Request of Favored Soul as an kit
kamuizin
Member Posts: 3,704
ATTENTION: THIS ISN'T AN MOD, IT'S AN FEATURE REQUEST (but if someone want to mod the idea, i have no qualms neither i request credit for it).
One nice class/kit that exist, one that would fit very well in Baldur's Gate is the Favored Soul. An resume of the kit bases in game plataform use can be found here (NWN2).
A link for the digital complete divine book, that officialy list the Favored Soul can be found here (and a player handbook digital copy can also be found here).
Favored Soul work with divine magic very alike an sorcerer work with arcane magic. They're natural with divine magic, what means they have the Spontaneous Spellcasting feature.
It's a valid class that can fit the story better than many other avaliable classes.
Favored souls in 3.5Ed have tons of advantages, so the class would need some reviews to be adapted in BG.
Some Advantages:
-High bonus in saving throws
-Spontaneous spellcasting (sorcerer style)
-d8 for hit points (same as cleric)
- medium Thac0 progression (or BAB as it's called in 3.5Ed) which should put favored souls in the cleric table thac0 progression.
-charisma as main atribute.
-elemental/magica damage resistance at each 5 levels. In 3.5Ed you would choose which energy kind to resist, but as this is impossible to implement here, they should get an 10% elemental and magic damage reduction by each 5 levels (or less maybe). Just to note they don't get magic resistance, but only magic damage reduction.
-Cold iron or alchemical silver resistance at lvl 20, what could be turned in physical resistance only.
-Proficience with the deity favored weapon (an raw idea below)
Some disadvantage:
-Limited spell choices, as the sorcerer, the favored soul pick an select amount of spells to her divine list.
-Low skill points, that would have to be turned in penality for weapon proficience and maybe in spell choices, giving an limit to maximum spells know as dragon disciple sorcerer have in BG.
-low mobility, that can be represented as an penality to dexterity.
So, based on these points, to implement this class on BG i would suggest:
Bases:
XP, proficience, Thac0, hit dice, APR of Cleric Table OR Thac0 progression using Thief/Bard Table (suggested by @ZanathKariashi)
Features (advantages):
- Spontaneous spellcasting
- +1 bonus to saving throw at each 6 levels OR +3 saving throw bonus at character creation (suggested by @ZanathKariashi) OR no saving throw bonus (for overpower control)
- 10% elemental and magic damage resistance at each 5 levels, stopping progression at 15° level.
- 10% physical damage resistance at level 20 OR immunity to normal weapons and 5% physical damage resistance (suggested by @ZanathKariashi)
- Receive 1 proficiency point (1 slot) at level 3 in the favored weapon of his god (alignment) OR in dagger (bhaal favored weapon) or another permanent weapon choice for the class (if assumed that Bhaal essence is taken as the power suply of this class, suggested by @Draith012)
- Receive 1 specialization point (2 slots) at level 12 in the favored weapon of his god (alignment) OR in the set weapon to be defined as favored for FS. (edited, based in Complete Divine page 10)
- Main atribute: Charisma. (edited, based in Complete Divine page 8)
Features (disadvantage):
- Spell progression for new divine circles always 1 level lower than a priest. (Ex: 2° circle spell (cleric 3/FS 4), 3° circle spell (cleric 5/FS 6), 4° circle spell (cleric 7/FS 8)...)
- Receive ONLY 1 proficiency point to distribute at character creation. This kit doesn't progress in proficiency points anymore except for the bonus proficiency for the deity weapon of choice (suggestion from @ZanathKariashi) OR use mage proficiency table progression.
- Maximum of 4-6 spells know spells per level (FS in the Complete Divine, in 3.5Ed, are limited to a maximum of 6 know spells per level even there). maximum of 3 suggested by @ZanathKariashi
- HLAs limited to 1-3 (based on suggestion of @ZanathKariashi) AND MAYBE included on the 7° spell limit of know spells.
- Penality of -2 on dexterity (or more, or less... to simulate the movement penality feature and give the kit some balance)
- Restricted to cleric weapons except for the favored weapon (determined by alignment).
- minimum of 15 in charisma (this is an advantage in fact, in reason of engine limitations, this will make the dice roll always higher than normal).
