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Baldur's Gate 3 on Consoles

BloodmoshenBloodmoshen Member Posts: 3
edited July 2012 in Archive (General Discussion)
With all this excitement for Baldur's Gate, it could be a great time to continue this way with Baldur's Gate 3 for Xbox and Playstation and whatever Wii will do, now or for the next gen consoles.

BG 1 and 2 were the greatest two-player co-op games of all time. A BG2 game (console for PS2) sells for a $100 on ebay. Strategy Guides for either game still sell for $29.99. 5 new BG2 games go for $84.99 each. I pulled these numbers off ebay today. It is crazy good.

Xbox Live or PSN could be the way, forget the discs, sell it for a mint and watch me buy it. And I would not be alone. It could be awesome. I started this post to see if anyone else shares my view...

Do you?

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Comments

  • AdaramAdaram Member Posts: 146
    If there is going to be a BG3, which I think depends largely on the success of #BGEE, I think having them available on Consoles would be awesome (even though I don't play console games myself :) )
  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    Considering that Overhaul would like to focus on isometric RPGs, I think its unlikely that they'll develop BG3 for consoles too.

    The Dark Alliance games were great, but the gameplay was completely different from what you find in BG1 and BG2.

    I'm not saying that BG1 or BG2 couldn't work on consoles (I believe they could even if the control scheme would be inferior due to using a controller), I'm just saying that Overhaul probably isn't planning on it.
  • NeoDragonNeoDragon Member Posts: 169
    Phew ... that's a highly complex topic you're bringing up here ...

    I could be a possibility to generate some funds, but it's definitely not a guaranteed success. It can be pretty risky.

    First of all, it's not sure it would sell well. No one can tell for sure. There are some very prominent examples for totally wrong expectations (Remedy's 'Alan Wake')

    Second, Overhaul Games is a pretty small company (in relation to the 'Big Ones'). I don't think they can afford to bind too much money and manpower to a port that possibly only sells medicore.

    And third, I think (like Adaram) this might depend on the success of BG:EE. If it becomes a huge success *fingers crossed* maybe they'll try. If not, they will probably stick with the PC, the obvious leading platform.
  • BloodmoshenBloodmoshen Member Posts: 3
    Today, on Cooptimus.com, "We really liked Sins of a Solar Empire: Rebellion. And it looks like we weren't alone. Stardock have announced that the game has sold over 100,000 copies via digital distribution channels. The publisher was previously worried that Steam might have cannabalized their direct sales of the game, but instead, saw it only supplement them. Obviously with direct sales Stardock is getting a larger piece of the financial pie, so they wouldn't want to cut into that. Thankfully this looks like an everybody wins situation."

    What is more famous, Baldur's Gate or Sins of a Solar Empire:Rebellion?

    I would say, easily, Baldur's Gate.

    So to address some comments above, if Solar Empire can do it, Baldur's Gate surely should. And if it wanted to as seen on ebay, note the immense popularity of BG on consoles, it looks to me to be encouraging.

    If Adaram (above) is right and if BG should outperform Solar Empire (it should), maybe BG 3 on consoles will eventually arrive and should expect better console numbers than Dungeon Siege 3, a similar game.
  • PhillipDaiglePhillipDaigle Member Posts: 654
    I'm not against the idea of isometric, party based role playing games on console, but I have yet to see a really good interface for it. It's in the same vein as RTS games on console - possible, but so far they've been largely hobbled by control limitations.
  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    edited July 2012
    PhillipDaigle said:

    It's in the same vein as RTS games on console - possible, but so far they've been largely hobbled by control limitations.

    RTS games are the example that I use to think that BG, with its current UI, can work on a console, but the control scheme will be inferior to a mouse.

