(thank you shadowkeeper!) I am using all the weapons you mentioned, but there are only so many such weapons. And quite a lot of interesting swords, which only minsk and imoen can use, and she is using the staff of the magi (I might switch her to carsomyr +6 when she gets use any item)
Also, I currently have str boosting items on everyone except charname (who doesn't need it) and Aerie. I am honestly not sure if I should keep minsk's offhand as belm for the +1 APR or give him that sword that sets strength to 22.
I was considering editing minsk away from ranger to a fighter/druid but then forktheworld pointed out the sword thing
Hoo boy, yeah, I can see how adding a fighter multiclass to your entire party would make the weapon situation tight, especially since most of them have weapon restrictions from another class. I wouldn't switch Minsc to any class combo that's going to give him weapon restrictions. He'll be fine as a Ranger, but if you must switch him, I'd either go single-classed Berserker or Barbarian or make him a Fighter/Thief.
I'd keep Belm as Minsc's off-hand, as a speed weapon trumps other options in nearly all situations. If you want to slide Belm over to Jahiera, Minsc can still use Kundane. Angurvadal actually makes a pretty good main hand weapon with its bonus fire damage, so you could use Angurvadal/Belm as your setup on Minsc.
As a side note, if parties with a lot of Fighter/Cleric and Fighter/Druid combinations are something you really like, you might consider using the Item Upgrade mod, as it adds a couple of upgrade options for Gnasher (club), Skullcrusher (Mace), an additional scimitar, and some throwing spears, which would help equip a party hampered by divine weapon restrictions immensely.
I'm not really sure the benefit of having a F/M/T and 2 F/M/Cs in the same party, especially since you have 2 other divine casters. I'm sure it works for you, but you'll be stuck with low level arcane spells for a long time. Just having a F/M for your main could overcome this to an extent.
I'd keep Belm as Minsc's off-hand, as a speed weapon trumps other options in nearly all situations. If you want to slide Belm over to Jahiera, Minsc can still use Kundane. Angurvadal actually makes a pretty good main hand weapon with its bonus fire damage, so you could use Angurvadal/Belm as your setup on Minsc.
I didn't even consider using Belm as off hand and angurvidal as main... this is what I am doing now, great idea!. Jeheira is using staff of the ram +6, imoen is using staff of the magi and will upgrade to carsomyr +6 when she gets "use any item" .
As a side note, if parties with a lot of Fighter/Cleric and Fighter/Druid combinations are something you really like, you might consider using the Item Upgrade mod, as it adds a couple of upgrade options for Gnasher (club), Skullcrusher (Mace), an additional scimitar, and some throwing spears, which would help equip a party hampered by divine weapon restrictions immensely.
Sounds nice, I will try that when I play BG2EE. Can't really use it now though thanks to the risk of save corruption from modifying an existing game.
Stealth, even without the ability to backstab, seems to be highly under-rated by many.
Because it takes too much time and effort to use. I tried adding it to the custom AI I am building but it has some engine bugs preventing me from doing that. 99% of the enemies I can just bum rush for a fraction of the effort. The 1% that take planning I will cast improved invisibility instead of using the inferior hide in shadows (regular invisiblity)
I dunno...being able to stealth in a Beastmaster with a Gnasher club to get the first hit on a mage before his protections can fire is pretty sweet. He's basically worthless for 4 rounds afterward, as long as he doesn't have scripted spells since the dot damage on Gnasher by-passes protections.
I dunno...being able to stealth in a Beastmaster with a Gnasher club to get the first hit on a mage before his protections can fire is pretty sweet. He's basically worthless for 4 rounds afterward, as long as he doesn't have scripted spells since the dot damage on Gnasher by-passes protections.
As I said, for the 1% of encounters where it is needed I can still do that with a spell. Invisibility or improved invisibility.
Of course, you don't actually need ANY skills or spells at all to beat the game, so it is kind of a moot point really.
not entirely true. Chaotic commands is a must. As is resist fear. And breach. Aside from that, its not that i just don't need it, its that its not worth the effort. Some spells, while unnecessary, are worth the effort as they make things sufficiently easier to justify putting the effort into casting them instead of waiting for the party AI to melee the enemies to death
Chaotic commands is a must. As is resist fear. And breach.
Please explain. I don't see how that could ever be true outside of specifically skewed mod-setups, let alone the vanilla game.
Enemies which mind control your party cannot be defeated without some way to counteract mind control. The most obvious and effective way to do it is chaotic commands + resist fear. Illithids, nymphs, particular enemy mages. However, it is possible to use alternative spells. Such as summoning undead and sending them in to fight in your stead.
Breach is required to strip certain enemies of their defenses. Particularly immunity to magical weapons.
Although it is potentially possible to savescum until you get extremely lucky on saves
Oh and I forgot another huge one. Immunity to Magic:Abjuration Only defense against imprisonment which demi-liches have as an at will ability.
Control: dispel; wait until it wears off; use summons; use classes immune to it; focus-fire whoever casts the control; ...
Breach: wait until defenses wear off (PfMW has very short duration); hit with normal weapons through PfMW; use Wand of Spell Striking; Dispel Magic; ...
Imprisonment: Protection from Undead; Protection from Magic; summons; kill fast enough; ...
Those are just off the top of my head, in 30 seconds of thinking. I think you're pretty far off of those spells you mentioned being required in any way...
