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Tazok can be killed in the Bandit camp (Continuity issue)

KeithSKeithS Member Posts: 623
edited July 2012 in Fixed
It's possible to kill Tazok in the Bandit camp, however he later appears in the Undercity.

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Added MIHP1.ITM to TAZOK.CRE (this ensures that he can never drop below 1hp, so the player cannot outright kill him). He will withdraw after the player defeats him.
Put his special bracers in his chest in AR1901 so players don't miss them.

(Originally found and fixed in DudlyFix)
Post edited by Bhryaen on
«1

Comments

  • BalquoBalquo Member, Developer Posts: 2,746
    Impossible to kill. Works.
  • WinthalWinthal Member Posts: 366
    Wouldn't it be better to remove his copy of the gauntlets of weapon expertise instead of making them easily accessible in a chest? It's already one of the best items in the game, and available early on if you know where to find them... killing Tazok in the bandit camp was more of an exploit than something that *should* have happened before, so technically, the player shouldn't be able to have two gauntlets.
  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    Unless something went really wrong, you can't get two gauntlets because you can no longer kill Tazok in the bandit camp.
  • BalquoBalquo Member, Developer Posts: 2,746
    Yes, but @KeithS placed the gauntlets of weapon expertise in a chest... to keep the exploiters happy? haha. Now that I think about it I would tend to agree with @Winthal and remove the bracers completely as you were never meant to kill Tazok in the first place and therefore never meant to receive the gauntlets.
  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    I don't know about that @Balquo. why would they create the item and give it a description if the player was never intended to get it?

    Or is there a second pair of the gauntlets in the game? If that's the case I can see your and Winthal's reasoning.
  • BalquoBalquo Member, Developer Posts: 2,746
    @Tanthalas You can get them at Firewine Bridge.

    Not certain right now if there are others.
  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    Ah, I see it now.

    Lol, well, maybe we shouldn't remove all the fun from exploiters. But yeah, perhaps it should be removed from the chest.
  • cmorgancmorgan Member Posts: 707
    BG1NPC (and I think SCS or another mod as well) reverses this behavior in Tutu/BGT, allowing players to kill Tazok, then have Kivan have a dialog about his ressurection/restoration by Sarevok at the end. But it definitely is important vanilla behavior to give him that minhp item. The bracers are good either place, I think - the bracers are definitely good stuff to have in terms of low level parties and especially in terms of weaker roleplaying parties. A PC Bard, a Sorceror, a Wild Mage, a Cleric/Thief, Imoen, and a Fighter walk into a bar... the kits will encourage "weaker" class exploration, and it would be nice to have things that can help them level the playing field.
  • BhryaenBhryaen Member Posts: 2,874
    I wasn't even aware of the 2nd pair of those bracers being on Tazok. I'd rather they not be there in the chest as well. Plenty to loot at the bandit camp already, and there's already a pair by fighting the braggart at the Firewine Ruins, like @Balquo said...
  • AceofWandsAceofWands Member Posts: 33
    It is possible to kill Firebeard in the prologue, but he still appears later on in Beregost.

    OK, so you usually have to employ cheesy methods to kill him in the prologue but he's worth over 3000 XP and the gold he owns can be used to negate nearly all of the rep loss at the nearby temple. It's very tempting - a thief can exit Candlekeep at level 3.
  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    @AceofWands

    Well:

    http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/296/firebead-elvenhair-appears-in-begegost-even-if-he-was-killed-in-candlekeep
  • MornmagorMornmagor Member Posts: 1,160
    edited July 2012
    sarevok57 said:

    maybe a tanked up biff the understudy, that would be awesome

    LOL Beef the Under-Stud? Awesome indeed :D
  • BhryaenBhryaen Member Posts: 2,874
    Mornmagor said:

    sarevok57 said:

    maybe a tanked up biff the understudy, that would be awesome

    LOL Beef the Under-Stud? Awesome indeed :D
    Reminds me of Robin Williams' caution to swimmers in the movie "The World According to Garp":
    "WATCH OUT FOR THE UNDERTOAD!"

  • QuartzQuartz Member Posts: 3,853
    Tanthalas said:

    But on the other hand, not everyone will kill the braggart either. I mean, if you're a good aligned character you don't go around killing people just because they're idiots.

    I don't know, I can see both sides of the argument. I'm kind of leaning on leaving them in the chest is a better option now.

    I guess I don't play good aligned characters very well. xD
  • KenKen Member Posts: 226
    He isen't supposed to be killed, so you aren't meant to get those bracers from him OR a chest in that area. Leave them to that guy at the Firewine bridge.. Makes exploration of that area even more exiting!
  • AranneasAranneas Member Posts: 282
    edited August 2012
    Tamoko can cast Resurrection from a scroll. Problem?
  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 6,002
    but what if you kill tamoko prematurely as well? which is what i usually do just for spite :)
  • AranneasAranneas Member Posts: 282
    edited August 2012
    You can't meet Tamoko without entering Baldur's Gate, can you? Which should be impossible before finishing the Bandit Camp last I checked.

    ed: And there's always the mercenaries in the Iron Throne tower and the Catacombs, both of which have a cleric or two in the pack. One of the nice things about having the resources of an organization like the Iron Throne at your disposal is having the resources of an organization like the Iron Throne at your disposal.
  • CommunardCommunard Member Posts: 556
    edited August 2012
    It really amazes me that in a setting where the Outer Planes have seemingly installed a revolving door (such is the cheapness of death), that "killing" a character is considered so significant at all. It seems like a bit of a logical inconsistency. Nobody except PCs ever get rezzed.
  • AranneasAranneas Member Posts: 282
    Communard said:

    It really amazes me that in a setting where the Outer Planes have seemingly installed a revolving door (such is the cheapness of death), that "killing" a character is considered so significant at all. It seems like a bit of a logical inconsistency. Nobody except PCs ever get rezzed.

