Cleric Tanks - what spells??

Frogman

Hello all - I love the idea of having my cleric tank big bosses and random encounters...but i'm curious what makes them so effective? I guess i really need help with spell choices!! What do you use that makes your Cleric a super effective tank?

Heindrich

A pure cleric is not a particularly good tank/front-liner, they are primarily useful for buffing up/protecting the party with spells like Chant, Remove Fear, Protection from Evil and Defensive Harmony. They can wear armour and carry shields (unlikely a mage) and cast spells at the same time, so Clerics can be reasonably resilient. They can also hit back quite well with a nice blunt weapon, and pump themselves up with Draw Upon Holy Might, which is an awesome spell given how low level it is. However, fighting in the front line is better suited to a Fighter/Cleric than a pure cleric.

You should specify which game you are playing (BG EE or BG 2EE), cos that makes a huge difference in the sort of spells available to you. I mentioned mostly low levels. At higher levels, Chaotic Commands is crucial, and Clerics get some really nice summoning spells.

Time4Tiddy

As Heindrich1988 says, tanking clerics are usually fighter/clerics or fighter->clerics. Having said that, Cleric of Lathander gets a boon spell that (temporarily) can make them a pretty decent short-term tank with bonuses to saving throws, protection from level drain, and extra attack/damage. Once you are higher level, the boon lasts a long time and you will have a couple of casts per day - this is great for tanking certain types of monsters, many of whom would also be affected by Turn Undead. I wouldn't be the only tank in the party, but you would be the best tank for leading the charge into tombs and crypts.

Lemernis

I love the spells that clerics can cast. While not as powerful overall as a mage, they are still great. I tend to use the cleric's spells more than having them melee, actually.

Concentrating here on just BGEE...

Beyond the healing, of course:

* Command Word: Die - extremely powerful for much of BGEE
* Doom - can help take down a tough opponent
* Protection from Evil - grants nice bonuses once you have plenty of spells to use
* Remove Fear - can make a huge difference, obviously
* Sanctuary - just like stealth or invisibility, basically
* DUHM - great buff
* Hold Person - awesome disabling spell; a staple
* Silence 15' Radius - shut down enemy spellcasters
* Animate Dead - best once you can summon a skeleton warrior at level 5; but still quite powerful early in the game when combined with Stinking Cloud or Cloudkill
* Dispel Magic - this can often be a lifesaver
* Miscast Magic - underrated spell, I find
* Rigid Thinking - another great disabling spell
* Mental Domination - great disabling spell
* Protection from Evil, 10' Radius - really nice buffing spell
* Defensive Harmony - solid buff
* Cloak of Fear - an ironic effect for some of the more badass enemies; I've had good luck with it
* Poison - the effects of poison on an enemy are something I have come to appreciate; for BG1 we're talking here about 2d8 per round lasting 1 turn (i.e., 10 times) and if the cleric reaches level 10, 3d8/round for a turn; that's a lot of poison damage; typically interrupts enemy spellcasting ; that's a big payoff when the spell succeeds
* Greater Command - beautiful disabling spell
* Righteous Magic - nice buff

and of course there are spells that neutralize enemy spell effects such as Zone of Sweet Air, Lesser Restoration, Free Action, Negative Plane Protection, Chaotic Commands, and True Seeing.

BelgarathMTH

In EE, the fourth level cleric spell Holy Power raises the cleric's strength to 18/00, increases Thac0 to that of a fighter of the same level, and grants one extra hit point per level, for one round/level.

Combining that with Draw Upon Holy Might and Righteous Magic can turn a cleric into a temporary combat juggernaut, especially if a friendly mage provides Haste or Improved Haste.

The problem is giving up spell slots to those spells, replacing other cleric spells that might be more useful and important to the whole party, such as Remove Fear, and Chaotic Commands.

Because clerics can wear all the same armor fighters can wear, they make very good front line combatants, just because they're very hard to hit when fully armored. They just won't do as much damage as fighters, because of only having one attack per round, and being restricted from some of the best weapons. The cleric's powers are focused on helping, healing, and defending others, rather than doing damage, although they do get a few good damage spells.

As has been said, if you really want a cleric to be a front-line damage dealer, it makes the most sense to make a fighter/cleric multi or dual.

EDIT:
Check this link for an excellent, easy-reference, concise and practical spell guide:
http://www.sorcerers.net/Games/BG2/SpellsReference/Main.htm
caveat: it's old, and some information in it is outdated, but the basic strategy advice is sound.

recklessheart

Depends how you take 'tank', I guess. Contrary to some impllcations made here on the thread, I find Viconia is one of the best tanks in the game. The pure cleric, despite doing little in the way of damage, can soar in dexterity with a high natural score and the Draw Upon Holy Might buff. Combined with a plethora of other buffs such as holy power, protection from evil and defensive harmony, they become fairly untouchable until you are on the aggressive with Yaga-Shura in ToB. They won't commit anything stellar in terms of damage output, but that's what the other 5 party members are for.

