Flaming Fist Fighters hit the cap?

dracostrike

Is it possible with the level cap in ToSC to get +5 Proficiency Mastery Level without mods for fighters?

Ascerion

Not really sure about the Flaming Fist part. A new kit added by a mod? Anyway, you can get Grand Mastery easily by plugging your first 4 pips into say longsword, and then when you get the next proficiency level (at level 3) getting grand mastery in it. Here's a good site for kits and classes, and if you click the "Fighter Level Progression", it tells you what levels you get proficiency pips, and APR and stuff.

http://web.archive.org/web/20090704103705/http://playithardcore.com/pihwiki/index.php?title=Baldur's_Gate:_Classes_and_Kits

There are more PiH pages, with a wealth of information. With Baldur's Gate, knowledge really IS power. Have fun!

~Ascerion

dracostrike

I have a problem then During Character creation I can only put 2 points in one stat and 2 in another , not 4 in one

And yes, I am a fighter (no multi-classing).

TJ_Hooker

In BG:EE (and vanilla BG1), you cannot put more than 2 pips into a single weapon at character creation. In BG:EE, you cannot reach grandmastery (5 pips) without taking advantage of some dual class shenanigans. For example, if you dual class into a fighter, you can place all 4 pips into a single weapon, and then achieve grandmastery when you hit fighter level 3. You can also hit GM dualling from a fighter, but it requires a little more planning. In vanilla BG1, it is impossible to get GM.

Ascerion

Ah, yes. I have been playing BGT recently, sorry. Well, since the exp cap is 161,000 exp I believe, then you would be stuck with High Mastery at levels 6-8. You could dual to Thief and get it at like War 6/ Thief 9.

Alternatively, go to - http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/10212/a-simple-xp-cap-remover
for a exp cap remover, and get grand mastery at level 9.

Hope that helps!

~Ascerion

dracostrike

Thanks for the help ^^ I keep finding it weird that BG1 doesn't allow you to make full use of the game like this Oh well, the "Kagain with Defender" idea wasn't worth it due to only 2 points in long swords and now this one going fighter on CHARNAME to gain the max no. of attacks.

sarevok57

yeah fighters that dual class over to thieves or druids at level 7 in bgee, can hit grandmastery and have great attacks per round, infact you can have a fighter level 7 dual into a druid and still hit level 9 for your druid, so now you have a druid with a level 5 spell, grandmastery in scimitar and the other 2 points, if you put it into 2 weapon fighting I believe you would have 3.5 attacks per round, not to shabby for bg1 I would say

Kaltzor

dracostrike said:

I have a problem then During Character creation I can only put 2 points in one stat and 2 in another , not 4 in one

And yes, I am a fighter (no multi-classing).

That from my knowledge is working as intended... No being a High Master at level 1 and Grandmaster by 3...

Gallowglass

Grandmastery of your weapons at BG1 levels seems premature to me. When you take the character onward into BG2 and reach higher levels, then completing your weapon proficiencies is part of the continuing development of your character, which is (IMO) a significant part of the fun of being able to carry on with the same character.

Corvino

Fighters plateau significantly after level 12-13 (12 for grandmastery, 13 for full APR). I'm not sure that getting grandmastery a little early by dual-classing changes this much overall.

Ascerion

Gallowglass said:

Grandmastery of your weapons at BG1 levels seems premature to me. When you take the character onward into BG2 and reach higher levels, then completing your weapon proficiencies is part of the continuing development of your character, which is (IMO) a significant part of the fun of being able to carry on with the same character.

I agree, for the most part. It's nice to be able to get the last pip at level 9 in BG1 when you are leveling multiple proficiencies, though. Like Spears and halberds.

Also, sometimes I get a weapon to grandmastery before I work on dual wield mastery, which I save for BG2. I think of it as learning everything about the weapon before I try to become ambidextrous with it.

~Ascerion

Gallowglass

I'm not convinced, @Corvino. After level 13, Fighters spend the next few levels getting their base THAC0 down to 0 (reached at level 21), which is important for effective combat in the later stages. Then after that, they start getting their HLAs, which are also pretty good if you choose the right ones (esp. GWW). So I don't see it as a severe plateau.

Corvino

THAC0 is one aspect, but "if you can hit it, it's dead already" is more or less the mantra of endgame SOA and TOB. Adding utility or additional special abilities is why so many powergaming builds dual at 13. That said, I do enjoy playing Cavaliers who spend much of their time doing exactly this. They do get additional spells (with a broken caster level) at the same time though.

Gallowglass

@Corvino: I agree that level 13 is one of the natural dualling-points for some builds, and sometimes I do that myself. Nevertheless, I think it's misleading to give the impression that Fighters don't get much useful development after level 13. The "if you can hit it ..." mantra does require that you actually can manage to hit instead of miss, and a high-level Fighter's excellent THAC0 obviously makes it easier to do that.

blackchimes

Huh? Fighters and their kits get proficiency every 3 levels right? So they should be able to get a Grandmastery at level 9.

Corvino

@Gallowglass: Compared to gaining 10+ HP per level, going from Specialised to Grandmastery as well as gaining additional APR *and* equal THAC0 progression to later on, what happens between level 13 and the first HLA is a significant slowing down of a Fighter class's initial rapid development. They do not stop progressing, but they slow down to the extent that I think the term plateau is appropriate.

Gallowglass

@Corvino: I don't think we're really disagreeing about much here. Yes, they slow down their progression. However, that's true of other classes as well (e.g. a Cleric gains access to his final level of spells at level 13, a Druid comes to a complete halt for quite a while at level 14, and so on), so I don't see it as a special disadvantage just of Fighters.

@blackchimes: yes, you can get a pureclass Fighter to Grandmastery at level 9, i.e. very early in BG2, if you put all your levelling points into one weapon. In practice, though, you might (and I usually do) want to spread the early points to develop some versatility - it's often handy for a warrior type to have at least a sharp and a blunt and a ranged proficiency.