- Cannot Dual-Class.
- Restricted to Neutral or Good alignments AND/OR cannot be lawful AND/OR cannot be neutral (this isn't officialy cannon, but the Complete Divine book, at page 7).
- Cannot wear any armor heavier than splint mail. Suggestion from @ZanathKariashi.
- Cannot turn undead (Suggested by @Draith012, i'm against it but it's an reasonable power balance)
What you guys think?
Ps: Spirit Shaman (Complete Divine page 14) are nice also, but they wouldn't fit well in BG saga, i think.
One nice class/kit that exist, one that would fit very well in Baldur's Gate is the Favored Soul. An resume of the kit bases in game plataform use can be found here (NWN2).
A link for the digital complete divine book, that officialy list the Favored Soul can be found here (and a player handbook digital copy can also be found here).
Favored Soul work with divine magic very alike an sorcerer work with arcane magic. They're natural with divine magic, what means they have the Spontaneous Spellcasting feature.
It's a valid class that can fit the story better than many other avaliable classes.
Favored souls in 3.5Ed have tons of advantages, so the class would need some reviews to be adapted in BG.
Some Advantages:
-High bonus in saving throws
-Spontaneous spellcasting (sorcerer style)
-d8 for hit points (same as cleric)
- medium Thac0 progression (or BAB as it's called in 3.5Ed) which should put favored souls in the cleric table thac0 progression.
-charisma as main atribute.
-elemental/magica damage resistance at each 5 levels. In 3.5Ed you would choose which energy kind to resist, but as this is impossible to implement here, they should get an 10% elemental and magic damage reduction by each 5 levels (or less maybe). Just to note they don't get magic resistance, but only magic damage reduction.
-Cold iron or alchemical silver resistance at lvl 20, what could be turned in physical resistance only.
-Proficience with the deity favored weapon (an raw idea below)
Some disadvantage:
-Limited spell choices, as the sorcerer, the favored soul pick an select amount of spells to her divine list.
-Low skill points, that would have to be turned in penality for weapon proficience and maybe in spell choices, giving an limit to maximum spells know as dragon disciple sorcerer have in BG.
-low mobility, that can be represented as an penality to dexterity.
So, based on these points, to implement this class on BG i would suggest:
Bases:
XP, proficience, Thac0, hit dice, APR of Cleric Table OR Thac0 progression using Thief/Bard Table (suggested by @ZanathKariashi)
Features (advantages):
- Spontaneous spellcasting
- +1 bonus to saving throw at each 6 levels OR +3 saving throw bonus at character creation (suggested by @ZanathKariashi) OR no saving throw bonus (for overpower control)
- 10% elemental and magic damage resistance at each 5 levels, stopping progression at 15° level.
- 10% physical damage resistance at level 20 OR immunity to normal weapons and 5% physical damage resistance (suggested by @ZanathKariashi)
- Receive 1 proficiency point (1 slot) at level 3 in the favored weapon of his god (alignment) OR in dagger (bhaal favored weapon) or another permanent weapon choice for the class (if assumed that Bhaal essence is taken as the power suply of this class, suggested by @Draith012)
- Receive 1 specialization point (2 slots) at level 12 in the favored weapon of his god (alignment) OR in the set weapon to be defined as favored for FS. (edited, based in Complete Divine page 10)
- Main atribute: Charisma. (edited, based in Complete Divine page 8)
Features (disadvantage):
- Spell progression for new divine circles always 1 level lower than a priest. (Ex: 2° circle spell (cleric 3/FS 4), 3° circle spell (cleric 5/FS 6), 4° circle spell (cleric 7/FS 8)...)
- Receive ONLY 1 proficiency point to distribute at character creation. This kit doesn't progress in proficiency points anymore except for the bonus proficiency for the deity weapon of choice (suggestion from @ZanathKariashi) OR use mage proficiency table progression.
- Maximum of 4-6 spells know spells per level (FS in the Complete Divine, in 3.5Ed, are limited to a maximum of 6 know spells per level even there). maximum of 3 suggested by @ZanathKariashi
- HLAs limited to 1-3 (based on suggestion of @ZanathKariashi) AND MAYBE included on the 7° spell limit of know spells.
