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[spoiler] Who can actually solve the Genies riddle?

EnterHaerDalisEnterHaerDalis Member Posts: 813
in General Discussion (Spoiler Warning!)
I remember back in my weed smokin days just staring at this baked out of my mind for like 5 hours trying to wrap my head around it lol

Who was able to solve this on their own? I tip my hat to those who can...

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Comments

  • nanonano Member Posts: 1,632
    Ha yeah I had to get out the pencil and paper for this one. Took me a while to even understand the question though I did solve it in the end.
  • ChildofBhaal599ChildofBhaal599 Member Posts: 1,781
    you can narrow it down to 50 50 because it says the princess is as old as the prince will be, implying that the princess is older. from there I just guess and got it right the last time I was there :)
  • shrekdjshrekdj Member Posts: 50
    edited November 2013
    This was really simple, yes it was tricky but the concept is based on common sense.

    I could be wrong in my way for the solution.

    What I did was FIRSTLY to look for the option that matches "Princess is older than Prince" and validates it, because Princess is twice the age of the Prince meaning Prince is younger to the Princess

    So, possible answers are 1 and 3

    But, option 1 can't be the answer simple because Princess is twice as old as the Prince WAS , which option 3 makes up in relation to option 1.

    3. Prince = 30, Princess = 40 ( Princess is twice the age of Prince in option 1)

    Basically options are inter-related and their past ages are also a part of the options. We just have to relate one option (current age) with another (older age) that validates,
    (a) Princess is older than Prince
    (b) But, Princess age should be twice in the Past of any age Prince was.









  • MechaliburMechalibur Member Posts: 265
    edited November 2013
    There's probably a way to turn it into an algebra problem, but I just did trial and error. The hardest part was wrapping my head around how the question was worded.

    His second question is a lot easier!
  • TsyrithTsyrith Member Posts: 180
    edited November 2013
    It's the "half the sum of their present age" part that got me, when it's not the combined total of both their ages at all. Only clued in when I focused on "age" not being plural and "sum" being only a referential term, not an actionable one.

    In fact, I don't know why the last part of the riddle is worded like that at all, when it's only the age of the princess that's important.

    edit: Though, looking at it again, the use of "their" was likely perspective. This is why I both love and hate writing.
  • CoM_SolaufeinCoM_Solaufein Member Posts: 2,606
    I just remember the answer from the original BG2 game guide. I'm not good with math and I dislike riddles.
  • CoM_SolaufeinCoM_Solaufein Member Posts: 2,606
    My brains just turned to mush.
  • MathsorcererMathsorcerer Member Posts: 3,044
    The kicker is that that problem wasn't even too difficult, compared to some of the ones I have seen elsewhere.
  • nanonano Member Posts: 1,632
    Mathsorcerer said:

    The kicker is that that problem wasn't even too difficult, compared to some of the ones I have seen elsewhere.

    Now I want to see these problems...
  • MungriMungri Member Posts: 1,645
    I just spent ages in notepad trying to turn it into algebra.

    I couldnt so again I cheated and looked up the answer.
  • QuartzQuartz Member Posts: 3,853
    EnterHaerDalis said:

    I remember back in my weed smokin days just staring at this baked out of my mind for like 5 hours trying to wrap my head around it lol

    Dude ... this thread just wins, so much, because of this. Had me laughing so hard dude
  • shrekdjshrekdj Member Posts: 50
    edited November 2013
    Tsyrith said:



    In fact, I don't know why the last part of the riddle is worded like that at all, when it's only the age of the princess that's important.

    edit: Though, looking at it again, the use of "their" was likely perspective. This is why I both love and hate writing.

    the last part says, ".. when the princess's age was half the sum of their present age".

    It means both Prince and Princess's age has to be same because Princess is twice as old as Prince was... meaning Princess is not twice the age but twice of what Prince's age was.

    Note the difference between (twice as old as) and (twice the age).

    In short, Princess has to be (twice the age) to be half the sum of their age's put together, be it past or present!.. This was to simply put to confuse the reader.

    AND thats why I completely ignored it right from the start because the Options clearly show that Princess is not twice the age BUT twice as old as Prince was, meaning Prince is not half the age of Princess.

  • Syntia13Syntia13 Member Posts: 514
    Oh that one! :D I like math and logic puzzles, so this was a treat for me. I did solve it on paper, though I admit it took me longer than similar riddle asked in prison in BG1 (you know, when the child killer started bragging about how many children he killed). I kinda wished back then that more puzzles were constructed like this, but on the other hand I realize it would frustrate a lot of players who don't care about math at all. Still, it's one more thing to love this game for - once in a while it would look you in the eye and say: 'hey, geek. We see you. Have a cookie. Now carry on playing.' ^__^
  • RazaDelromRazaDelrom Member Posts: 149
    Mathsorcerer said:

    The princess' current age = h. The prince's current age = k. The princess' age at a certain point in the past was (h + k)/2. The prince's age at that time was k - [h - (h+k)/2] which, after a little algebra, gives us (3k-h)/2. In exactly (h-k) years the prince will be h years old and the princess will be h+(h-k) = 2h-k years old. At that time, she will be twice as old as he was at that point in the past so (2h-k) = 2*[(3k-h)/2]. At this point, you cannot solve for either h or k *but* if you examine the ratio h/k you will see that there is only one possible solution.

