your opponent is good enough.

As has been stated, attacking with a weapon you are not proficient with is a pretty safe way to waste a back-stab. You miss and become visible. Then it is straight combat. And not great combat at that unless you are pretty heafily buffed.

ZanathKariashi

A. You can only backstab with melee weapons usable by a single class thief without UAI. In the case of a C/T that's clubs and quarterstaves. This isn't that bad of a deal as the best backstab weapon in both games is a staff.

B. Attacking from invisibility/stealth gives +4 hit. For a C/T using a weapon you aren't proficient in gives a -3 hit penalty, largely negating that bonus. Highly unadvised to attempt it.

C. Last I checked, you can't BS from sanctuary, but I haven't tried a C/T in EE yet, so they might've changed it.

lunar

In addition:Last I checked, you could backstab with Shilelagh. It is a nice spell weapon as it has +1 to hit and does 2d4 base damage, which is equivelant of backstabbing with a bastard sword!

Oxford_Guy

BTW the best backstab weapon in the game is the Staff of Striking, though you can't get that until quite late. There are +1 staves available very early on, though, and in BGEE there is now a +2 staff in Cloakwoord Druids, though you have to kill someone to get it. Don't forget with 2 handed style you also get bonuses to damage, speed and double critical hit chance too.

Draw Upon Holy might is also great for backstabs.

BTW are you playing a gnome or a half-orc? I prefer the former for the thieving bonuses and con-based bonuses to saves vs. spell.

NB: you can't use *most* thieving abilities in heavy armour, but *can* use Find Traps (but not remove traps) without any penalty (and can do this under Sanctuary, in fact without heavy armour on you can also remove traps under Sanctuary without breaking it). Elven chain (and hide and the +2 rugged leathers) do allow you you use all thieving abilities, but gives penalties to them.

Sanctuary does *not* give a +4 bonus to hit like attacking from invisibility/stealth does (BTW *all* classes get that bonus), nor can you backstab from Sanctuary (but it can help you to safely get in position without risk of losing your natural stealth, also can help you to run away and re-hide safely).

Wowo

Oxford_Guy said:

BTW the best backstab weapon in the game is the Staff of Striking, though you can't get that until quite late. There are +1 staves available very early on, though, and in BGEE there is now a +2 staff in Cloakwoord Druids, though you have to kill someone to get it. Don't forget with 2 handed style you also get bonuses to damage, speed and double critical hit chance too.

Draw Upon Holy might is also great for backstabs.

BTW are you playing a gnome or a half-orc? I prefer the former for the thieving bonuses and con-based bonuses to saves vs. spell.

NB: you can't use *most* thieving abilities in heavy armour, but *can* use Find Traps (but not remove traps) without any penalty (and can do this under Sanctuary, in fact without heavy armour on you can also remove traps under Sanctuary without breaking it). Elven chain (and hide and the +2 rugged leathers) do allow you you use all thieving abilities, but gives penalties to them.

Sanctuary does *not* give a +4 bonus to hit like attacking from invisibility/stealth does (BTW *all* classes get that bonus), nor can you backstab from Sanctuary (but it can help you to safely get in position without risk of losing your natural stealth, also can help you to run away and re-hide safely).

Gnome all the way. +3 staff is available for purchase at Ulgoth's Beard.

I tried a dual priest of helm/thief recently but didn't get far before dying.

Oxford_Guy

Wowo said:

Oxford_Guy said:

BTW the best backstab weapon in the game is the Staff of Striking, though you can't get that until quite late. There are +1 staves available very early on, though, and in BGEE there is now a +2 staff in Cloakwoord Druids, though you have to kill someone to get it. Don't forget with 2 handed style you also get bonuses to damage, speed and double critical hit chance too.

Draw Upon Holy might is also great for backstabs.

BTW are you playing a gnome or a half-orc? I prefer the former for the thieving bonuses and con-based bonuses to saves vs. spell.

NB: you can't use *most* thieving abilities in heavy armour, but *can* use Find Traps (but not remove traps) without any penalty (and can do this under Sanctuary, in fact without heavy armour on you can also remove traps under Sanctuary without breaking it). Elven chain (and hide and the +2 rugged leathers) do allow you you use all thieving abilities, but gives penalties to them.

Sanctuary does *not* give a +4 bonus to hit like attacking from invisibility/stealth does (BTW *all* classes get that bonus), nor can you backstab from Sanctuary (but it can help you to safely get in position without risk of losing your natural stealth, also can help you to run away and re-hide safely).

Gnome all the way. +3 staff is available for purchase at Ulgoth's Beard.

I tried a dual priest of helm/thief recently but didn't get far before dying.

A Gnome Cleric/Thief is pretty awesome, I prefer this to the Half-Orc version, okay you can't have 19 starting strength and only 17 Wis, but half-orcs don't get the shorty con-based spell save bonuses, nor the 40 points of thieving skill bonuses Gnomes get. The only thing that stopped me playing gnomes in the original BG2/BGT etc. were the aweful gnome avatars and paperdolls, but these are much improved in BGEE, especially the female ones.

neleothesze

Valen said:

2. I wouldn't say so. Honestly I don't know how you backstab with a blunt weapon but that's not for me to judge haha.

@Valen Imagine your worst enemy. Imagine being invisible behind him. Now imagine swinging a staff at least as thick as a broom shaft and having it connect with his spine with a satisfying crack.

damageX5



A puny dagger can't break a man's spine in two... but I guess it's more of a backcrunch or backcrack :P