- Penality of -2 on dexterity (or more, or less... to simulate the movement penality feature and give the kit some balance)
- Restricted to cleric weapons except for the favored weapon (determined by alignment).
- minimum of 15 in charisma (this is an advantage in fact, in reason of engine limitations, this will make the dice roll always higher than normal).
- Cannot Dual-Class.
- Restricted to Neutral or Good alignments AND/OR cannot be lawful AND/OR cannot be neutral (this isn't officialy cannon, but the Complete Divine book, at page 7).
- Cannot wear any armor heavier than splint mail. Suggestion from @ZanathKariashi.
- Cannot turn undead (Suggested by @Draith012, i'm against it but it's an reasonable power balance)
What you guys think?
Ps: Spirit Shaman (Complete Divine page 14) are nice also, but they wouldn't fit well in BG saga, i think.
Post edited by kamuizin on
8
Comments
So first the developers would have to tackle the challenge of externalising the Spell Selection menu, then they could create a Divine Sorcerer kit. Even though this is a kit request, it's tied into a feature request because of the hardcoded limits of the Spell Selection menu.
So... no mod possibility, at least. Unless we can make the divine spells to be used as arcane spells, but that would need to make an specific control of each divine spell in the game.
Convert all divine spells to make arcane copies of them, set the strings on the favored soul character so the engine when checking for armor (that would block the use of arcane spells) would register any armor on main char to have elven chainmail properties, then reorganize the converted divine spells into the first 7 levels of arcane spell.
But, if possible, i would like to see this official and properly implemented.
If so, then converting the Divine Spells into arcane versions is only step 1. Step 2 would be to make them selectable via the Sorcerer spell selection menu. And to do that would be make the Spell Selection menu work like a HLA menu, where each kit would have their own unique .2da table file that lists all the spells. So changes to the Spell Selection menu would be confined to each kit. You need the class infrastructure sorted first before you can add in the divine spells.
Step 1 is a piece or cake for modders, it's step 2 that is the most valuable step and is currently impossible due to hard coding. Once they get around to externalizing that, then can we have some unique sorcerer kits with their own spell list. It's the reason why we haven't seen any overly ambitious Sorcerer kits released, we're pretty much stuck with the default list of spells for now.
Ah well, thats my gripe about 3ED done. It would be nice to see a cleric style sorceror implemented in the game, but I suspect it's probably overly difficult for the reasons Mordeus mentioned.
Just take spells you know you'll need, and fill up the rest with inflicts or heals, depending on whether you channel holy or unholy, respectively.
And Favored souls have TWO prime casting requisites...one for the highest level they can cast, another for determining save bonuses, and averaging both to get the value you check to see how many extra spell slots they get).
An cleric of Good Alignment can convert any spell to a cure relative of the same level.
Any cleric of Evil alignment can convert any spell to a harm relative of the same level.
Neutral Clerics can convert to cure/harm if i'm not wrong.
Any druid can convert any spell to a summon animal relative spell of the same level.
So it's not like you can simple trade an spell for whatever you want.
No specific rule of 3.5Ed will perdure anyway, the intent here is to convert every 3.5Ed rule of the class to 2° edition.
Besides, favored souls are more than spontaneous spellcasters as displaced in the OP.
Yeah, no...there's no real way to make this work without being stupidly overpowered. Clerics don't get many useful spells as it is, so even 4 per level is WAY too many...and other then that, they're a cleric with no disadvantages at all.
Lets see.......in an attempt to at least try...
Levels up on fighter xp table
d8
Uses the rogue thac0 table
Uses the cleric save table
Requires 14 wisdom, 17 charisma
Uses Wisdom to determine bonus spell slots.
Advantages-
+3 all saves at creation.
Lvl 1: Gains a special version of the Enchanted Weapon spell, usable once per day (additional uses at 10 and 20). This weapon has no proficiency type and can only be wielded by favored souls. It can be a Longsword, Mace, spear, 2hded sword, Axe, or hammer, and lasts for 8 hours. Every 5 levels the weapon's enhancement bonus increases by +1 to a maximum of +5 at 25. (it has no bonus before level 5, but is considered magical as well as silver/cold iron). At lvl 12, the summoned weapon also grants +1 hit, +2 damage, and +1 bonus attacks, in addition to other bonuses (only one instance of the spell can be active at a time, casting it again before the previous weapon expires will remove the older weapon).
