Mage/Cleric, Dual, Multi-Class, Advice?

ghostowl

So I wanted to make a mage who can cast high level priest spells, contingency -> heal and so forth.

I realize that there are 3 options:

Mage/Cleric Multi

Mage dual'ed to Cleric (Possibly a specialist mage school)

Cleric dual'ed to Mage (Possibly Priest of Lathander)

Can anyone explain to me what are the benefits/cons of these? Ideally, I would like my caster to be able to cast at least FOUR level 9 mage spells, if not more.

I heard something about the number of memorization can go down using a multi..is it true?

TheElf

Well, if you want high levels of both, it would seem you'd have to go multi or be really gimped for most of the game. Not 100% sure, but I never heard anything or noticed losing out on spells with Aerie, so I don't think that's the case.

ghostowl

I'm willing to dual-class at upper levels(20s). I just want to make sure I have high level in mage to get access to 9th level spells

Normally, your wisdom/int gives you a boost in memorization for cleric classes or mages but if you multi them, you don't get those bonus extra memorization....can anyone confirm?

Mathsorcerer

Extra spells from wisdom apply regardless of how you get to your cleric class; similarly, high intelligence gives you a greater likelihood of scribing spells regardless of how you get there. My favorite run through SoA/ToB was with a cleric/mage, which can become quite a powerful combination, especially once you hit 14/14 and above.

I would go with cleric/mage multiclass.

Chaotic_Good

http://playithardcore.com/pihwiki/index.php?title=Baldur's_Gate:_Dual_and_Multiclassing#Cleric.2FMage

There is allot of good info in the link above including an overview of every duel and multi combo it is missing some info on the new kits but they are in progress.

Elendar

Gnome Cleric/Illusionist multiclass would probably be your best bet if you want both arcane and divine spells.

GoodSteve

As a side note high Int doesn't ever give extra spell slots to arcane casters whether they are single, multi, or dual classed. Int affects your chances of scribing a scroll to your spellbook and nothing more. That said I seem to recall seeing in the latest path notes it is needed to have higher level spells, in that if your int is only 14 or something you wont be able to cast any 9th level spells... not entirely sure about that, but otherwise Int gives no spell slots.

In order to do what you want you'll likely have to be a multi cleric/mage. I'm not sure there is enough XP before cap to let you get to 20 something as a mage than dual to cleric (or vice versa) and still see lots of max level spells in both classes.

Elendar

GoodSteve said:

As a side note high Int doesn't ever give extra spell slots to arcane casters whether they are single, multi, or dual classed. Int affects your chances of scribing a scroll to your spellbook and nothing more. That said I seem to recall seeing in the latest path notes it is needed to have higher level spells, in that if your int is only 14 or something you wont be able to cast any 9th level spells... not entirely sure about that, but otherwise Int gives no spell slots.

In order to do what you want you'll likely have to be a multi cleric/mage. I'm not sure there is enough XP before cap to let you get to 20 something as a mage than dual to cleric (or vice versa) and still see lots of max level spells in both classes.

Intelligence simply alters the maximum number of spells you can learn per spell level and increases your chances of successfully scribing a scroll into your spellbook. At 19 intelligence there is no limit to the number of spells you can learn at each level (edit: Where as at 18 Intelligence, you can only learn 18 spells per spell level)


edit: Correction: It also affects the highest spell level your character can cast. You need 18 intelligence in order to be able to cast 9th level spells, for instance. If your character only has a 9 in intelligence, you'll only be able to cast spells up to spell level 4. Not sure if BGEE changed this or not, but don't see why they would.

ComplyOrDie

I'm playing one of these at the moment. First time I've tried. Dualled my priest of lathander to a mage at lvl 10. Lvl 7 in mage at the moment, playing SCS so it's quite tough.

That will get me 10/30 at the experience cap. Two Boons of Lathander, and a bunch of fun cleric spells to put in sequencers/contingencies which is the main reason I'm personally doing it.

You could do 15/27 I think as max and get 4 lvl 9 spells? But that would be an incredibly dull game!

Elendar

@ghostowl

With the Gnome Cleric/Illusionist multiclass you can get to Cleric 25 / Illusionist 20 with the 8 million XP cap. With that you'll be able to cast 3 level 9 mage spells per day and have access to all the cleric spells. Its only the Necromancy school spells in the mage area that you'd be unable to cast, which unfortunately includes Horrid Wilting.

