What should be done about BG2 + TOB

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lordkim

Upper right corner there is a wheel.

Edit* your welcome @Sergio

O_Bruce

I don't know how much of your points can be implemented into actual game, but I have to say something about Ascension. I know what it does, and sure, it makes Throne of Bhaal generally better. But it also increases difficulty of fighting with The Five and Amelyssan drasticly - I would like to remind you that BG2:EE wasn't mean only for hardcore players, but also for new ones. And for newbies, Ascension would be just too difficult to beat. Hell, I doubt I would ever be able to beat this freaking mod.

BLack_XIII

Sergio said:

hi everyone,

today I founded that you are remaking Baldur's gate and I think I could give an hint or two about what Baldur's gate 2 + Tob lacks, because I played these two games extensively and I know every part of them. I cannot give hints about Baldur's gate 1: I didn't play it as much as the sequels, and so on that matter I cannot help you

Here is a list about what I guess should be done for Bg2.

Have a nice read.

Content tweaks:

1) you should try to rebalance the evil path.
Most of the times not only you will get lesser rewards by choosing the evil route, but considerably less xp! And there is another problem: you can't play some quests if you are evil.

Spoiler : Let's look at the quest "Animal Trouble in Trademeet "

The Trademeet's mayor asks you to help him with the wild beasts invading Trademeet, and asks you to bargain or at least solve the problem with the druids, that are located in a grove near the city.

While you are going to solve the quest, a dwarf comes to you and asks you to poison the lakes of the Druid Grove, to make druids pay for the problem they caused.

If you take the evil route, not only the reward for poisoning the druid grove is not that good, but you are cut out of much experience (I'm talking about the Mayor feasting you with a ceremony for having solved the druid problem), and you won't get the quest about the two families clash.

Same thing on the Underdark:
Why , if I give the silver dragon eggs to the Demon Lord, I am going not only to take a very weak reward ( does someone like that Halberd, seriously?), and I'm cut out of much experience that I should be getting (I'm referring to the xp that are given to every single party member)?



2) Add some evil kits to Baldur's gate 2
I want some good evil kits, without going too far (I don't want overpowered things like Weimer's antipaladin).

One thing, though: just a question. In D&D, if a character from good becomes evil (let's look at a paladin , for example) isn't he supposed to get other powers, that mirrors the old one he had?
If this is what is likely to happen, why it isn't added the possibily to the main character to fall for the lust of power: after all, when you are doing the Trials in hell, isn't it supposed that it could corrupts you?




3) A new NPC, evil, preferably a thief (I'm seriously annoyed by Jan Jansen after the 6th playthrough..)
I have a npc in mind, that could have a very amazing background: Valen.
Not only she could have much to talk about (How did Bodhi find her? Did she completely give up to his istincts? Does he murder anyone? Does he feel pain for being a vampire? What was his life before becoming Bodhi's servant? ]
It would be cool also if you could romance her: would you manipulate Valen? Would you try to change her, although slightly? The romance itself could lie around some very mature content and definitely add some freshness to the romances that are currently available
Valen was already used in another mod, but apart from choosing always the most evil during the walkthrough, that mod doesn't add much.

4) The ability to corrupt party members: I never liked the fact that you can redeem Viconia, but you cannot corrupt anyone (beside Anomen... but that's another pair of chair because the choice is still limited)

5) Dryad acorn quests: Seriously, I want an Evil route for this quest..

6) The unseeing eye: what about an Evil route? I find it hard to believe that Gaal cannot find an use for the main character

7) The slavers: what about an Evil route to help them? And what about using Hendak and Lehtinan as a starting point?


8) Fix BG2 Ending: who are these people around the table talking about "Abdel"?





Tob content:
1) Ascension : I read in another topic that some user asked you to introduce Ascension content inside BG2 TOB. He is definitely right.

What Ascension adds to Tob for people that didn't play it:

- choices for both alignment (evil or good) : can get a definitely powerful ally while facing Amelyssan on the throne of Blood.
- Improve the slayer: control over the slayer improves, together with the power of the form.
- Add powers after every pocket challenge into Tob: the control over the mark of Bhaal grants more powers.
- An awesome ending boss fight: You know what I mean...

