Irenicus in ToB
EnterHaerDalis
Member Posts: 813
just had a random thought
Wouldn't it be way better if Irenicus was written into ToB and was the one behind killing the bhaalspawn instead of Melissan? Irenicus should of had a brother who was written into SoA and aided him at Spellhold and Suldanessellar. He would be the final SoA fight while Irenicus escapes so you have some sense of conclusion yet still a sense of this isn't over yet.
The ToB story line seems to come up short for many people in terms of captivating them in a nostalgic sense - In my opinion Melissan is far too dull of a character to be the final straw of the entire series.
Irenicus should of been the last stand, the last hurrah, the kiss to send us off since he is the greatest villain to ever be conceived. Sure it might take away from the magic that is SoA as a whole but would lengthen the nostalgia through BG2 in it's entirety
Thoughts?
Wouldn't it be way better if Irenicus was written into ToB and was the one behind killing the bhaalspawn instead of Melissan? Irenicus should of had a brother who was written into SoA and aided him at Spellhold and Suldanessellar. He would be the final SoA fight while Irenicus escapes so you have some sense of conclusion yet still a sense of this isn't over yet.
The ToB story line seems to come up short for many people in terms of captivating them in a nostalgic sense - In my opinion Melissan is far too dull of a character to be the final straw of the entire series.
Irenicus should of been the last stand, the last hurrah, the kiss to send us off since he is the greatest villain to ever be conceived. Sure it might take away from the magic that is SoA as a whole but would lengthen the nostalgia through BG2 in it's entirety
Thoughts?
0
Comments
Alternatively, Imoen. What a twist! Actually I would hate that because I like Imoen and it'd break my heart to kill her but it would make for quite the story. Or Gorion! I mean, why did Sarevok take out Gorion instead of chasing you? Maybe he knows something you don't. Probably too contrived though, let's just go with Bhaal.
I wouldn't want to see Irenicus back. If I kill someone they should stay dead. Looking at you, Sarevok... how many times do I have to put you down?
I would have prefered Irenicus as an ally instead of Sarevok. Though if it gets rid of Mellisan I'm all for it... But seriously, Winthrop's old socks would make a more interesting villain than Mellisan.
@nano
I really like the Imoen idea. Seeing her slowly become evil and twisted over the saga would have been great. Or Bhaal takes over her body, and you have to kill her to stop him... It's all been done before but it's still a hundred times better than what we got in ToB.
But to be honest I don't even like Irenicus that much. (gasp!) He has a cool voice but that's about it. Nothing really makes him stand out for me as a villain, he's just an ultra powerful evil mage, blah blah power, blah blah immortality, revenge, the same things that every evil mage wants. Boring... but that's fine because I just want a villain to kill, one who's irredeemably evil and that I won't feel bad about going all out on. One you can kick the crap out of and be proud for doing so. I want to slay monsters and I don't need a complex backstory for every single one.
Looking back, I don't think Melissan needs depth because both her and Irenicus are about as deep as a teaspoon. She just wasn't that satisfying to beat. Irenicus has generally been a scumbag to you for the entire game and you're itching to put a sword through his head, but Melissan isn't evil enough. Sure, she's power hungry and her plans are evil and generally involve your death, but for most of the game she's not even openly trying to kill you because she's busy plotting everyone else's downfall at the same time. This is what I like about Sarevok in BG1 - while you don't know who he is until much later, you're constantly being jumped by his assassins from the moment you leave Candlekeep. By the end you're more than ready to dish out some payback. In this sense Bhaal makes a good final villain, not only because it fits but because in a way he's responsible for all the crap you've been through. And this is why Irenicus should not have a brother, because it would dilute his evilness.
That said, Melissan suffers primarily due to the fact she's in ToB. Any villain in ToB would have been shoddily done when compared to Sarevok or Irenicus. Melissan could quite easily have been the best villain, I think, had she been the antagonist of a full-blown BG3, as was presumably originally intended.
Imoen- "It was Old Man Elminster all along!"
Elminster - "Ho there wanderer. I would have got away with it too... If it weren't for these pesky kids..."
Khalid - "Wooah.. L-l-like, let's get out of here!!"
Cernd - "Rhood rhon Rhalid
Irenicus' brother? After defeating him, we now have to fight his evil twin? I rather we get to fight Irenicus' mom. That would make for some more interesting play. Then in ToB, we should get Irenicus' mom to join charname's party and make it so that she can be romanced.
brilliant and simple solution. not even worth arguing about it's so perfect
Also Sarevok-like companionship is out of the question - either he wouldn't have magic and be of no use, or he would have, and couldn't be trusted. I don't think there could be any precaution good enough agains a man of that caliber to explain him staying by your side during one of those 16-hour rests.
Amelyssan wasn't bad per se. She just did not get any exposition, no emotional link was formed. Like, at all. Sarevok instilled fear thorugh Gorion, maybe some hatered. Irenicus involved a little fear and lots of hatered. She was just there. It WAS a good plot twist, just needed tripling the amount of dialogues involved.
The lengths I go to in order to educate those beneath me is astounding. I should receive a medal.
Her battle feels like I'm fighting a demi-god (if not god) in a different plane, she has the levels of Irenicus, is a 30 level Cleric and she's a damn good fighter, plus she's huge.
Her appearance is unique enough (not a classic mage or a classic tank like Sarevok in plate) and her quotes are cool. "Doom await thee. You shall suffer."
What kind of bugs me is her voice actor which is Jaheira.
And I like that when you defeat her she doesn't become dust or sent to hell, she is completely annihilated on a spiritual level.
And I choose to think of Ascension as semi-official so the final battle against all of the Five makes her and the final battle even more epic.
What she lacks unfortunately compared to the other two villains, is that she's not personal enough. We don't know much about her except what is said when her consciousness is summoned.
What would have been truly great is if it was revealed that she gave birth to one of Bhaal's progeny... maybe as a mother to Charname (or even Imoen, though it would be less impactful). Now she is obsessed with the power and wants to steal her own child's essence. It would make the final showdown a lot more fascinating.
Some suggested that we should be fighting Bhaal. That would wrong for many reasons. A few of them:
1) If Bhaal was reborn, he would be unkillable unless another god helped Charname. As he would actually be a god.
2) Bhaal would be able to pull a Bane on charname. What Bane did, was that he had a son, Iyachtu Xvim, when he became powerful enough, he just burst out of him like in the Aliens movies. Maybe Bhaal would just kill the remaining Bhaalspawn when he was resurrected as he would in full command of their essences.
Fighting a priestess of Bhaal is as close to fighting Bhaal without actually fighting him.
What I think the developers said was something like: "How do you fight Bhaal without actually fighting him? We know, you fight his strongest priest that holds most of his essence but is not a god, yet."
It's like fighting the Chosen of Bane, Fzoul Chembryl. His most powerful priest that became a demi-god afterwards.