    3e makes this pretty hilarious with material component casting

    "Well I COULD snatch you back from the jaws of death.. but I'll have to spend all these diamonds to do it. Which would I rather have: you back in my life... or diamonds?"
  • CommunardCommunard Member Posts: 556
    Aranneas said:

    Communard said:

    It really amazes me that in a setting where the Outer Planes have seemingly installed a revolving door (such is the cheapness of death), that "killing" a character is considered so significant at all. It seems like a bit of a logical inconsistency. Nobody except PCs ever get rezzed.

    3e makes this pretty hilarious with material component casting

    "Well I COULD snatch you back from the jaws of death.. but I'll have to spend all these diamonds to do it. Which would I rather have: you back in my life... or diamonds?"
    That's why the first thing you do in a 3e campaign is find and take over a diamond mine...
  • AranneasAranneas Member Posts: 282
    Communard said:

    Aranneas said:

    Communard said:

    It really amazes me that in a setting where the Outer Planes have seemingly installed a revolving door (such is the cheapness of death), that "killing" a character is considered so significant at all. It seems like a bit of a logical inconsistency. Nobody except PCs ever get rezzed.

    3e makes this pretty hilarious with material component casting

    "Well I COULD snatch you back from the jaws of death.. but I'll have to spend all these diamonds to do it. Which would I rather have: you back in my life... or diamonds?"
    That's why the first thing you do in a 3e campaign is find and take over a diamond mine...
    or have an expedition to the quasi-elemental plane of minerals

  • CommunardCommunard Member Posts: 556
    Aranneas said:

    Communard said:

    Aranneas said:

    Communard said:

    It really amazes me that in a setting where the Outer Planes have seemingly installed a revolving door (such is the cheapness of death), that "killing" a character is considered so significant at all. It seems like a bit of a logical inconsistency. Nobody except PCs ever get rezzed.

    3e makes this pretty hilarious with material component casting

    "Well I COULD snatch you back from the jaws of death.. but I'll have to spend all these diamonds to do it. Which would I rather have: you back in my life... or diamonds?"
    That's why the first thing you do in a 3e campaign is find and take over a diamond mine...
    or have an expedition to the quasi-elemental plane of minerals

    You obviously play at a higher level than me :p
  • AranneasAranneas Member Posts: 282
    Communard said:

    Aranneas said:

    Communard said:

    Aranneas said:

    Communard said:

    It really amazes me that in a setting where the Outer Planes have seemingly installed a revolving door (such is the cheapness of death), that "killing" a character is considered so significant at all. It seems like a bit of a logical inconsistency. Nobody except PCs ever get rezzed.

    3e makes this pretty hilarious with material component casting

    "Well I COULD snatch you back from the jaws of death.. but I'll have to spend all these diamonds to do it. Which would I rather have: you back in my life... or diamonds?"
    That's why the first thing you do in a 3e campaign is find and take over a diamond mine...
    or have an expedition to the quasi-elemental plane of minerals

    You obviously play at a higher level than me :p
    possibly

    most know diamond mines are guarded jealously as fuck though so unless your DM works around you this shouldn't be a cakewalk either
  • CommunardCommunard Member Posts: 556
    Aranneas said:

    Communard said:

    Aranneas said:

    Communard said:

    Aranneas said:

    Communard said:

    It really amazes me that in a setting where the Outer Planes have seemingly installed a revolving door (such is the cheapness of death), that "killing" a character is considered so significant at all. It seems like a bit of a logical inconsistency. Nobody except PCs ever get rezzed.

    3e makes this pretty hilarious with material component casting

    "Well I COULD snatch you back from the jaws of death.. but I'll have to spend all these diamonds to do it. Which would I rather have: you back in my life... or diamonds?"
    That's why the first thing you do in a 3e campaign is find and take over a diamond mine...
    or have an expedition to the quasi-elemental plane of minerals

    You obviously play at a higher level than me :p
    possibly

    most know diamond mines are guarded jealously as fuck though so unless your DM works around you this shouldn't be a cakewalk either
    Lots of non-combat ways though...incite a revolt among the miners, enchant the foreman, bribe the guards, torture the location of a flooded one from a dwarf...;)
  • PoulsenPoulsen Member Posts: 10
    Tanthalas said:

    But on the other hand, not everyone will kill the braggart either. I mean, if you're a good aligned character you don't go around killing people just because they're idiots.

    I don't know, I can see both sides of the argument. I'm kind of leaning on leaving them in the chest is a better option now.

    Excuse me for resurrecting this discussion, but I would rather propose the gauntlets placed on Ardenor Crush instead. Placing it on Ardenor Crush would:
    1 - Make him a less bland and more formidable chieftain of the Chill. As is, I see him as quite easily overlooked compared to his supposed counterpart, the mighty Taugosz Khosann of the Black Talons.
    2 - Bring Ardenor more in line with his canon description (FR15: Gold & Glory, p19), which equips him with magic gauntlets (albeit of Ogre Power). In addition, his 48 HP and 14 thac0 might also well be improved, as the sourcebook says to treat him as a 10th level fighter.
    3 - Put the item to use against the party before acquisition, which IMO would be more satisfying than picking it up from a chest.
  • dawnlancedawnlance Member Posts: 25
    I am wondering what will happen if I take Kivan in my team. Can I kill Tazok in the Bandit's Camp with Kivan? If I cannot, How to complete Kivan's quest?
  • JalilyJalily Member Posts: 4,681
    @dawnlance You can't kill Tazok at that point, but simply completing the camp and moving to Chapter 4 will complete his quest.
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