I will go further than that user and I will suggest to add another mod, together with Ascension:
Wheels of prophecy [http://www.gibberlings3.net/readmes/readme-wheels.html]

In the end, but I maybe going a little too far, I would suggest to add also the yellow dragon encounter inside Abazigal lair added by the mod SCSII.
Finally these yellow dragon eggs founded their right use!

Ah: I also realize that maybe I'm dreaming, but it would be cool , if you could redeem Irenicus in the end of Ascension. I know that I'm asking a lot, but I like to dream :O [http://www.spellholdstudios.net/ie/redemption]
or maybe add him like a joinable npc [http://www.spellholdstudios.net/ie/lr]


2) Banter and endings.

I was satisfied by almost all endings, but for one,the one related to Sarevok.
According to me, Sarevok was rushed.
He should have at least 4 finals.

- Sarevok helping you with Godhood (good sarevok with good GOD) [sometimes I dream that as a gift to Sarevok, we could resurrect Tamoko; why not... I'm a good God.. Though I never understand why this game assume that we killed her... I remember I spared her: definitely this is a subject the developers should work on]
- Sarevok helping you after your ascension to Godhood (evil sarevok that does not betray an evil main character) [If I recall correctly, this ending is currently added by Banter packs V12]
- Sarevok helping you after your ascension to Godhood (evil Sarevok that betrays an evil main character)
- The current sarevok ending (though if the current ending is removed I wouldn't feel sad) or a reworked Sarevok ending for pc that do not ascend to Godhood.


Definitely, the difference of "behaviour" by Sarevok should be revolving around how you talk to him: do you share the same goals? Does he like your vision of things?
Add more dialogues: Sarevok deserves them.

3) Fix the Aerie plot around the child between you and her. I cannot understand why the solar won't even ask you about your child ( isn't him supposed to be at least 1\4 son of Bhaal?)

4) Fix the HLA: Fundamentally, the way they are made currently on TOB is not the best. I would like to see a complete overhaul.
There are two mods that do a really amazing work about it:
http://www.spellholdstudios.net/ie/refinements + http://www.spellholdstudios.net/ie/rr/
Up to you to find a way to implement them, I'm rather interested to see what you are gonna do ;D



Some slight tweaks:
- Make Irenicus drop the cloak of Balduran, after fighting him in Hell, or maybe Suldanesselar.
- I experienced that the Italian version of Bg2 lacks of the music when you are changing chapter, and the narrator start speaking: if you can , make the music appear once again.
- Free action tweak ( how come that haste is influenced by free action?)
- Please solve the riddle around potion of everlasting and the gemjump ( do they exist?)
- Make charisma open new ways of dealing with clashing party members


I will keep adding to this post other points as soon as they come to my mind
Thanks for reading.
Sergio

Can i quote everything *_*?

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Tanthalas

@Sergio

I think he already has tried it, that's why he made that post.

drakerd

Good post, I agree with all of your points. I really hope the devs look at this and can implement most of these improvements!

O_Bruce

Sergio said:

ote>
Try the mod before talking about it :P.

Fail, I actually tried this. Hence "I doubt I would ever be able to beat this freaking mod."

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Quartz

So basically ADD A BUNCH OF STUFF FOR EVIL CHARACTERS.

Not that you don't have a point, mind you. I have never gone evil routes for the reasons you said; there is sooooo little incentive to. Heck, I can still roll in the sack with Viconia as a good character. Feels good man

Knettgummi

I think you have some good ideas, @Sergio, although many of them would require meddling with the existing content to a degree that I doubt will make it into BG2EE because of legal restrictions.

I see no reason why they can't be implemented through community mods, though. And some already are, as you point out, which means it's just a matter of ensuring that the mods are compatible with the EE release.

Communard

ZelgadisGW said:

I don't know how much of your points can be implemented into actual game, but I have to say something about Ascension. I know what it does, and sure, it makes Throne of Bhaal generally better. But it also increases difficulty of fighting with The Five and Amelyssan drasticly - I would like to remind you that BG2:EE wasn't mean only for hardcore players, but also for new ones. And for newbies, Ascension would be just too difficult to beat. Hell, I doubt I would ever be able to beat this freaking mod.

The "tougher fights" components are all optional on install, persoally I just install the improved plot components and the Mellissan changes, which are the real attractions of the mod, leaving combat unchanged.

Knettgummi

If Ascension is implemented in EE, and I hope it is, it might be a good idea to somehow gradually introduce the "tougher fights" with higher difficulty settings.