    Hm, I minimized it to 3 h = 4 k. I think that it's easier on the eyes. ^^
  • ArktosaArktosa Member Posts: 73
    It might be a hard math question but it was a well worthy xp boost !
  • ZarakinthishZarakinthish Member Posts: 214
    I seem to recall figuring this out after a few minutes. Sorting through the wording of the riddle was probably the hardest part.
  • simplessimples Member Posts: 540
    easiest way to solve this is to draw it out in bars- for example:
    _ _ _ = prince
    -- = princess
    i didn't take the exact numbers of the question this time, but that's how i figured it out.
    i gave a simplified version of this as an exercise to kids (10-11 year-olds) in my class and they worked it out just fine
  • RazaDelromRazaDelrom Member Posts: 149
    simples said:

    easiest way to solve this is to draw it out in bars- for example:
    _ _ _ = prince
    -- = princess
    i didn't take the exact numbers of the question this time, but that's how i figured it out.
    i gave a simplified version of this as an exercise to kids (10-11 year-olds) in my class and they worked it out just fine

    Using kids to solve your problem? - "you are such a meany!" says the neutral good character
    and I reply "congrats on using your resources to the full extent"
    xD xD xD
  • simplessimples Member Posts: 540
    i worked it out myself before i let them do it obviously ;)
  • ZarakinthishZarakinthish Member Posts: 214
    I'm surprised nobody has brought up the grisly riddle Neb asks you to escape after you are imprisoned by Angelo.
    Neb said:

    Heh, sure, sure, everyone's wanting out, but does the world really want us out? Maybe it's safer if we all just stay in here, heh... Monster to monster now, murderer to murderer, how many little children passed away at old Neb's hands? Not one, not two, neither four nor seven nor twelve nor twenty but the next one, the next one in the sequence...

  • JarlealeJarleale Member Posts: 114
    edited November 2013
    Hmmmm. Is it the last two numbers +1? Giving 33?

    I checked the answer and it's correct.

    Solved the genie one by algebra though. That one is much harder than neb's.
  • CenerCener Member Posts: 45
    It's a little off-topic, but...
    On the screenshot, if you fix one of the character's cusror on the ground, you can see the others cursor moving as if they were animated !
  • MathsorcererMathsorcerer Member Posts: 3,044
    RazaDelrom said:


    Hm, I minimized it to 3 h = 4 k. I think that it's easier on the eyes. ^^

    Definitely. I was just going to leave the details to those who wished to follow the path the solution.

  • OneAngryMushroomOneAngryMushroom Member Posts: 564
    I dealt with those types of algebra problems enough in 9th grade, Like hell I'm going to solve one during my down time...
  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,653
    edited November 2013
    @Mathsorcerer, do I understand you correctly that the answer cannot be obtained without being given the multiple choices? I always thought that the problem was a solveable system of equations. Can you derive the correct answer algebraically (h=40, k=30), without referring to given answers?

    If not, then I have learned something here. It's not a pure algebra problem, it's a logic problem where some algebraic manipulation helps - "Given these conditions, which of the following four statements could be true?"

    I never could simplify the conditions down to the easy ratio like you have - I could always narrow it down to the two answers where the princess is older, but I had to guess 50-50 from there. Kudos on your logical and mathematical acumen.
  • JarlealeJarleale Member Posts: 114
    The thing is that all you get is a ratio: h/k = 4/3.

    This means there are an infinite set of solutions. Luckily, five ratios are given as alternatives:
    a) h/k = 3/2
    b) h/k = 3/4
    c) h/k = 4/3
    d) h/k = 2/3
    e) h/k = 1

    Out of these alternatives, only c) fits the answer of the equation.
  • DavidWDavidW Member Posts: 823
    You can read off directly that it only gives you a ratio, in fact: just note from the original statement of the puzzle that doubling or halving the ages would leave the condition invariant.
  • shrekdjshrekdj Member Posts: 50
    DavidW said:

    You can read off directly that it only gives you a ratio, in fact: just note from the original statement of the puzzle that doubling or halving the ages would leave the condition invariant.

    Exactly
    It is about reading between the lines, going through options and pick the correct one based on logic rather following a set calculation, after all its a game and the approach needs to be simply judge the options meaningfully integrated into the puzzle.
    We don't find such games any more with that qualify to such level of immersion.
    The closest pick would be Witcher Series and upcoming Divinity:Original Sin
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