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Was the game rules changed at all from BG2?

Im finding the game way more difficult than I remember, its kinda off putting. I remember leaving the first dungeon and then smashing that one house to get that special katana...no chance this time around.
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  • WigginnsWigginns Member Posts: 18
    It could be that you are playing on a different difficulty than the last time you played.

    I believe the only thing that's changed is that song of the AI scripts have been updated so that you can't "cheese" some fights at low level.

    For example, Firkraag the Red Dragon used be able to be almost killed before the battle even started if you attacked him while he was neutral. Not sure what may have been changed about the encounter you reference.
  • OdiumvexOdiumvex Member Posts: 6
    No same difficulty...now I can't beat the group of adventures in the sewers
  • GamingFreakGamingFreak Member Posts: 639
    The AI has been upgraded a little more so that they know to use potions and whatnot, and thieves who carry Potions of Invisibility will attempt to backstab you, so there's that. Otherwise, I know of no "difficulty" changes. Cloud Kill can easily devastate that bandit group in the sewers you mentioned, though I went around a corner and picked them off one by one as they chased me.
  • booinyoureyesbooinyoureyes Member Posts: 6,164
    Odiumvex said:

    No same difficulty...now I can't beat the group of adventures in the sewers


    They were always tough as hell though
    needed web and infinite fireballs, and had to really hit that jerk dwarf with the crossbow asap
  • SkaffenSkaffen Member Posts: 709
    Sell the wand of cloudkill and pickpocket it with Jan after drinking a potion. It will have 50 charges now. You can do the two inns with adventurer group fights (Promenade & Bridge) and the sewers group with 2-3 webs and spamming cloudkills. After that you should have decent gear and cash for another good item like girdle of strength.
  • booinyoureyesbooinyoureyes Member Posts: 6,164
    Skaffen said:

    Sell the wand of cloudkill and pickpocket it with Jan after drinking a potion. It will have 50 charges now. You can do the two inns with adventurer group fights (Promenade & Bridge) and the sewers group with 2-3 webs and spamming cloudkills. After that you should have decent gear and cash for another good item like girdle of strength.

    I never use my wands though... I always save them for the emergency that never seems to come, and when it does I forget all about them in my bag of holding (really my bag of hoarding)
  • nietzschelivesnietzschelives Member Posts: 36
    This is incredibly embarrassing; but I just got killed 3 times in a row by those hobgoblins in the Copper Coronet sewers. I've played through BG2 maybe a half dozen times, and I've started the game many more times than that. I've always gone straight to the Coronet, fought Lehtinan and then proceeded to the sewers. Not once have I found that section of the game challenging. This time though... Hobgoblins! Seriously! Ugh...
  • GamingFreakGamingFreak Member Posts: 639

    This is incredibly embarrassing; but I just got killed 3 times in a row by those hobgoblins in the Copper Coronet sewers. I've played through BG2 maybe a half dozen times, and I've started the game many more times than that. I've always gone straight to the Coronet, fought Lehtinan and then proceeded to the sewers. Not once have I found that section of the game challenging. This time though... Hobgoblins! Seriously! Ugh...

    To be fair those hobgoblins have moderately decent THAC0, I remember my frontliners getting hit pretty hard a couple times by them over the play-through.
  • OdiumvexOdiumvex Member Posts: 6
    I've been trying to go by my instincts of what I did my first time around and umm yea i don't remember loading and dying so many times...i know my character got to the point that i could solo the game...now im using EE keeper playing with spells ...kinda shitty
  • OdiumvexOdiumvex Member Posts: 6
    Yea i'm not gonna lie. I'm very close to chalking this up to a waste of money and will recommend "stay away" to people I know will buy it. There's a spell caster in the group, I've tried Dispel Magic, Remove Magic, spell thrust...he just goes on his marry way unaffected...this was the same issue I had in other encounters...its like my spells aren't working the way they're supposed to
  • DrHappyAngryDrHappyAngry Member Posts: 1,577
    Wigginns said:

    For example, Firkraag the Red Dragon used be able to be almost killed before the battle even started if you attacked him while he was neutral. Not sure what may have been changed about the encounter you reference.

