Building an evil party

Necroblivion

Okay, so I am thinking about starting another evil playthrough... the thing is I am not sure how I wish to go about with it this time.

I am thinking about including Tiax this time, though I am not sure if it's worth it. Because until I get to him my party is already well refined.

I thought abuot:
Kagain as my main tank
Viconia as my priest
Tiax as rogue
Edwin as wizard

Still not sure what to do with CHARNAME. Maybe add Xzar and make my char a jester :P

What do you guys think?

OzzyBotkins

Kagain
Dorn
Shar teel (dueled to thief
Viconia
CHARNAME (1/2 elf Cleric/mage or Bard Blade )
Edwin or Baeloth

FinneousPJ

Tiax is totally worth it. Make CHARNAME an Assassin (early game thieving can be done with low scores) and take Dorn if you haven't used him before. If you have, take someone else you haven't used.

Nifft

I'll third adding Dorn as a fun addition to an Evil or even Neutral party.

Dorn + Kagain = a strong front-line.

Necroblivion

I used Dorn already.. Maybe I will try Shar teel.. I also want to try Baeloth..

Should I just go 5 men until I get to Tiax?

FinneousPJ

Using 5 members until Tiax sounds good. You will level up faster. If you haven't used Xzar he's pretty decent as a secondary caster. You could also try dualing him to Cleric.

Necroblivion

I used Xzar and Monty before, and I LOVE them! but I want to use evil chars I haven't had the chance to expirience with. I guess it leaves me to use CHARNAME as a rogue or have Imoen until I find Tiax..

FinneousPJ

Shar-Teel is great dualled to a thief if you haven't used her before. But I for one think an assassin evil CHARNAME is brilliant.

Baeloth and Edwin would make a great duo too if you've already used Xzar.

Necroblivion

I love rogues though the problem I have with them is that between the wizards and clerics air strikes and CC and the fighters entering combat I can't really seem to utilise their abilities more then open locks, find traps and shoot with bows.. :S

zur312

Necroblivion said:

Okay, so I am thinking about starting another evil playthrough... the thing is I am not sure how I wish to go about with it this time.

I am thinking about including Tiax this time, though I am not sure if it's worth it. Because until I get to him my party is already well refined.

I thought abuot:
Kagain as my main tank
Viconia as my priest
Tiax as rogue
Edwin as wizard

Still not sure what to do with CHARNAME. Maybe add Xzar and make my char a jester :P

What do you guys think?

remove tiax get montaron as rogue/archer

main char can be anything druid fighter/ilusionist barb bard pal berserker ranger2/cleric berserker2/cleric
anything

Wowo

Necroblivion said:

I love rogues though the problem I have with them is that between the wizards and clerics air strikes and CC and the fighters entering combat I can't really seem to utilise their abilities more then open locks, find traps and shoot with bows.. :S

Grab drizzts scimitar, single weapon style, legacy of the masters and go stealth through a dungeon chunking everything along the way.

Mind you, staff of striking is better but Tiax is set up to use that so let him have it and then you can set both characters stealthing and chunking (cast find traps with Tiax so you don't miss any traps).

Getting ~50 in set traps on both party rogues is great too.

Wowo

Regarding your party I'd tend to feel that Viconia is quite underwhelming as a character. Xzar, Tiax, charname or Feldorn make better evil party healers.

Not sure if Feldorn leaves at low rep though despite being a shadow Druid ...

kamuizin

Well @Necroblivion, so the stakes are:

Evil party with:

- Kagain (fighter)
- Viconia (Cleric)
- Tiax (cleric/thief)
- Edwin (wizard)

My 2 cents on this (if you didn't already started the adventure) are:

install SCS mod. If you don't like it, install only the "replace old NPCs in the game tool", so Tiax will be moved to Beregost.

EE keeper Kagain into a Dwarven Defender, i did it and it's pretty amazing. You gonna need to edit his abilities to match his previous levels (even if you got him at level 1), any kit given by EE keeper will function as if any previous level gained wasn't come from the kit, so a lvl 1 Kagain will not receive the first defensive stance skill (so you need to manually give that to him).

Just go into abilities -> give abilities -> kit abilities -> Dwarven Defender (set the kit abilities there to the same level that your Kagain is atm), then it's done (if more than 5 you need to manually give him 5 resistance to crushing/piercing/missile/slashing as well).