Doesn't require memorizing of spells.
Gains 5% resistance to Fire/Cold/electricity damage every 5 levels, to a max of 20%
Gains +5% magic damage resistance per 10 levels, maximum of 10% at 20.
Can cast a self only version of Improved haste once per day at lvl 17
Gains immunity to normal weapons at lvl 20. 5% physical damage resistance.
Disadvantages -
Cannot wear armor with a base AC better then 5 (chainmail).
Only gets a single HLA pick.
Gains only 3 known spells per spell level and their spell progression is always 1 level behind a clerics.
Gains proficiency points by the Wizard table.
Cannot turn undead
Cannot dual or multiclass
Sadly most of these disadvantages disappear at higher levels, and you end up with a F/C with fewer attacks per round, but is otherwise pretty much full strength......but that's the best I could come up with while trying to keep the flavor.
Spontaneous casters always have 1 level penality to reach new spell levels (as sorcerers to wizards), so with the spontaneous caster ability, this disvantage is already included.
The other disvantages don't fit well with the class. Armor limit isn't proper as Favored Soul are aknowledge as heavy armor warriors. Decent BAB (Thac0 in 2ed) progression is an advantage of the class.
Cannot Turn undead do not fit well in terms of roleplay disvantage. Favored Souls, more than a cleric, have an even deeper link with their good, their turn undead shouldn't be inexistent but stronger. However as this isn't an official class feature by WotC standards, let's just not change it.
Some HLAs, to power control could be removed (or limit the HLAs to 3 or 4 as the spell limit suggested), but i don't see a reason for it in roleplay terms.
Just to remember Favored Soul does not receive magic resistance but rather magic damage resistance, that meant they do not avoid an magical effect by resisting it, but any damage dealt by magic means will always be reduced by an %.
I disagree with the use of wisdom to determine spell numbers, i would rather prefer an charisma stat to define spell number for 2 reasons:
1° - Charisma is the main stats of this class by official lore.
2° - We have 3 wis books in the game, we can receive 2 wis points in the Hell Tear of Bhaal and 1 point with the machine of the Lum, what sum an possible total of 24 wisdom with any race.
So, if you don't mind i will work the ideas you brought @ZanathKariashi and i'm going to edit the OP with them, i liked some of the ideas (due credit will be defered).
From the vanilla source (hiperlink in the OP) favored souls are the personification of Tank, high AC, medium attack capacity and spellcaster.
I agree with what was said earlier that Wisdom should determine spell bonuses. Even though you argue that Wisdom can get ridiculously high later on, this options was always open to clerics to begin with. Rangers and Paladins still rely on Wisdom for their spells, even though its not their prime attribute so there's no reason to restrict FS to Charisma simply because they feel Sorcerer-like. If it was the case, then they shouldn't get any bonus spells just like all other arcane wielders. Plus, this is 2nd edition now, not 3rd. Even though they were dependent on Charisma in the other edition, you still must conform the class TO 2nd, not 2nd to the class.
And on that topic, look at how Shadow Dancer was conformed to fit game balance for 2nd edition. We know it as a prestige class but the concept is completely misplace in 2nd edition. To compensate for it's obvious advantages, the Shadow Dancer took a considerable hit to it's thieving skill points per level. There's obvious advantages to Favor Soul, but the disadvantages are easily mitigated. I don't understand this low mobility idea you propose. Are you talking about the low mobility due to donning heavy armor? If it's a built in disability to the class, then lowing the FS movement speed (much like how Barbarians move faster). The only other ability that clerics get that can be compromised for the sake of balance is the Turn Undead ability.
The skill penalty is hard to transfer due to the lack of the NCP system. And penalizing their weapon profs doesn't really make a lot of sense, since a cleric really only needs one or two weapon types anyway. I originally was going to suggest not giving them any additional points...but it wouldn't really matter in the long run they really only need 2 prof points anyway.
Another idea was allowing them access to all weapons a fighter could use, but only giving them 3 total proficiency points to work with at creation and never getting anymore, and allowing them to gain up to ** in a weapon plus 1 more type, if they desired or spreading them out to 3 weapon types.