    I played Command & Conquer Red Alert on my PSX. Was it fun? Yes it was.
    Would a mouse have been better than a controller? Definitely.
  • ShinShin Member Posts: 2,344
    edited July 2012
    Instinctively, I would say no.. experience says that whenever a new game is co-developed on consoles and PC, the PC version tends to end up worse off for it. Simplified menu systems that have to work with controllers, cut content because everything has to fit in a 360's memory (lack of weapon holstering in ME3), assets loading weirdly because 360 games have to be able to run without storing anything on a 360 hdd, etc. Just seems too risky.
  • Talin_SilverbaneTalin_Silverbane Member Posts: 34
    No! The same reason the Elder Scroll is not meant for consoles. One: It screws with the UI design. Two: You can't add mod to consoles. Three: Console versions are always worse than the PC version.
  • LinkamusLinkamus Member Posts: 221
    As long as it gets designed for the PC first without consoles in mind at all, then I don't care.
  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    No modding and inferior versions on consoles, at most, is a reason to buy the PC version instead, not a reason for games to not be released on consoles too.

    As for UI designs being screwed, I'll have to disagree. There is no reason for the UI to be the same on the PC and console versions of a game besides the developer wanting to save time/money. This is also a pretty loaded argument because it assumes that for all games using a controller is always inferior to using mouse+keyboard, which simply isn't true.
  • PhillipDaiglePhillipDaigle Member Posts: 654
    If we A) Get the opportunity to make BG3, and B) Decide to also do a console port, the PC version of the game would take the lead, and the tablet/console versions would be based upon it, rather than the other way around.
  • LinkamusLinkamus Member Posts: 221
    Tanthalas said:

    No modding and inferior versions on consoles, at most, is a reason to buy the PC version instead, not a reason for games to not be released on consoles too.

    As for UI designs being screwed, I'll have to disagree. There is no reason for the UI to be the same on the PC and console versions of a game besides the developer wanting to save time/money. This is also a pretty loaded argument because it assumes that for all games using a controller is always inferior to using mouse+keyboard, which simply isn't true.

    This argument goes further than just the UI. Most games in general in the last 10 years have been dumbed down to the point of ridiculousness in order to cater to the casual console gamer market. Look at Dragon Age and Skyrim.. Much newer than Baldur's Gate.. Much worse than Baldur's Gate.

    I agree though that standard gamepads are not always inferior to a mouse and keyboard. Platformers for instance.
  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    Linkamus said:


    This argument goes further than just the UI. Most games in general in the last 10 years have been dumbed down to the point of ridiculousness in order to cater to the casual console gamer market.

    Oh, but were they "dumbed down" for the casual console gamer market, or "dumbed down" to cater to casuals?

    Then there's also the question of if these games really are being "dumbed down" or if they're being improved by being simplified. To me, complexity for the sake of complexity doesn't automatically translate into a better game.
  • DeathOfNamesDeathOfNames Member Posts: 40
    Bloodmoshen said:

    I started this post to see if anyone else shares my view...

    Do you?

    Absolutely and categorically NO! If BG3 happens, and consoles are taken into the equation, it will likely make the game less than it could have been.

    To date, all games I've played, which have been tailored to work on consoles from the beginning, have suffered for it. Interface dumbed down, shitty controls, limited configuration, etc. etc. etc.

    I know it may seem like I'm a pessimistic PC elitist, but I'm really not. I like consoles just fine, and they are definitely great for certain game genres. I'm just tired of having been degraded into a second-class customer/gamer, because games nowadays are made for the lowest common denominator (xbox). Devolopers make the game so it fits with the consoles, and the PC-crowd can get whatever is left over... a few months later.

    So, no. Please don't even think about consoles, achievements, online points or trophies. Take the these and the MMORPG-influenced overemphasis on multi-player and DPS/Ganking/Kiting/Whatever, and leave me my few bastions of SOLID single player enjoyment.