I also approve @FinneousPJ suggestion for an rogue (assassin maybe), or at least take another thief with you, cos mult-class thief in BG will have to focus in lockpick + detect trap or hide in shadows + move silently. In fact if you don't need an stealthy character, keep Tiax only then.

Dorn is a nice suggestion, but also is Shar-Teel if EE keeped to berserker, as eldoth, montaron and xzar need 2 slots and you only have 1 now, so apparently you have only 2 hard melees to choose to fit the last slot. You can go for faldorn, she approve more evil than good behavior even being true neutral.

I also dare to suggest an evil archer main char, in Bishop (NWN2) style. Just make an archer and make sure you get the helmet of opposing alignment (fallen archers only lost spell capacity if i'm not wrong).

elminster

Wowo said:

Regarding your party I'd tend to feel that Viconia is quite underwhelming as a character. Xzar, Tiax, charname or Feldorn make better evil party healers.

Not sure if Feldorn leaves at low rep though despite being a shadow Druid ...

Its Faldorn and healing is kind of underpowered in BG1 given its casting times and the amount healed. The best healing spell you can get has a casting time of 8 and only heals 27 health, and that is only with Faldorn. You are better off doing other things with the clerics/druids.

Wowo

@kamuizin so will Feldorn leave at 1-2 rep? I endorse the message of an evil archer but suggest archer theme rather than archer class. Starting out as an Assassin and then dualing to fighter can give Grandmastery in your preferred weapon (say, bows) and the extra attack from fighter 7 making this build the pinnacle of ranged combat for BG1.

If you don't dual until 5 or 6 assassin then you can get a decent score in 1 or 2 skills, 2 uses of poison weapon and x3 backstab and perhaps respec into melee for BG2 (5 assassin/8 fighter can get Bow*****, Staff**, THF'ing* with 195 points into the 2 stealth skills for instance).

kamuizin

I believe she does @Wowo , she get happier as the reputation of the party drop, that's vanilla, but probally the engine is set to make neutral NPCs leave when reputation hit 1 (as good NPCs leave when reputation hit 1 or 2). But when that will happen is linked to Charisma.

But as i always have my game modded i don't worry so much about this, i always make neutral NPCs to not be affected by the reputation of the party (in terms of leaving the party i mean).

Necroblivion

kamuizin said:

Well @Necroblivion, so the stakes are:

Evil party with:

- Kagain (fighter)
- Viconia (Cleric)
- Tiax (cleric/thief)
- Edwin (wizard)

My 2 cents on this (if you didn't already started the adventure) are:

install SCS mod. If you don't like it, install only the "replace old NPCs in the game tool", so Tiax will be moved to Beregost.

EE keeper Kagain into a Dwarven Defender, i did it and it's pretty amazing. You gonna need to edit his abilities to match his previous levels (even if you got him at level 1), any kit given by EE keeper will function as if any previous level gained wasn't come from the kit, so a lvl 1 Kagain will not receive the first defensive stance skill (so you need to manually give that to him).

Just go into abilities -> give abilities -> kit abilities -> Dwarven Defender (set the kit abilities there to the same level that your Kagain is atm), then it's done (if more than 5 you need to manually give him 5 resistance to crushing/piercing/missile/slashing as well).

I also approve @FinneousPJ suggestion for an rogue (assassin maybe), or at least take another thief with you, cos mult-class thief in BG will have to focus in lockpick + detect trap or hide in shadows + move silently. In fact if you don't need an stealthy character, keep Tiax only then.

Dorn is a nice suggestion, but also is Shar-Teel if EE keeped to berserker, as eldoth, montaron and xzar need 2 slots and you only have 1 now, so apparently you have only 2 hard melees to choose to fit the last slot. You can go for faldorn, she approve more evil than good behavior even being true neutral.

I also dare to suggest an evil archer main char, in Bishop (NWN2) style. Just make an archer and make sure you get the helmet of opposing alignment (fallen archers only lost spell capacity if i'm not wrong).

Thanks a lot! those are great ideas! even though I kinda hate Kagain when I think about it.... I think I will go:

Viconia - Cleric
Xzar - Arcane
Monty - Front line
Tiax - Helping Monty with thieving and support caster
Edwin - OP Arcane

Now my question is, how good is shadowdancer? HiPSing in the middle of combat sounds really cool to me and means I can open on enemies more then once in combat..