Sorcerers are only 1 level behind up to 5th in BG, for 6th and above they gain the new spells levels the same as mages (was complaining about this in an older thread concerning overhauling the Arcane spellcasting system in general).
Skip's preview to fails mention the dual Attributes in the class preview, due to it being revised before the new Complete Divine was released. NWN2, and all other sources, including it's official book (Complete Divine 3.5) mention it's dual-casting stat dependency as one of it's balancing factors (though I hadn't read it in a while and got them backwards. Charisma determines the highest castable spell, while wisdom determines save penalties, though they're still averaged to get bonus spells per day).
As far as XP goes, they definitely need to level more slowly then a cleric (was being very generous giving them a Fighter XP tree...paladin or even mage would likely be even more balanced). As mentioned, clerics get few spells worth casting making even a ludicrously small sample of 3 more then enough to cover their important spells (Command, Doom, AoF. DUHM, Silence 15", maybe Aid. Cure Moderate wounds, dispel, Animate dead or Holy Smite. Holy Power, NPP or Death Ward, Lesser restoration. Chaotic Commands, Righteous Magic, Slay Living or True Seeing. Bolt of Glory, Harm, Heal. Shield of Archons, Finger of Death, Sunray or Holy word. And assuming only 1 HLA Deva/Fallen Deva which is basically a 25th level cleric in your pocket or Globe of blades for dramatically increasing damage dealt while meleeing) , and turning is more of luxury for most of the game and so isn't really missed.
Unlike a sorcerer, the Favored Soul can cast while wearing armor and shields, and gets a bunch of built-in bonuses, and is pretty much a F/C as a single class but without sacrificing hardly anything at all for it.
(Even in PnP it's heavily criticized as being broken and more suited as a prestige class then a base class).
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/cwc/20051206a
It's a link to Wizard of the Coast official article of the favored soul class. There, it's explained the advantages, disvantages and specific features of this class.
http://www.aegisoft.be/costa/data/roleplay/D&D 3.5 - Players Handbook [OEF].pdf
It's a link to a digital copy of the official player handbook (3.5Ed)
http://merung.net/DandD3.5/3.5 D&D Books/Complete Divine.pdf
It's a link to a digital copy of the official complete D&D divine book of David Noonan.
(Favored soul in page 6)
So @Draith012, the following answers i give, are based on these sources. It's a Class in 3.5Ed, but then, there everything is a class, you have thief as a class, swashbuckler as an fight class, Assassin as an prestige class, Shadow Dancer as an prestige class. The best way to fit Favored Souls in this game by roleplay and pratical point of view, is as an kit for cleric in my view. If the devs. for hard code need, want to send him as an variation kit of Sorcerer, it's their call. Bhaal is dead, therefore he can't favor no one. By another hand, his divine essence in the main char is stronger (this is many times stated in Throne of Bhaal expansion), thus, instead of work the alignment suggestion system given by me, assume that any favored soul from the game has powers comming from bhaal essence can be more simple. Favored weapon dagger (official from dead Bhaal) always, no conflict in alignment changes.
By another hand, tons of deities would like to favor and link themselfs to the very exception of Aluandro's prophecy, the one with an reasonable amount of chance of become a god, an allied god most probally, thus enlarging that deity power or at least giving an great blow to evil (for neutral and good deities) by taking assassination and death from evil portifolio (as Kelemvor did with Myrkul's dead portifolio).
So when i worked the idea, by understand that in infinite engine would be impossible to make what is done in NWN2, give the player an table to choose among tons of gods (unless the devs want to rework an copy of the favored ranger enemies only for this class, if this is even possible), link the favored weapon to alignment fit well to solve the issue. From what i understand in 3.5 Ed, there's no more weapon restriction there for clerics, and now weapon proficiency is divided between 3 proficiences: Simple, Martial and Exotic. However by the use of Feats, you can speciallize further into an weapon of your choice (Weapon focus, weapon specialization, improved weapon critical...).
In 3.5Ed every deity has an Favored weapon, and clerics that choose the war domain, as the Favored Soul, receive the weapon focus Feat in that Weapon (and the weapon proficience: martial feat if that weapon falls into the martial weapon list). Source in players handbook page 31.
