Wizard Slayer -> Thief

mylegbig

Thinking of making a wizard slayer that will later be dualed to thief for UAI. I can't decide when to dual though. Should I wait until 13 for the extra 1/2 attack since thieves level rather quickly? Or will it take to long to be worth it and should just dual at 7 or 9? By the way, I won't be soloing. Never tried a fighter -> thief dual class, and though I would like to dual at 13, don't think it's worth it if I have to spend almost the entirety of SoA to get my WS levels back.

Eejit

13 is certainly feasible, but 9 is easier and you don't lose *that* much. Probably better do that your first time F->T dual classing imo.

Wizard Slayer obviously isn't the most OP kit, but I have a soft spot for it, especially dualled to thief.

Fredjo

I have once played a pure Wizard Slayer, we played a duo with my brother who was a ..... wizard , it was loads of fun, we had enough money for all the spells he needed and I had enough poitions to substitute the lack of magical equipment, it felt like playing a WItcher, one poition after another.

Hope you have fun with the WS/T

zur312

13 is great but i think it is too long with big party

Itstucktwice

I actually completed my most recent run through with a WS>Thief dualed at 13. I can honestly say that I enjoyed it, but there were some letdowns.

When it comes to when you get your levels back, it really depends on how much of Amn you clear in chapters 2/3 rather than later. I run with a full party of 6 because I love NPC banter, and I dualed at 13 and got my fighter levels back on the pirate island before going into Spellhold. Though, I play through a lot of the game in Chapter 2 before I even go to rescue Imoen.

As far as the class itself, the biggest letdown for me is that in an un-modded game, WS miscast magic doesn't apply to ranged weapons. I made the character with the intention of using him as a support archer who could disrupt mages, and I ended up playing him as a poor man's assassin.

The inherent flaw with the kit is that any enemy mage who isn't immune to magical weapons is going to be 1 shot by a WS>T's backstab anyway, which really takes a lot of the utility the kit has away.

The MR bonus is nice, and it definitely helps you to be a little bit sturdier against the mages who ARE Immune to magic weapons, but those fights typically go the exact same way. You are just waiting for YOUR mage to remove the protection, and then you 1 shot the mage anyway.

All that being said, I enjoyed the run, and I enjoyed the character. Just know before you make it, that until you get UAI, for a large chunk of the game you will be performing as a subpar F>T, and after you do, you will perform just as any other F>T

Edwin

Are you guys playing at way above the leveling for BGEE?

zur312

it was probably bg2

Eejit

Itstucktwice said:

All that being said, I enjoyed the run, and I enjoyed the character. Just know before you make it, that until you get UAI, for a large chunk of the game you will be performing as a subpar F>T, and after you do, you will perform just as any other F>T

But that's ok, because other F>T are boringly overpowered almost the entire game.

Fubby

I have been trying to find a strong use for Wizard slayer, out of the 3 which to you think is better? WS mage, WS thief, and WS cleric. Sort of offtopic but whatever

Anaximander

WS 13 with grandmastery two handed sword, dual to Thief for UAI, weild Carsomyr
... question does simulcrum clone also stack spell failure % when it hits in melee?

Eejit

Fubby said:

I have been trying to find a strong use for Wizard slayer, out of the 3 which to you think is pbetter? WS mage, WS thief, and WS cleric. Sort of offtopic but whatever

To take into ToB probably not Cleric, don't think he could manage well enough without magic items. Mage gets strong enough buffs late and thief can UAI. Pure kit can work too.

Lord_Tansheron

@Anaximander They should. Simulacra are exact copies of your character, except they are level-drained (you can cast Restoration + Wish to restore spells and they will have a full spellbook...). As such, they should copy all class abilities, including WS interrupt.

Anaximander

WS-T + Vhailor's Helm, WS - M + simulcrum ... 4 wizard slayers! ... lots of toys

zur312

there is no appeal in 4 wizard slayers
you will do better with 4 mages spamming sunfire or something

for me wizard slayer/thief is just another semi-fighter who actually is not that cool when you play

wizard slayer/mage is probably better because mages are better so you might try it

Edwin

zur312 said:

for me wizard slayer/thief is just another semi-fighter who actually is not that cool when you play

wizard slayer/mage is probably better because mages are better so you might try it

Wizard slayer/mage would bring about such vitriolic self-loathing and could never be trusted to be left alone with sharp objects.

zur312

call it emo-wizard build

SpaceInvader

Lord_Tansheron said:

@Anaximander (you can cast Restoration + Wish to restore spells and they will have a full spellbook...)

Rest Wish doesn't work on Simulacrum/PI

Fredjo

The problem with ranged weapons not having a miscast ability @Itstucktwice mentioned might have been solved in NearInfinity, does anybody know the name of the miscast variable and if it's applicable on all ranged weapons?

Lord_Tansheron

@SpaceInvader: Are you sure? You do need to Restoration them first of course to remove the level drain. I am fairly certain it worked when I last did it, but admittedly that has been about 8 or 9 years ago...

Eejit

Well SPCL132 lists casting failure (60) as the effect, same effect as the Miscast Magic spell and Bala's Axe. I'm not sure how to make it ranged (add a ranged copy of the spell?) but modders have done so at various points.

SpaceInvader

Lord_Tansheron said:

@SpaceInvader: Are you sure? You do need to Restoration them first of course to remove the level drain. I am fairly certain it worked when I last did it, but admittedly that has been about 8 or 9 years ago...

Yes, you can restore the clone to its original level. But Wish won't affect it.

zur312

Eejit said:

Well SPCL132 lists casting failure (60) as the effect, same effect as the Miscast Magic spell and Bala's Axe. I'm not sure how to make it ranged (add a ranged copy of the spell?) but modders have done so at various points.

there are mods for wizard slayer ranged attacks

Fredjo

Thank you @Eejit and @zur312 , I'd like to play a wizard-slaying vengeful marksman elf someday, changing the +1 to hit for swords to bows and hunt down every mage I come upon and @Elminster won't be spared..:D

Eejit

zur312 said:

Eejit said:

Well SPCL132 lists casting failure (60) as the effect, same effect as the Miscast Magic spell and Bala's Axe. I'm not sure how to make it ranged (add a ranged copy of the spell?) but modders have done so at various points.

there are mods for wizard slayer ranged attacks

Uh, yeah, that's what I said. Most of them seem to change other aspects of the kit at the same time however.

SpaceInvader

@Fredjo @zur321 @Eejit
G3: Baldur's Gate II Fixpack, for example.

"Wizard Slayers Cause Miscast Magic on Ranged Attacks

The original kit description of the Wizard Slayer states as a kit advantage: "For each successful hit on an opponent, 10% cumulative spell failure penalty is applied". However, it was only applying this effect on melee hits. The Core Fixes do not change this and the Game Text Update clarifies the kit description to specify melee-only. This component allows players to extend the ability to both melee and ranged attacks and updates the kit description. "

Link: http://www.gibberlings3.net/bg2fixpack/docs_obc.php

elminster

Fredjo said:

Thank you @Eejit and @zur312 , I'd like to play a wizard-slaying vengeful marksman elf someday, changing the +1 to hit for swords to bows and hunt down every mage I come upon and @Elminster won't be spared..:D

I hope you miss and he turns you into a chicken!