Also with both Monty and Tiax I don't have to be a rogue anymore and I can go Blackguard or whatever else that I want..

FinneousPJ

Shadowdancer is great but I think it's still bugged. Doesn't matter though, HiPS and backstabs are all you need to finish the game. Solo.

kamuizin

I believe the shadowdancer kit is bugged still, i don't know much of the issue though, so maybe another member of the forum will be better able to help you with this.

Necroblivion

What is the bug?

kamuizin

Apparently there are many bugs:

http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/16394/bug-shadow-dancers-bugs


There also a mod released to fix those bugs unnoficialy if you want to play one badly, i do not use this mod so i can't vote for it (if it works well or not).

http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/17862/tresset-s-shadowdancer-bugfixes-important-update

Necroblivion

Oh I see.. I might go assassin then.. a sneaky party with no main fighter kinda sounds awesome to me..

kamuizin

Gonna be hard, specially in the though fights (Demon knight, Aec'Lerc Demon and Sarevok). But with intelligence you can go far with this party, with 2 wizards you can use them in stoneskin+mirror immage to take the role of tanks (fireshield spells gonna rock also in this combo).

Divide your 2° level spells between mirror image and invisibility (so monty can go sneaky also and your main char got able to backstab more than once into a fight, or at least without needing to send him far to get invisible again). With 2 wizards that will not be too hard.

Remember that exist 2 rings of wizardry in the game ( double 1° level spells capacity), one into a rock, near a tree in the south part of Friendly Inn Army (use the "tab" button to spot the slot, cos it's hard to see it. it's in the x 2555 y 3759 coordinates if an old walkthrough is not wrong. The other ring is found in the south west baldur's Gate area, near the inn where Phalydian is (an paladin that attack any evil party member). It's inside a house with an mage (that will attack you no matter what for invading his house).

FinneousPJ

I think it's a great choice.

Necroblivion

kamuizin said:

Gonna be hard, specially in the though fights (Demon knight, Aec'Lerc Demon and Sarevok). But with intelligence you can go far with this party, with 2 wizards you can use them in stoneskin+mirror immage to take the role of tanks (fireshield spells gonna rock also in this combo).

Divide your 2° level spells between mirror image and invisibility (so monty can go sneaky also and your main char got able to backstab more than once into a fight, or at least without needing to send him far to get invisible again). With 2 wizards that will not be too hard.

Remember that exist 2 rings of wizardry in the game ( double 1° level spells capacity), one into a rock, near a tree in the south part of Friendly Inn Army (use the "tab" button to spot the slot, cos it's hard to see it. it's in the x 2555 y 3759 coordinates if an old walkthrough is not wrong. The other ring is found in the south west baldur's Gate area, near the inn where Phalydian is (an paladin that attack any evil party member). It's inside a house with an mage (that will attack you no matter what for invading his house).

The demons will be hard. But, last time I played a rogue I backstabed Sarevok to Near Death, with assassin it will even be more powerful.

The theme of this party seems to be madness, Edwin is megalomaniac, Xzar and Tiax are just basket cases, Monty is blood thirsty, violent psychopath, and Viconia is paranoid (is hunted by everything on the surface) and with a female domination fetish. How does CHARNAME enters here? should I dual him from assassin to something else after a while? maybe a cleric of Cyric or Loviatar? Or maybe I can start him as wild mage, and at some point switch to rogue and only memorise this 1st level wild magic spell that allows you to cast any other spell in the spell book?

kamuizin

Well, as you defined:

Edwin
Xzar
Montaron
Tiax
Viconia

An tanker can be pretty well welcomed in this party, but main char involve too much personal taste. From a functional view point, an Dwarven Defender main char can fill well the role of tanker here, also barbarian or berserker can do the same.

If you want a rogue class and do not mind open hand of backstab go for swashbuckler, they can become pretty strong fighters and you can make them human, so you can later dual to mage, but you already have 2 clerics and 2 mages, so it's not a wise choice (unless you have the old BG2 and intend to import your character there after finish this run).

But in the last moment, think that your choice must be of a character that will amuse you enough to run an entire BG saga with that character.