An Favored Soul, unlike an cleric receive the weapon focus in his deity favored weapon no matter the domain he choose. At level 3 the favored soul get the weapon focus into his deity favored weapon and at 12 he also receive the weapon specialization focus, which i forgot to add in the OP (gonna edit). Source Complete Divine page 10.
To simulate those features in 2° Ed, where clerics are restricted against slashing and piercing weapons, i suggested for a break in the weapon restrictions for FS when linked to a favored deity weapon (what would be defined by alignment to keep simple, or just to daggers, bhaal favored weapon, to keep even more simple) and of course, when needed.
So when i suggested those points i see reasonable to make them get proficience weapon at lvl 3 (gonna change it in the OP) with the favored weapon and specializtion (2 proficience points) at lvl 12 in that weapon. Complete divine reference, page 8:
Game Rule Information
Favored souls have the following game statistics.
Abilities: Charisma determines how many spells the
favored soul can cast per day. Wisdom determines how
hard the favored soul’s spells are to resist (see Spells, below).
In addition to using Charisma and Wisdom for spellcasting,
a favored soul also benefi ts from high Dexterity, Strength,
and Constitution scores.
Alignment: Any.
Hit Die: d8.
Obs: in the briefing of the class, when the book start to determine the bases of FS, it's spoken that Favored Souls tend to be Good or Neutral and rarely lawful. There's no rule restriction to favored souls and they can be of any alignment, however, by pratical reasons or roleplay, the FS can be restricted to Neutral or Good alignments and/or non-lawful alignments without breaking the rules.
It's an specific 3.5Ed class, and base his spell table in charisma isn't something too hard coded in my view (but then maybe i'm wrong). In the article quoted above (and in the OP) Low mobility is described as:
Low Mobility: A favored soul's reliance on heavy armor makes her a slow mover on the battlefield.
So i thought in make this an dexterity penality (as the dexterity in BG is worked different than PnP, and any reduction on it can be seen as a huge penality). Make a character move slowly eternally will not increase difficult, will only make the game be boring.
I will put your suggestion of "unable to turn undead" into the suggested features (disadvantage) anyway @Draith012 (with proper credit), it's good to consider all points here to not make an overpowered class.
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@ZanathKariashi , your brought some really important points there, and i'm going to make some changes in the OP based on them, even with access to both handbooks that work the class, the questions you raised still stays on the air.
FS in my view is a frontline character, to give them a huge disadvantage in armor use can pretty easy break the entire kit, but the kit is too overpower atm, and will be more even with the change below that i forgot to put into the OP, so splint mail limit is reasonable and will be another class giving use to chain mail armors. Gonna edit in the OP.
I liked your proficience idea and i'm gonna edit the OP with it but with some minor changes, cos FS by official complete divine book, receive an specialization on favored weapon at lvl 12. By compare the 3.5Ed Cleric spell per day progression (player Handbook page 31) with the Favored Soul spell per day (complete divine handbook page 7), the Favored Soul is ALWAYS 1 level behind in spell level than a Cleric.
His first access to any spell level will always happen in an even number higher than the odd number a cleric have to reach to access the same spell circle (but need adaptation, as 3.5Ed make divine spells reach an 8° and nine circle, while 2° ed stop at the 7° divine circle).
Ex: 2° circle spell (cleric 3/FS 4), 3° circle spell (cleric 5/FS 6), 4° circle spell (cleric 7/FS 8)...
Change the XP tree will change too much the kit, and will make it become too far in spell progression in comparison to a cleric, it's to be a similar sorcerer class but a divine spellcaster. IF needed it's better to postpone the achievement of the some (or all) the advantage features than change the XP table.
It's a kit after all and if accepted, it will need to be build based on the Cleric basic class (unless the devs move it as an sorcerer kit, then the sorcerer xp progression will be easier applied and maybe will give a better control of the class).
And I completely forgot it's possible to restrict how points a character can place in weapons at creation. Give them 3 points at creation and the ability to put them into any weapon a fighter can, but limit them to only * in a weapon at creation. They gain no further proficiency points normally from levels. And then at lvl 12 they gain a 4th point that can either be spent in another weapon or to purchase specialization (**) in one of their starting proficiencies.