Sidenote: Additionally, Blade Barrier can do the extra damage for a pure cleric tank at high levels, and I find with Viconia that her AC is often so high that enemies have almost no chance of interrupting her before she gets up some great spells even when she is in the middle of combat (making false dawn, holy smite, blade barrier, draw upon holy might and flame strike a joy to behold in the heat of combat).

mjs

depending what/who you're tanking

chaotic commands/lesser restoration against mind flayers. CC stops you being stunned, LR restores your lost Int points

holy power and righteous magic both add temporary HP (1 per level, so using both obviously grants an extra 2HP/level). RM also grants 1 Str per 3 levels and all attacks are at full damage...epic

DuHM is great at lower level and solid at higher. it raises str, con and dex.

Armour of Faith. Every 1st level slot should be filled with this. 5% damage resistance up to a max of level 20 and 25% DR

blade barrier/globe of blades (HLA). there are two similar blade barrier spells as level 6 and HLA (can't remember what each are called). One does 8d8 damage per round (vs spells negates), the other does 10d10 per round (vs spells at -2 negates). this can stack for ridiculous amounts of damage

Frogman

Thanks all! Very helpful to understand which spells are strongest.

[Deleted User]

At high levels, don't forget Shield of the Archons; it has a good duration and can force enemy spellcasters to waste spells. Potentially useful once every enemy you meet makes the save against Globe of Blades effortlessly. Magic Resistance can also be handy if you don't have other sources of MR. I consider Protection From Evil 10' a must have for its long duration party buff.

Heindrich

@belgarathmth's link offers a nice overview of spells and their stats. But I don't know about you, I personally find that a bunch of stats doesn't tell me very much when I don't entirely understand the gaming mechanics behind them. Like when I first started BG, I had no idea how long a 'yard' was on my computer screen, or the difference between a turn and a round. I still struggle with the high end spell/combat protection removal.

So here's two links I personally like a lot:

For Arcane Spells:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/pc/258273-baldurs-gate-ii-shadows-of-amn/faqs/11334

Priest Spells:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/pc/258273-baldurs-gate-ii-shadows-of-amn/faqs/13870

They are written for BG 2 Vanilla, so there might be some changes for EE, but it still offers a nice bit of depth and analysis on each spell, and why they maybe good or bad. Another caveat is that the guide is written for BG 2 specifically, so although it includes BG 1 spells, it deals with them from the perspective of BG 2 combat situations. Thus some low level spells are very under-rated because they are nearly useless for high level combat, but very actually useful in early game BG 1. "Sleep" being the obvious example here, which the guide gives a 1, but in BG 1, it is an absolute game-changer.

Frogman

oh that's fantastic - thanks @heindrich1988 !

kryptix

I have viconia pretty decked out as a tank but she still goes pop on insane way too easily... I've resorted to having my fighter mage, nalia and neera tank because stoneskin, contingency stoneskin and pfmw make it so they actually survive more than 2 hits, mirror image helps too.

Night_Watch

I'm a little late to the party but I was wondering, did they nerf defensive harmony? If memory serves in the vanilla it gave +4 AC for 6 rounds but now in the EE it only gives +2 AC for 6 rounds. I noticed that whilst playing with my friends and I find it to be less useful than it used to be because of this =\

Edit: Please disregard. According to @Heindrich1988's links the vanilla gave +2 (-2, w/e suits your fancy) AC for 10 rounds. well, that's still 4 rounds more than what EE gives. I think I may have been stacking with Protection from Evil 10' which is where the +4 AC came from. sad panda =\

I should really try and find my old bg2 manual. Volo and Elminster's comments were so amusing.

kryptix

Night_Watch said:

I should really try and find my old bg2 manual. Volo and Elminster's comments were so amusing.

Not in paper but:

http://www.beamdog.com/files/bg2ee/bg2eemanual2.pdf

Enjoy!

BTW, the best buff for a cleric tanking is ironskins if you dual/multi with ranger.

Dragonspear

PoE no longer displays on your character (in terms of all the effects), but you do still gain them. I know that threw me for a loop recently when I played.

stargazerb

I've been playing a berkerser(9)->cleric solo through SoA, and there are only a few spells I ever really use. Sanctuary, Armor of Faith (with Defender of Easthaven), DuHM, True Seeing, Chaotic Commands (usually I use enrage instead), Blade Barrier, Prot. from Evil 10' and Summon Deva are the major ones. Occasionally I bring Sunray or Regeneration, but most of the time things die quickly.

That's good of course, because a cleric tank doesn't last long! By the time you're done buffing your spells start dropping in just a few rounds.

With SCS installed, there are challenges, but even dragons have been manageable. Clerics are tough characters.