Maximum damage per hit chalenge

SympetrumD

No backstabs, damage to living, neutural humanoids only please)

Categories as follows
Max Normal and Critical
BGEE
Black Pits
BG2
Ascention

Please note that in the first two not all potions are available)

Think, Test, Have Fun!

Cause I know I am)

Corvino

Thinking about it (but not testing), I think that a kensai->priest or berserker->preist dual using staffs is likely to have the highest potential damage. Swashbuckler bonus damage was a consideration, but they only get +7 damage by level 40 (equivalent to the difference between specialisation and grandmastery + Kensai bonuses) and cannot legitimately get 25 strength while wielding a staff.

Staff of the Ram does 18 max damage
Grandmastery adds 5 damage
25 strength (quite doable with DUHM) adds 14 damage
Chant adds 1 damage
Kensai level 12 (for a 13 dual) adds 4 damage OR Berserker rage + Gauntlets of Extraordinary Specialisation adds 4 damage

I would conjecture that maximum non-crit, non-backstab 1-hit damage on a non-party member is about 42. Which seems oddly low. However, using righteous magic they can do this amount of damage with every hit.

There are other external factors like enhanced bardsong (+4 damage) which could push this higher, but I was only counting personal buffs. I do not expect to be right about this, and someone will doubtless be able to point out other ways to do it. You might well be able to exploit things like the Equaliser's damage bonuses applying to the mainhand to get obscene amounts of damage to specific targets.

pixie359

FoA +5 does 22 damage, and if it's theoretical damage limits rather than practical playing, let's dual the kensai much higher than 13.

ryuken87

If you're allowed help from your party then stack some enhanced bard songs, it's been a while but I vaguely remember Mislead clones being able to sing as well.

Also attack a character holding a ranged weapon, that's another 4 damage.

EDIT: Just remembered that if you Shapechange into an Iron Golem, your fists do 4d10 base damage and I'm pretty sure that's the highest damage 'weapon' in the game.

Corvino

@pixie359 I am probably doing the Kensai a disservice for the level 13 dual. It's possible for them to get a whopping +13 damage bonus from class benefits alone at level 39, which may well put them in contention for top 1-hit damage generally. A pure Kensai half-orc can attain 24 natural strength using the tome/deck of many things, MoLTM and hell trials, only missing 2 damage from strength as well.

10thLich

How about using the black blade of disaster? The effect of that spell is a +5 longsword which grants grandmastery in longsword and does 2D12+5 damage per hit. Equalizer in the off-hand and you're looking at these theoretical numbers:

29 max damage
+ 6 Equalizer bonus
+14 from strength 25
+5 grand mastery (if that's the correct value)
+1 Chant
+2 Gauntlets of Extraordinary Specialisation
= 57 damage before class bonuses

The fists of an iron golem have the highest damage, but they're not associated with any weapon proficiency.

Eudaemonium

Actually, a Half-Orc Fighter can get the full 25. 19 Base, +1 Tome, +3 in Hell (Wrath trial gives +2 for evil route and a further +1 Core Stat for transforming into the Slayer to begin with), then +1 from MoLTM and finally +1 from the Deck.

lunar

IIRC, in Bioware forums Alesia has abused mislead-stacking enhanced bard song effect to score a critical hit with a septuble backstab for an astounding amount of damage well over 1000+ hit points.

Lord_Tansheron

Don't think anything can beat Iron Golem, 40 maximum damage + 25 STR bonus (= 54 total) is too much. Or is it? Well, it all depends on how gear and kit bonuses apply to being a Golem. If those are retained, then Iron Golem wins; if they only gain their base damage + STR bonus, then there are alternatives.

BBOD is the highest maximum damage "weapon" (29) but requires you to be a mage. Assuming you don't cast it off a scroll, you'd need to be at least lvl 18, meaning you could be Kensai 28->Mage 18 (8m XP exactly), earning you another +9 from Kensai kit bonus damage and +5 from Grandmastery. Dual however means you can't be a Half-Orc, so only 24 STR (+12 damage). Equalizer in off-hand does nothing, as the OP's testing conditions specify a neutral target. Gauntlets of Extraordinary Specialization add another +2.

So we get:

29 (BBOD max dmg)
+ 9 (Kensai)
+ 5 (GM)
+12 (24 STR)
+ 2 (Gauntlets

= 57 damage

The alternative using a real weapon would be FoA+5 or SotR+6, both of which have 22 maximum damage. You don't need to be a mage for those, so you can snatch up an extra +4 Kensai damage and +2 STR bonus damage (from being Half-Orc) putting you only a single point behind.

To all that you can add external buffs al gusto. Potions etc are a given, and I believe the aforementioned Song-stacking with Mislead is the highest party-buff bonus you can achieve. Feel free to calculate those bonuses yourselves. I believe some priest spells also add damage, but I think it's not enough to justify a priest in the party over another bard.

Corvino

@Lord_Tansheron - wouldn't being a 28 kensai and 18 mage mean that your wouldn't reactivate the Kensai ability for bonuses? Or do you automatically reactivate your inactive class at the level cap?

SympetrumD

Same question here, plus kensai/mages still cant use gauntlets can they?