That's about as close as you're going to get.
- Spell progression for new divine circles always 1 level lower than a priest. (Ex: 2° circle spell (cleric 3/FS 4), 3° circle spell (cleric 5/FS 6), 4° circle spell (cleric 7/FS 8)...)
Maybe cover enough of any overpower issue, i have tons of disvantages quoted there as well now, not to be all implemented, but all possible to be linked to this kit.
When I say did the FS have a clerics weap. pro. I meant as a reference to what is available to the class from start, unaffected by feats. Since we are trying to convert a 3.5 class into 2nd edition rules, many considerations must be taken and harboring 3rd edition rules over 2nd will not work well. After reading the Favor Soul class (cause it's been ages since I read it), I will say this:
As far as weap. pro. go, the class starts off with the same weap. feats as any cleric. Thus, this translate that the 2nd edition FS version should in turn have the same restrictions as any 2nd ed cleric. As a kit to cleric, you can add the extra weapon pro based on deity there, but how you're going to further alternate it between alignment is beyond me. Maybe its a moddable feature, but it sounds like something like that would be modded only in the class aspect and not alignment.
Next, though the class bases its spell powers off of charisma, so too does the sorcerer... in 3rd edition. However, in 2nd edition sorcerers use intelligence as their spell ability even though the concept is that they channel their powers naturally. This, unfortunately, doesn't allow them to use charisma as their arcane source, they too do not escape the 2nd edition rules. Whether you want to make charisma as a prime stat during character creation is up to you, but I still stand by that Wisdom should still dictate how many bonus spells this character gets per day just like how it still dictates it for Rangers and Paladins despite where theirs prime stats are.
In the Divine handbook, it never states that they even get Turn Undead. Why you want to implement it is beyond me. I would consider this a disadvantage to the class considering the advantages it gets upon leveling. Plus in regards to Save Throws, though they get great save throws, I wouldn't go so far as giving them a whole +3 to their saves. That's a bit excessive don't you think? Considering it can be stacked with a halflings natural bonuses as well as a +2 Ring of Protection for a total of +7 to all saves. I would consider giving them no more than +1 to their saves, though it's not like their save throws is a special ability like the 3rd edition paladin's. If you really want them to have a save that reflects the one in the book, then I'd give them the same saves as a monk's 2nd edition progression and with no bonuses due to class.
And it certainly does say that they do not get heavy armor as a proficiency and to argue that they could get it through feats doesn't give thieves the ability to wear chain or better in 2nd edition either. Same goes for martial weapons. There's no point in arguing that their 2nd edition version will limit them to either chain or splint. Which ever is better. This is just an added disadvantage to the class, one that is respectable to the their damage reductions to elements and physical. But this negatible ability by silver/cold iron has no meaning in 2nd edition, other than nonmagical weapons will be reduced by x amount of damage.
I doubt there's any way to implement wings into the game, you can however, reflect his speed to match a winged character, though they'll move about the field like a hasted character, to see them with boots of haste will seem ridiculously fast, unless you want to cap it by not allowing the two abilities to stack...
As you said, good sense will make any converson of FS to 2° edition be bound to Cleric weapon restrictions. How we will open restricted weapons to FS based on alignment with the engine is beiond my knowledfe, if it's even possible, thus i let the more simplier possibility you brought of just elect Bhaal favored weapon (dagger) to any FS and define that any main char will channel his/her power from the Bhaal essence with him directly.
But in fact this isn't a direct proficience distribution, the character get the 1° star at lvl 3 and the 2° at lvl 12, we do not need to unlock that weapon proficience at the character creation (or if the kit gain proficience after x levels, at the level up screen).
So if Lawful Good is set to Bastard Sword favored weapon, at level up to 3, automatic the character gain 1 point of proficiency, at lvl 12, automatic he get another point (specialization) in the bastard sword. It appears to me as possible, but i'm no modder so i don't know.
About sorcerers using inteligence in BG, i always tought of it as some lazy work of the devs, or they just didn't stop at that time to link sorcerer spell cast with charisma (using the already existent strings for mages probally) or maybe was the choice made when they produced BG (and BG2).