@Iamaros: I think he means you don't *need* any *specific* spells or skills to beat the game; not that he thinks you don't need *any* skills or spells *at all*. Though I'm not sure it would be true even in the later case, given how many potions, scrolls, etc. there are... not skills nor spells, right? >_>
Again it's all about perspective. Sure there are many weapons in the game that best utilize a ranger or Fighter/cleric. So it depends on your playstyle and what you like more - a ranger (subturfuge or all out hail of missles) or the cleric(beefed up tank). You know I want to see a Fighter/cleric and a Fighter/mage go at it..... oooooo thats a new blog
@Iamaros: I think he means you don't *need* any *specific* spells or skills to beat the game; not that he thinks you don't need *any* skills or spells *at all*. Though I'm not sure it would be true even in the later case, given how many potions, scrolls, etc. there are... not skills nor spells, right? >_>
Control: dispel; wait until it wears off; use summons; use classes immune to it; focus-fire whoever casts the control; ...
Breach: wait until defenses wear off (PfMW has very short duration); hit with normal weapons through PfMW; use Wand of Spell Striking; Dispel Magic; ...
Imprisonment: Protection from Undead; Protection from Magic; summons; kill fast enough; ...
Those are just off the top of my head, in 30 seconds of thinking. I think you're pretty far off of those spells you mentioned being required in any way...
with the exception of "wait it out" (which is NOT practical in many battles) every example you gave was to cast other spells. I suggest you reread the arguments made.
>Someone: You never need to cast any spells to win the game >Me: Yes you do >Like what >Me: List some spells, and explicitly state there are alternative spells that can achieve the same things >You: You are wrong, here are alternative spells that can achieve the same thing. Yes, I already explicitly said there are alternative spells that can achieve the same thing. And just because you are casting it off of a scroll or a wand doesn't mean you aren't casting a spell.
In vanilla BG2 it is quite possible to "wait out" or just bash through a lot of combat protections with bonus elemental damage. The first couple of times I played through BG2 I had no idea about breach and kept trying to secret word Liches, and I didn't dispel because I did not want to lose my combat buffs. And yet I still completed SoA without too much difficulty.
@taltamir: you never mentioned anything about alternatives in the original post, and that's what I was responding to. Not that it matters anyway, I think we've established now that there are so many alternative effects and/or strategies to deal with these things that nothing is "required" by any means. Any class/race combination can solo the vanilla game without any difficulty.
@taltamir: you never mentioned anything about alternatives in the original post, and that's what I was responding to. Not that it matters anyway, I think we've established now that there are so many alternative effects and/or strategies to deal with these things that nothing is "required" by any means. Any class/race combination can solo the vanilla game without any difficulty.
And you you replied out of context, since the so called "original post" is a reply to a post saying you don't need any MAGIC to win the game.
Comments
I'd keep Belm as Minsc's off-hand, as a speed weapon trumps other options in nearly all situations. If you want to slide Belm over to Jahiera, Minsc can still use Kundane. Angurvadal actually makes a pretty good main hand weapon with its bonus fire damage, so you could use Angurvadal/Belm as your setup on Minsc.
As a side note, if parties with a lot of Fighter/Cleric and Fighter/Druid combinations are something you really like, you might consider using the Item Upgrade mod, as it adds a couple of upgrade options for Gnasher (club), Skullcrusher (Mace), an additional scimitar, and some throwing spears, which would help equip a party hampered by divine weapon restrictions immensely.
I know this is a bit off-topic, but still.
Jeheira is using staff of the ram +6, imoen is using staff of the magi and will upgrade to carsomyr +6 when she gets "use any item"
99% of the enemies I can just bum rush for a fraction of the effort. The 1% that take planning I will cast improved invisibility instead of using the inferior hide in shadows (regular invisiblity)
Chaotic commands is a must. As is resist fear. And breach.
Aside from that, its not that i just don't need it, its that its not worth the effort. Some spells, while unnecessary, are worth the effort as they make things sufficiently easier to justify putting the effort into casting them instead of waiting for the party AI to melee the enemies to death
Illithids, nymphs, particular enemy mages.
However, it is possible to use alternative spells. Such as summoning undead and sending them in to fight in your stead.
Breach is required to strip certain enemies of their defenses. Particularly immunity to magical weapons.
Although it is potentially possible to savescum until you get extremely lucky on saves
Oh and I forgot another huge one. Immunity to Magic:Abjuration
Only defense against imprisonment which demi-liches have as an at will ability.
Breach: wait until defenses wear off (PfMW has very short duration); hit with normal weapons through PfMW; use Wand of Spell Striking; Dispel Magic; ...
Imprisonment: Protection from Undead; Protection from Magic; summons; kill fast enough; ...
Those are just off the top of my head, in 30 seconds of thinking. I think you're pretty far off of those spells you mentioned being required in any way...
>Someone: You never need to cast any spells to win the game
>Me: Yes you do
>Like what
>Me: List some spells, and explicitly state there are alternative spells that can achieve the same things
>You: You are wrong, here are alternative spells that can achieve the same thing.
Yes, I already explicitly said there are alternative spells that can achieve the same thing. And just because you are casting it off of a scroll or a wand doesn't mean you aren't casting a spell.
Ah, a more innocent age.