    He went down with a huge mound of traps and 2 cloud kills for me, without getting a chance to strike back.
  • bman86bman86 Member Posts: 115
    really? I'm flying through it...just finished killing that band of adventurers, flew through the cult of unseeing. I killed firkragg at level 10 (a few loads there ;D ). I haven't really noticed it being more difficult tbh. Maybe you've lost your touch, or playing a different class? If it were easy, you'd get bored with it
  • bman86bman86 Member Posts: 115

    Wigginns said:

    For example, Firkraag the Red Dragon used be able to be almost killed before the battle even started if you attacked him while he was neutral. Not sure what may have been changed about the encounter you reference.

    He went down with a huge mound of traps and 2 cloud kills for me, without getting a chance to strike back.
    got to be careful cloudkilling him. If he gets down to near death he fully heals himself again. I used cloud, but only to get him down to badly injured...still a tough fight though, but so worth it haha
  • OdiumvexOdiumvex Member Posts: 6
    I was a sorcerer but now i'm trying this dragon disciple out. I'm only 9 but I don't remember ever being "ill come back later" ever. I feel pause was enough to "cheese" ..whatever that means..
  • The big thing I've noticed is that the AI is now better about not letting you separate groups using line of sight. Take the group of mercenaries in the Temple Sewers: My usual strategy with them would be to grab the attention of one, kite them way down the tunnel, then kill them away from the group. Now it seems much more likely that the rest of the enemies will follow if one of them breaks off to pursue you. Also, they seem to be a little bit better about realizing that if a spellcaster just threw a greater malison at them and retreated, they had probably better give pursuit...
  • bman86bman86 Member Posts: 115
    pause is cheese... that's like saying using anything but your fists is cheese

    maybe try using a fighter then? What type of roll did you get on your charname creation? Maybe you rolled crappy and have poor stats?
  • DrHappyAngryDrHappyAngry Member Posts: 1,577
    bman86 said:

    Wigginns said:

    For example, Firkraag the Red Dragon used be able to be almost killed before the battle even started if you attacked him while he was neutral. Not sure what may have been changed about the encounter you reference.

    He went down with a huge mound of traps and 2 cloud kills for me, without getting a chance to strike back.
    got to be careful cloudkilling him. If he gets down to near death he fully heals himself again. I used cloud, but only to get him down to badly injured...still a tough fight though, but so worth it haha
    Ya, I think it was the pile of traps that made all the difference. I had Jan and Hexxat, so was able to lay out the max of 7. I don't think I'll do that again, well unless I play a bounty hunter. It was pretty cheesy, but so satisfying because of all trouble he gave me on my first playthrough.
  • OdiumvexOdiumvex Member Posts: 6
    I think my final roll was 92 total...I remember spending at least an hour in the original with rolls...I just assumed rolling got better...I just switched my team up to what i think i had before and i'll try again. I've also been just running my character up there instead of the whole team lol
  • bman86bman86 Member Posts: 115
    Odiumvex said:

    I think my final roll was 92 total...I remember spending at least an hour in the original with rolls...I just assumed rolling got better...I just switched my team up to what i think i had before and i'll try again. I've also been just running my character up there instead of the whole team lol

    yeah man. Create yourself a half-orc kensai. Get a 90+ roll, 19 strength, 18 dex, 19 con. Max out dual wield, and place slots on flail. Smash d'Armise Keep (flail of ages ;D ) and in no time you'll be rolf stomping your way across faerun :)
  • FrkunFrkun Member Posts: 52
    Kaigen said:

    The big thing I've noticed is that the AI is now better about not letting you separate groups using line of sight. Take the group of mercenaries in the Temple Sewers: My usual strategy with them would be to grab the attention of one, kite them way down the tunnel, then kill them away from the group. Now it seems much more likely that the rest of the enemies will follow if one of them breaks off to pursue you. Also, they seem to be a little bit better about realizing that if a spellcaster just threw a greater malison at them and retreated, they had probably better give pursuit...