If they don't want to use charisma, i have no qualms in using wisdom, our sorcerer class work pretty well in BG/BG2, however this just need to be defined as divine spellcasters receive spell slot bonus from their main attribute. I would prefer to link bonus spell slots to charisma, to keep faithful to the Complete Divine rule book, but better the class get produced with the main attribute in wisdom than not be produced at all. Turn undead in 3.5Ed is a rule, when a class doesn't have access to this feature, it's specifically listed on that class. Unlike 2° edition (or at least unlike baldur's gate), in 3.5 Ed you can't use turn undead at will, you have an set number of uses per day of the ability, pretty much alike any other ability in the game.
In the page 77 of the Complete Divine, is listed the divine feats. ANY divine feat that isn't passive (that have to be activated and have limited uses), use one charge of turn undead to be activated. In other words, you have to spend an charge of your turn undead ability to use divine feats.
The saving throws can be reworked, the +3 was a suggestion of another member, i thought in the begin of an progression of +1 at each 6 levels (but maybe we could give a limit on level 18 to it, or 12).
About the armor limits, i just give voice in the OP to @ZanathKariashi suggestion. I don't agree with it, but it's reasonable and in terms of balance it make some sense. After all all the advantages and disavantages listed there are suggestions, it's not like if this kit become true, that it will have 12 advantages and 12 disavantages, it's there more as an option to with which to work than anything else.
I could give the advantage suggestion similar to a barbarian movment speed (between +2/4 or even more) at level 17. I ignored this feature as NWN2 ignored, but i have nothing against it, do you think some mov speed bonus at lvl 17 is proper to be displayed at the OP?
Anyway thx for the replies, it's an idea that i would like to see being applied and you and other ppl here are giving a nice support in discuss the issues of this kit with me.
It doesn't seem like the FS is particularly set in his own beliefs other than he's the personification of some god. He doesn't follow tradition and chooses what he deems is right or acceptable. This neither dictates good or evil, but I would restrict any lawful and neutral alignments.
I'd drop the low mobility penalty. It's sort of an artificial disadvantage that compounds on the fact that we already restricted heavy armor from him. Now restricting high Dex would make him even less tankable; let having a surplus of healing spells his way to help nullify the AC problem but it'd be pointless if he keeps getting hit and miscasting.
Though it was suggested to use a Thief's THAC0, I would say that he's obviously a cleric and deserves cleric's THAC0. But I don't know if rate of weapon pro. can be modified outside the original chart. Fighters get 1 every 3. Thieves every 4... yata yata. Can you throw in a pro to a particular kit using te chart or can you even attach weapon pros to certain levels?
Would like if Sorcerers were a dualable class... but in regards to that, I wouldn't object further if you really want to make FS undualable.
There is no chart for proficiency gains. The chart just says what bonuses each proficiency point gives. The rate of gain, etc etc, is just a couple lines in the class 2da.
The reason I suggested thief thac0, is that there is no appreciable difference between cleric and thief except at the earliest levels which could at least try to help with adding penalties....let us call that part the mobility penalty.
And after level....10 or so, it would no longer matter as the FS could just keep Holy power up at all times and have thac0 equal to a fighter of their level for the handful of truly high AC enemies.
I suggested a haste or speed bonus for 17 due to the fact they're supposed to grow Wings at 17, which would VASTLY improve their mobility.
About the Thac0 progression, there's an difference between clerics and thiefs at lvl 18 - 20.
Cleric thac0 improves by 2 each 3 levels. Thief thac0 improves by 1 each 2 levels.
But pass by lvl 18, a cleric thac0 reduce further than 10 (the progression for clerics stop at thac0 6 in level 22) while thieves have an end on their thac0 progressions at thac0 10 (level 21 thief).
FS is more propense as a fighter class than even the cleric class is, so i feel a bit uncomfortable in harm their thac0 progression to a thief chart. The buff argument is good, but so a cleric can buff itself. About all the advantages of the kit are related to defense and resistance and they can't be dualed to as the cleric class can, thus not being able to achieve grand master proficiency with an fighter/cleric.
But regardless my opinion i'm going to add this point in the OP, it's a valid point as FS can achieve specialization (2 stars in weapon proficience) being pure class (what a pure cleric class cannot).