Ability Score Prerequisites - Removal?

Wierdoom

I've been analyzing the rules that currently exist in BG before making an attempt to mod the game to tweak certain things to be more to my liking recently, and the ability score prerequisites for classes caught my eye. As far as I can see they don't really do much mechanically considering ability scores are determined after a class is picked and that they can be rerolled as many times as desired. Thus, I see no reason to keep them. Would there be any potential repercussions in regards to balance if I strip out the prerequisites from all classes, or would it be relatively safe to do?

Kilivitz

It depends on the class, really.

For example, I'm not sure what having a low CHA would do to a Paladin (in gameplay/mechanical terms, at least), but a Mage's intelligence determines not only how many spells he can learn (and how easy/hard it is to do so), but also what's the maximum spell level he can access.

So to take it as an example, if you go ahead and drop the INT requirement for Mages, you open up the possibility for a completely gimped character. Unless you go and also remove those requirements, but then you'd be making INT obsolete as a stat.

I think the same could be said about Clerics, but I'm not sure about how a very low WIS affects their spellcasting other than not giving out any bonus spells per day.

Jalily

You also need 9+ Int to use scrolls and wands.

IkMarc

Would there be any advantage on removing them might be an initial question?

Wierdoom

The main reason why I'm considering removing them is mostly because it limits the potential amount of different ability score arrays you can have severely. You aren't able to play weird and contradictory characters for no apparent reason assuming you want them to be modeled accurately using both the mechanics and your own ability to roleplay in-game.

lunar

I find the requirement of 9 INT to use scrolls and wands somewhat unnecesary, as any mage or bard created will have 9+ INT off the start. You can not create a 8 INT mage or bard.

Umm, it only counts for protection scrolls which everyone can read, they require 9 INT and Minsc can not read them. (so anything below 9 INT is illiterate?) Also Yeslick is somewhat slow-witted too, so he can not use cleric scrolls/wand of the heavens? Or in BG2, a thief with UAI but with 6 INT won't be able to use any scrolls at all, which is a shame as if played right, using scrolls is a great boost for thieves actually. (Mislead scrolls FTW!)

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Kilivitz

lunar said:

I find the requirement of 9 INT to use scrolls and wands somewhat unnecesary, as any mage or bard created will have 9+ INT off the start. You can not create a 8 INT mage or bard.

The reason why you can't create an 8 INT mage or bard is exactly because 9 is the minimum required to use certain scrolls and wands. Or cast spells. You have to admit that the game allowing you to create characters unable to perform in their own class would be at best a FU to new players and at worst, just broken.

lunar said:

Umm, it only counts for protection scrolls which everyone can read, they require 9 INT and Minsc can not read them. (so anything below 9 INT is illiterate?)

Not necessarily, but being able to read doesn't automatically make you able to fully understand or correctly interpret the information. Specially when it's magical writings.

lunar said:

Also Yeslick is somewhat slow-witted too, so he can not use cleric scrolls/wand of the heavens? Or in BG2, a thief with UAI but with 6 INT won't be able to use any scrolls at all, which is a shame as if played right, using scrolls is a great boost for thieves actually. (Mislead scrolls FTW!)

That's the price of being slow-witted. The game wouldn't be as fun if characters never had shortcomings and were awesome at everything all the time, don't you agree?

atcDave

The idea of removing the score requirements for SOME classes could be interesting. Especially say fighter, it could open up possibilities of smaller folks as fighters. But mainly in a PNP game if your thinking of something odd like a Brownie fighter; since BG doesn't allow such things its a less useful thing to play around with.

I think removing the restrictions do make the penalties for low scores even more important; so you may have a fighter with a 6 strength who can only wear leather armor, use a buckler, and wield a club and sling. Talk about a gimped character! Might be fun to try...

But for most classes it makes no sense. A wizard or cleric I think would need at least a 9 in their prime requisite to even finish training. I mean, if the wizard can't even read magic writing he'll never learn to work magic!
Ideally I'd like to see scores and their modifiers made more important to the game, not less so. And since BG lets you choose your class before you roll the dice it really isn't a limiting factor for anyone.

I understand the OP wants to play around with some contrary characters, I can imagine that being fun. But I think you can change such things in Shadow Keeper, much easier than messing with the game itself.

karnor00

In P&P you would normally roll your stats first and then decide on what class you want to be. Your choice of class will be limited to those classes that you qualify for. It can be quite difficult to qualify for some of the subclasses.

In practice this approach only really works to a certain extent - and for very purist games. Most times, if a player really wanted to play a mage (for example) but only rolled a 7 for intelligence then the DM would typically find some way of jiggling the stats around so that the player was able to play a mage. At least that was the case for my games. On the other hand if I really wanted to play a class that is difficult to get the stats for (e.g. paladin) then I was just out of luck unless my stats were really close to the requirements.

The strict P&P approach wouldn't work very well for BG either, because I think most people generally decide what class they want to play ahead of starting. And if you want to play a ranged, but the game only gives you options of mage or thief, you won't be very happy.

At the end of the day, there's Shadowkeeper for those that want to mess around with their stats. So I don't think this is a feature that needs to be added to the default game.