    Young people nowadays! ;-)

    In all seriousness, no. I do not agree with your post. If they want to shoe-horn the BG-games onto the consoles that's fine by me, but if they start including "this has to run on an xbox" into the development. Then the end results will be shite.
  • CommunardCommunard Member Posts: 556
    Console controls just aren't built for a BG style game or interface.
  • Pixel_KaiserPixel_Kaiser Member Posts: 7
    edited July 2012
    I think the OP has Baldur's Gate confused for Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance. I suppose his question is still worth answering either way, though.

    I disagree with the notion that requiring a controller for a console port would mean "dumbing down" the controls too much. I remember Lord of the Rings: The Battle for Middle-earth II and Halo Wars on the Xbox 360 both having pretty decent controls, insomuch I never felt as though the games weren't enough fun to play. That said, the Wii-U's tablet controller could be pretty perfect for something like an isometric party based RPG. Presumably, it wouldn't be too much different from playing Baldur's Gate: Enhanced Edition on an iPad.
  • gmazcagmazca Member Posts: 60
    I just can't see a Baldur's Gate game working without a mouse or some sort of touch screen interface. Perhaps the WiiU but I believe Overhaul has had a poor experience with Nintendo and likely would not partner with them for a console release. For me PC is the only way to play. As long as a BG3 could support lower settings on lower grade hardware (intel HD 3000 graphics for example) I think it could be successful and most would have some sort of machine to play it on whether it be a laptop, desktop, or tablet.
  • norolimnorolim Member Posts: 62
    edited July 2012
    Oh man, @Bloodmoshen. First of all, you are confusing Baldur's Gate, a great tactical, party based RPG with Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance - a mediocre action only hack'n'slash. That alone is a crime ;)

    Second, asking for BG3 to be made for consoles? For that you should be thrown in the darkest dungeon and tortured for eternity. As others mentioned above, the game would have to be significantly dumbed down. And the PC version would have to suffer, no matter if the "PC version of the game took the lead" or not. Otherwise, they would just have to make two separate games. Yes, that's how much dumber the game would have to be, to be successful on consoles. I'm sorry, but that's how it is. Most console owners are casual gamers, who just don't like to think at all, when gaming (mind you, I wrote "most", not all).

    And of course, there is the controller. BG3 would have to have a completely different UI, to the one we have in BG2, for example. And I don't see the devs doing 2 separate UIs...the PC one would just get consolised. We've seen this too many times. Besides, even with a dedicated console UI, I just can't see it working. The game is too complex, too much micromanagement. It would have to be drastically simplified. Again, the PC version would suffer greatly.

    So no, Overhaul if BG3 becomes a reality, please don't make it for the consoles. Even if PC is your lead platform.
    Post edited by norolim on
  • AlparonAlparon Member Posts: 58
    I don't think the Dark Alliance story has any relation to the story of Gorion's Ward. Never played it but never read good reviews about it either.
  • SchneidendSchneidend Member Posts: 3,190
    Maciak87 said:

    I sincerely hope that no console versions would be taken into thought. That would automatically make the game simplified, to a degree at least, and stretch the development time infinitely, since the interface would have to be adjusted.

    Except for the Playstation 1 port that looked entirely identical to the original game but was unfortunately canceled.

  • CoM_SolaufeinCoM_Solaufein Member Posts: 2,606
    Please don't mention the BG games with consoles. That is just bad.
  • LediathLediath Member Posts: 125
    I wouldn't mind there being console ports for the BG series.

    but I say this:
    PC needs to be the primary platform
    PC needs to be the primary platform
    PC needs to be the primary platform

    I hope that's clear ;)
  • DreamDream Member Posts: 52
    Bioware tried to make BG for consoles with DA:O. It was a good game in it's own right but the mechanics were a neutered shadow of BG style gameplay.
  • BloodmoshenBloodmoshen Member Posts: 3
    Thank you for the comments above.

    Clearly, when discussing BG 3 for consoles, I am referring to BG I and BG 2 on consoles and whether or not a BG 3 for consoles would be welcome.