    This is true. It happened to me in the beholder's dungeon. On the bottom-right part of the dungeon there are a lot of beholders together. Before I was able to kill them by luring them outside of the group. In EE it was the most painful combat ever. To succeed in the battle I had to go to the top part of the level where they could not follow me anymore because they got stuck in the tunnel. It was a real pain. And I have quite a good party because I can deal with single beholders not even being touched.
  • KoyoteKoyote Member Posts: 89
    Yes, the AI seems a lot more competent in BG2EE. I've noticed that the game is a lot harder for my play through. That said, mass disruption spells are now very much your friend. Insect plague is the only reason I win most of my battles.
  • jukagajukaga Member Posts: 49
    Frkun said:

    Kaigen said:



    This is true. It happened to me in the beholder's dungeon. On the bottom-right part of the dungeon there are a lot of beholders together. Before I was able to kill them by luring them outside of the group. In EE it was the most painful combat ever. To succeed in the battle I had to go to the top part of the level where they could not follow me anymore because they got stuck in the tunnel. It was a real pain. And I have quite a good party because I can deal with single beholders not even being touched.

    Tell me about it, I didn't even bother with the unseeing eye quest till i could afford the shield of Balduran.

  • mylegbigmylegbig Member Posts: 292
    edited November 2013
    Odiumvex said:

    Yea i'm not gonna lie. I'm very close to chalking this up to a waste of money and will recommend "stay away" to people I know will buy it. There's a spell caster in the group, I've tried Dispel Magic, Remove Magic, spell thrust...he just goes on his marry way unaffected...this was the same issue I had in other encounters...its like my spells aren't working the way they're supposed to

    Your level is too low. Dispel and Remove Magic aren't working because those spells rarely work against targets that are a higher level than you. I believe the mage there is level 14+. You're level 9. Of course your dispels aren't working. Spell Thrust only gets rid of the weakest of spell protections. Everything is working as intended.

    If you really don't want to come back later, I suggest cheesier tactics. Launch Web+Stinking Cloud+Cloudkill into the unrevealed area and then blast with more area of effect damage and disabling spells. Even if that doesn't kill all of them that should weaken them significantly.
  • Zzidolfas86Zzidolfas86 Member Posts: 77
    *Does seem to be a ton of strange shit going on in Bg2:ee combat at the moment. Like a golem hitting normal hits (yes, I had a bloody helmet on! :p) for 50+ damage and the combat log said it was only for like 20.

    *Stun spells also seem impossible to save against, no matter how well protected you are. I tried to max out my main with every possible item and spell I found, but still stuff like symbol stun seems to have a 100% hit rate against me. I think out of the 20+ I have used myself, I manage to stun gibberling in the Saradush sewers.... :|

    *Random NPC`s called "Guard" just totaly pissed all over Dorn in a 1v1 fight too, even with Dorn popping greater whirlwind + pre-used poison weapon @ -8 AC.

    The great hero of Baldur`s Gate, roflstomped by guard swag ladies and gentlemen.

    *There are also a ton of spells that just totaly ignore immunity. Few web spells that just ignore free action like a boss, a normal entangle spell working on a char with 100% spell resist and ring of free action etc...

    No idea if this is intended or a bug or w/e, but some updated and functional tooltips would be cool.