But, using a combination of cleric and mage buffs, especially with having cleric spells inside of the contingencies and spell triggers, you can easily just a equip a couple of good weapons and go right on into melee and deal massive amounts of damage

And you'd have the shorty saves.

Chaotic_Good

If those lvs are correct he would have 3 7th lv cleric spells and 2 ninth lv mage spells at cap

Elendar

Chaotic_Good said:

If those lvs are correct he would have 3 7th lv cleric spells and 2 ninth lv mage spells at cap

You're forgetting the extra spell per level that specialist mages get. So it'd be three 9th level spells.

Corvino

I've never seen a priest to mage or vice versa dual as particularly valuable. Both continue to gain spells well after 9th level which is the most painful point to dual-class. Unless you're willing to make quite extraordinary sacrifices you will not get the best spells with both classes.

A Cleric/Mage multiclass or Cleric/Illusionist on the other hand is very viable throughout the saga. Just look at Aerie. Or Quayle. They have *so many* spells despite fairly average stats. You'll level pretty slowly but will be a potent support character throughout the saga. You will miss out on high-level spells until a good way into TOB though.

Mornmagor

It's probably better to multiclass with Cleric/Mage, but if you dual, then go Cleric-> Mage, not the other way around. Using a nice kit cleric and dual wielding with improved haste means you don't care about your attacks per round. Thac0 is not an issue either, cause of Holy Power.

For instance, 1 main attack, one off hand, if Lathander then 2-1, and improved haste means 4-1, capped APR. If Helm, same thing, although you don't cast any more. So don your armor as well

For the extra spells, i believe if you multi, then you only get extra mage spells. I'm not sure about dual, i imagine you keep your initial class' bonus spells.

You only need level 11-13 cleric btw. Until you get enough heals.

ghostowl

^ That was incredibly insightful and so were the other posts on this thread, thank you all

So dual classing (at equal levels) Mage ---> Cleric vs. Cleric ---> Mage only really makes a difference in speciality kits? Which is better in melee / proficiency?

I like the idea of Cleric/Illusionist but I don't think I want to miss out on triple horrid wilting chain contingency, and I like to cast more than 2 or 3 level 9 spells. Those time stops and improved alacrity run out fast..But I think I might do another character with gnome MC illusionist / cleric

I might dual a cleric of lathander at level 10 into a level 30 mage like the above poster. I'm assuming you would end up with about 4 level 9 spells?

Mornmagor

If you dual at level 13 Cleric, you will end with 28 level Mage at level cap. If you dual at 11, you will be 29. Aka, no matter what you do, you'll have more than 4 i think. Plus the 10 level spells.

Drayen

TBH, I've been thinking about making a mage/cleric.. i tweaked game to be max level, you get 3 lvl7 cleric spells, 2 lvl9 mage spells, which is kinda few, but you get a truckton of every other level. Honestly, if you were pure mage, youd get 5 max level spells, if you were a cleric, probably 6-7 i think? So if you add both classes spells, its rather equal, but id say mage lvl9 spells are stronger (Dat dragonbreath)

In the end, you'll still have a shitton of albi dalzim horrid wiltings so its ok.

Severon

I play with a Cleric / Wild Mage for giggles. So its a bit of a hack but its tons of fun

karnor00

A cleric/mage dual (in whichever order) is very different to a cleric/mage multi class.

The dual class version is essentially a single class with slightly delayed advancement but some bonus low level spells from the other class. The multi class version has much delayed advancement, but has both classes at full power.

If you really want to dual, then I would suggest cleric > mage. Because 4-5 levels of cleric spells is probably more valuable than 4-5 levels of mage spells. Mainly because there are a lot of great low level cleric spells, but most of the really good mage spells are high level.

teslates

Do cleric spells improve after he duals to a mage? For example animate dead? I dual from a cleric at lvl 10, when I get lvl 15 with the mage will I be able to summon skel. warriors?
The same with barksin, does it add the lvl of the other class or only the first one?

Thanks

Bercon

Nope. You'll always cast them at level 10. Mage levels don't affect cleric spells.