    Obviously, BG 1 and BG 2 for consoles refers to the Dark Alliance games, and an easy search online shows that these two games are some of the most beloved games ever to appear on the last gen systems. Moreover, BG 1 and BG 2 are universally mentioned on any platform on any generation to be amongst the greatest coop games of all-time.

    I realize we can all go back and forth about what is better, what is more capable, and what is more liked, but that tends to be more anecdotal than anything.

    I come at this from the empirical data of appreciated values. This comes for business background; meaning, one can chart one possible future by analyzing the past performance.

    It is much like cars. What cars today will appreciate in value? What will become the next great automotive investment?

    It is like property. What property can I buy now, in this market now, that will ultimate appreciate in value and thus prove profitable?

    First, were the last gen systems loved? Of course. Did they appreciate in value?


    New PS2 systems range from $224.99 to $409.99, more than a new PS 3.

    You can see this appreciation at http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=ps2+system&_sacat=0


    New Baldur’s Gate Dark Alliance game for PS2: $25
    New Baldur’s Gate Dark Alliance II game for PS2: $100
    New Baldur’s Gate Dark Alliance Strategy Guide $51.99


    Below are more appreciated values found at Amazon

    http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i_0_18?url=search-alias=videogames&field-keywords=baldur's+gate+dark+alliance&sprefix=baldur's+gate+dark,videogames,162&rh=n:468642,k:baldur's+gate+dark+alliance

    new Baldur’s Gate Dark Alliance game for Xbox: $87.00
    new Baldur’s Gate Dark Alliance II game for Xbox: $76.95
    new Baldur’s Gate Dark Alliance game for Game Boy Advance $52.99
    new Baldur’s Gate Dark Alliance game for GameCube $77.95

    The market assigns value. Consumers demand. Valuation is a force of not many factors, nor complex factors. The above data is not hard to understand.

    Baldur’s Gate Dark Alliance games have appreciated to soaring costs across the platforms in every way, for each game. Time and again, in the US market, games die at GameStop for pennies on the dollar. I can but the old Baldur's Gate PC game for next to nothing right now.

    Two other games in sequence that appreciated greatly was Ico / Shadow of the Colossus, but that was before being rereleased as a package for the current generation. Rerelease kills prior value. This is happening now to the old Baldur's Gate PC game. It has not happened to Dark Alliance.

    Fact is, whether one is a PC fan or console fan, the Baldur’s Gate Dark Alliance games command value, have profoundly appreciated, and are still considered among the greatest two-player co-op games ever made.

    No wonder why making a BG 3 for consoles would be a very welcome idea, and why this topic is a hot topic on the forums here.
  • SamielSamiel Member Posts: 156
    I think it could work on the WiiU, but to be honest playing point and click games on consoles have always felt overly laborious and limiting on consoles to me.
  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    @Bloodmoshen

    I loved the Dark Alliance games and would welcome a Dark Alliance 3, but for almost everyone on this board a BG3 means a CRPG in the style of BG1&2.
  • NWN_babaYagaNWN_babaYaga Member Posts: 732
    No way can BG3 a console game. Blasphemy!
  • CoM_SolaufeinCoM_Solaufein Member Posts: 2,606
    Quite insulting really.
  • Leaf_EaterLeaf_Eater Member Posts: 71
    edited July 2012
    Dark alliance is a fun series that I enjoyed, but like most others on these forums I dont think it deserves the Baldurs Gate Title and I would support it more if fanboys didnt try to piggie back it on every forum thread with the subject of 'BG'
  • paulsifer42paulsifer42 Member Posts: 267
    I'm all for BG3 being on console. It wouldn't have to be dumbed down at all. I'm very much for making it for the PC and then porting it to a console. How the battle in BG is set up would work fine for console. Would I be as quick with the joystick as the mouse? Nope, but I don't need to be. I pause, figure out what I want everyone to do, then let the action commence. This concept that anything that goes on a console automatically sucks is ridiculous on the point of annoying. PC elitists who do this are acting just as bad (if not worse) than the 12 year old console fanboys that they condemn.
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