    *I also found the name of the mountain bears you can summon as a druid interesting.... :|

    The fight vs Szass tam you do was also a complete and utter failfest. I hope this will be remade or removed, because it was (IMO) shait and has no place in Baldurs Gate 2. Also the fight before needs a few more hours of work on the tooltips alone.
    Beamdogs way of trying to make fights harder: Spam invis potions (that are not possible to dispel with spells exept for "Dispel Magic", or the NPC`s just have permanent non-detection you get no tooltip info about) and healing potions.... Oh, and make random rabble NPC`s stronger than Adamantite golems (logic) :p


  • MadhaxMadhax Member Posts: 1,416
    @Zzidolfas86 I haven't encountered any of your complaints so far. I always buff Protection from Evil 10ft radius at the start of the day, and my party will occasionally shrug off a Lich's entire Time Stop burst of symbols. Several items that grant a "Free Action" buff actually have specific immunities rather than a blanket immunity, so you might check that. Can't comment on a random guard taking on Dorn 1v1, either.

    Anyway, overall, I've found BG2EE to be similarly difficult-but-fair as the original game. The group in the sewers, for example, was always a medium-to-high level, well-equipped group. Not much has changed. If you can't strip spell protections and crowd control powerful melee opponents, then yes, they'll beat you. Neither that nor the Celestial Fury encounter were ever easy fights in any version of this game.
  • nietzschelivesnietzschelives Member Posts: 36
    ^After playing a bit, I agree. I was getting stomped early on because I wasn't taking early fights seriously. Also, @zzidolfas86 the golem's damage discrepancy might be due to difficulty level (which increases damage taken.) I do remember combat log/actual damage discrepancies in the original game, and I think that might have been the reason.
  • tennisgolfbolltennisgolfboll Member Posts: 457
    Have not seen any odd stuff. Save vs stuns works, damage seems ok. Firkraag is really buffed though
  • Zzidolfas86Zzidolfas86 Member Posts: 77
    Firkraag just stood still and died after 15 seconds for me, after I had spent 3 minutes prepping potions, buffing up, spreading out etc... Same thing at the shadow dragon too I might add. Maybe it is somehow related to those mountain bears with the messed up names.

    And to answer the lucky guy up there, no.. I tried changing diff settings back and forth. Always the same result with the golems.

    Free action is... free action, there is no if-or-else with it. Some spells still root you even with it up.
    The first issue came with some web traps related to hexxat`s quest. When you run into bloated spiders in a long hallway. The other I remember off the top of my head was the shadow dragon in Suldanessilar or w/e the city name be. =)

    At first I was wondering if it got removed by something, but nothing came up.

    "Guard" you run into in Neera`s personal quest in Tob, some of them take powerful shit and hit you on the head with it. Solution is to tank with mantle or the likes, they are not hard, its just that "Guard" should not be bitch slapping people who battle gods and dragons harder than "Elite Fire-Giants", get my point ? :p Its stupid as fuck.
  • bman86bman86 Member Posts: 115

    Firkraag just stood still and died after 15 seconds for me, after I had spent 3 minutes prepping potions, buffing up, spreading out etc... Same thing at the shadow dragon too I might add. Maybe it is somehow related to those mountain bears with the messed up names.

    And to answer the lucky guy up there, no.. I tried changing diff settings back and forth. Always the same result with the golems.

    Free action is... free action, there is no if-or-else with it. Some spells still root you even with it up.
    The first issue came with some web traps related to hexxat`s quest. When you run into bloated spiders in a long hallway. The other I remember off the top of my head was the shadow dragon in Suldanessilar or w/e the city name be. =)

    At first I was wondering if it got removed by something, but nothing came up.

    "Guard" you run into in Neera`s personal quest in Tob, some of them take powerful shit and hit you on the head with it. Solution is to tank with mantle or the likes, they are not hard, its just that "Guard" should not be bitch slapping people who battle gods and dragons harder than "Elite Fire-Giants", get my point ? :p Its stupid as fuck.

    You have some odd stuff going on... I haven't come across any of that crap
  • SkaffenSkaffen Member Posts: 709
    So far the old content seems the same for me and challenge is low (I scout a lot with hidden Jan and then start the fight with multiple AoE spells). The new content though is a serious challenge. I did Neera's quests very early and gad to pull all stops to win the fight. Great fun :)
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