What about lower levels? so far my Berserker with 2handed sword leads with 32 (str 24 + gau 2) in BGEE but Black Pits dont have Cloud G potion so Barbarian with might out do him

ryuken87

@SympetrumD

Berserker with GM in staffs.
15 - max base damage from Staff of Striking
+14 - 25 str through potions and DUHM from Bhaalspawn abilities (I assume they stack?)
+5 - GM
+2 - rage
+2 - gauntlets
+1 - Chant
+2 - Skald song
+4 - target wields a ranged weapon

That would come to 45

EDIT: Berserkers can't get GM on their own in BG1 can they, it would have to be a Berserker / thief dual.

Lord_Tansheron

Corvino said:

@Lord_Tansheron - wouldn't being a 28 kensai and 18 mage mean that your wouldn't reactivate the Kensai ability for bonuses? Or do you automatically reactivate your inactive class at the level cap?

You win, I completely derped that. OBVIOUSLY you don't reactivate the Kensai in that case. Herp.

TethorilofLathander

Not sure if this counts but I had Sarevok doing around 230 damage with deathblows and Harbringer, not to mention the fireballs that sometimes sprang from Harbringer, so we could be looking at 250 damage.

Corvino

Are there any items that add bonus damage in slots other than gauntlets? I can't think of any off the top of my head, but it might be a way to up the damage of thief duals with UAI. Kensai->thieves can use (and indeed backstab with) the black blade of disaster, so there's potential for big hits.

Lord_Tansheron

Keep in mind that this discussion is completely academic. In practice "big hits" don't play nearly as much of a role as the overall average, which is contingent on more than just damage per hit (primarily APR, but also things like THAC0). As such, casting BBOD off of scrolls is not a feasible strategy, given how few of these scrolls are actually around.

As for thieves/UAI, I don't believe there is an item outside of the Gauntlets, but even if there was it would have to be a considerable amount of damage to offset the loss of Kensai bonuses. Does not sound likely.

SympetrumD

Yes, of course! The initial idea came from a discussion with a friend about killing a dragon in Skyrim with one arrow/strike (not like in good old times=) So we set out discussing the present topic

zur312

my plan was c/t true power shapeshifting scroll into iron golem backstab

Corvino

Let's face it, outside a rare few difficulty increasing mods, having a maximised damage-per-round is completely un-needed. In BG1/EE, THAC0 is close to king, as merely hitting something frequently is usually enough to bring it down. Even Sarevok can be brought down with an unoptimised party with a few buffs. I ran with Garrick/Skie/Eldoth/Xan recently and he was still a cakewalk with a bit of preplanning and knowledge of the game.

In BG2 & TOB the focus shifts dramatically to "can I hit it at all?". With the levels of spell and inherent resistance to weapons of less than a certain enchantment level it becomes about pre-planning how you're going to hit the target not how hard or how often. Enemies you can actually just hit repeatedly are usually fodder.

This thread is about a simple, pointless and utterly academic point: how hard can you hit someone if you really put some thought into it!

nano

What about kensai/thief shapeshifted into iron golem?

Lord_Tansheron

@nano: shouldn't make a difference to Kensai/Mage. You still need 3m xp for UAI, same as lvl9 spells, and thieves don't add any innate damage. Backstabs have been excluded by the initial question, so the net result is probably exactly the same.

nano

@Lord_Tansheron Yeah, but Kensai/Mage can't wear gloves.

Lord_Tansheron

I guess that's true! -2 then, depending on how items work with Golem form.

ryuken87

You can also dual later with a K/T, getting an extra Kensai damage bonus.

karnor00

Wouldn't the club of detonation give a higher maximum damage than other weapons? A maximum damage fireball would add a lot.

Lord_Tansheron

@karnor00: that depends on how you define the "hit". I suppose that also applies to Staff of the Ram and Flail of Ages, since they deliver their damage in chunks. Come to think of it, that may put BBOD at the top again... I guess you could argue both ways: a "single hit"; or damage "per hit", i.e. per weapon swing. The Club is definitely a top contender if the latter, though it shouldn't influence the baseline choice of class combination (since that doesn't apply to the fireball proc).

[Deleted User]

Of course, if you include the Club of Detonation's proc, you start having to consider how many enemies are in the vicinity. If multiple enemies are close by, weapons like the Club of Detonation and Storm Star jump to the forefront because they can deal extra damage to those other combatants in a single swing.

ajwz

Can physical and elemental vulnerabilities be exploited?

ajwz

Arrows of biting deal 30% of total hp within 20 seconds on a failed save.
There is no theoretical maximum limit on this; for any value of damage y anyone else calculates in this thread, it is possible to give a number n for which 0.3 x n > y. Therefore I want my prize.

zur312

well there is probably limit

name the highest hp creature in the game and do the math for your damage

i think some dragons have like 250 adalon?

Schneidend

ajwz said:

Arrows of biting deal 30% of total hp within 20 seconds on a failed save.
There is no theoretical maximum limit on this; for any value of damage y anyone else calculates in this thread, it is possible to give a number n for which 0.3 x n > y. Therefore I want my prize.

Hrm. It wouldn't be a straight comparison like that, though. One y can include things like Strength or Kensai bonuses that arrows of biting cannot benefit from.