suggestion for a multi fighter/mage

maxi

hello everyone!
so, I wanted to play through all the saga with an elf fighter mage multiclass (not dual) and I still don't know about weapon prof.
thinking about all the weapons available in BG2 my doubts are mostly between two weapon fighting ar two handed weapons.
in the first option I would choose katanas and long swords... katana for celestial fury and dzakkon blade and long swords because there are a lots of god ones (like daystar, flaming sword etc...)
in the second option my idea was to go with two handed sword (for the silver sword), quarterstaff (staff of the magi) and longbow so I can switch easily between ranged and melee weapons.
what is the best option for you guys?

and another question: what are the best spells for a fighter mage in SoA and ToB for a good defense against weapons and other mages spells? (of course I use a lot stoneskin and mirror image)

thanks a lot!

[Deleted User]

For the two-weapon fighting route, I would highly recommend starting out with long swords. Katana are hard to come by in BG1, while long swords are everywhere, and you get a racial THAC0 bonus with long swords, which really helps in the early stages of the game. Plenty of time to pick up Katana proficiency when you get into BG2.

For the two-handed weapon route, two handed swords are really good in BG1, and you can get excellent ones in BG2 right out of the gate, so it's a good starting point. Picking up quarterstaff proficiency in BG2 would definitely be interesting, though, as there are a lot of staffs with interest equip and on-hit effects, such as the elemental staffs and the Staff of the Magi. One of the best two-handed weapons in the game is a halberd, but halberds are kind of unimpressive for most of the saga up until then, so I'd make that a late acquisition, if at all.

As for which one to use, I personally prefer two weapon fighting, but I'll often spend most of BG1 using ranged weapons and build towards two weapon fighting, rather than doing it out of the gate.

As for defensive spells, Improved Invisibility is a great all around defensive spell because it boosts your AC and saves while also making it impossible for most enemies to directly target you with spells and abilities; it's easily stripped by True Sight unless you can cast Spell Immunity: Divination on yourself, though. (Minor) Globe of Invulnerability can also help, or at least force the enemy mage to fire a spell protection remover before it does anything to you.

nano

SI:abjuration is a good one too. It blocks dispel/remove magic. With SCS you can layer on spell protections to block Breach and make your combat defenses untouchable.

And don't forget protection from magical weapons, four rounds of near invincibility.

maxi

about dual wield, with a fighter mage do I really need the extra attack per round?
I like a lot dual wielding (now I am playing a ranger) and I love the katanas in BG2 (especially celestial fury) but also I like a lot silver sword and quarterstaffs and the possibility to easily switch with a ranged weapon... in the end, I really don't know what to doooo!!! )
thanks for the answers guys

nano

You don't need it... but who could say no to more attacks?

You can only put two pips in most things anyways, so you might as well get a bit of everything. I'd go with katanas at the start of BG2 if you're up for the celestial fury fight because you want to get as much use out if it as you can. Later on it's not as effective so you can switch to a two hander... And by then you'll have lots of whirlwinds to make up for the lost attacks.

maxi

nano said:

You don't need it... but who could say no to more attacks?

You can only put two pips in most things anyways, so you might as well get a bit of everything. I'd go with katanas at the start of BG2 if you're up for the celestial fury fight because you want to get as much use out if it as you can. Later on it's not as effective so you can switch to a two hander... And by then you'll have lots of whirlwinds to make up for the lost attacks.

I think this is a good idea, going on with the game I will be able to put pips on quarterstaff and two handed sword. Do you think it's important to give also a pip or two to 2 handed weapon style?

Larkus

maxi said:

about dual wield, with a fighter mage do I really need the extra attack per round?

You don't need the extra attack (or rather one extra attack for the main hand and one extra attack for the off hand if you wield Belm/Kundane in the off hand), but every extra attack is convenient, and under Improved Haste twice as convenient.

Of course, nothing keeps you from switching between two weapon style and two handed weapon style, depending on the situation.

karnage

To be honest, I never played through BG1 in its entirety, but in BG2, I did create a F/M and was very happy with him. He dual-weilded longswords.

These are tactics that worked very well for him:

-- Longswords, dual weilding
-- At lower levels, "Ghoul touch" prior to combat. At higher levels, creatures tend to save v. spell more often, so is less effective.
-- He generally used this tactic at higher levels: STONESKIN, CHAOS, HORROR, then MISLEAD, followed by melee attacks on his enemies while MISLEAD was in effect. The band of pirates that want to enslave you? With the tactic above, he wiped out each and every one of them singlehandedly.
-- My suggestion, then, is Longsword, dual weilding; give him profiency (at least) in a bludgeoning weapon for those Clay Golems; during combat, use Disabling spells then a Defensive spell or two then a "Beef up" spell (haste, touch spells, strength, etc) then go in for the kill.

Corvino

Dual wielding is very effective in terms of damage output, and also allows you to have the immunities or equipped benefits of 2 different weapons.

Longswords are a good call in BG1, and you can diversify a number of ways come BG2. Katanas look cool, and everyone loves Celestial Fury but there are actually very few of them around.

Dzuk5

maxi said:

about dual wield, with a fighter mage do I really need the extra attack per round?
I like a lot dual wielding (now I am playing a ranger) and I love the katanas in BG2 (especially celestial fury) but also I like a lot silver sword and quarterstaffs and the possibility to easily switch with a ranged weapon... in the end, I really don't know what to doooo!!! )
thanks for the answers guys

if you like silver sword soo much get Ravager +6(10% instant kill) for ToB. and only 1 pip for two handed weapon.
for start i would take
short bow or long bow**(short-> more atacks and end of SoA gensen/ long at start lower traco and more DMG) i would chouse short
long sword **(as elf +1 traco on start and there is a lot of long sword in the begining of the game)
2 wepon styl **(you don't needed more her offhand has only 1 atack per round with imp.hast 2)
then
katana **
halabard or quterstaf ** (on ToB much beter than 2handed sword)
two handed wepon stayl *

nano

maxi said:

nano said:

You don't need it... but who could say no to more attacks?

You can only put two pips in most things anyways, so you might as well get a bit of everything. I'd go with katanas at the start of BG2 if you're up for the celestial fury fight because you want to get as much use out if it as you can. Later on it's not as effective so you can switch to a two hander... And by then you'll have lots of whirlwinds to make up for the lost attacks.

I think this is a good idea, going on with the game I will be able to put pips on quarterstaff and two handed sword. Do you think it's important to give also a pip or two to 2 handed weapon style?

I'd put one pip into 2 handed, it gets you a bit more damage and more crits. Pretty good deal for one point.

Depends how you play whether the second pip is worth anything. I find it useful for a solo character. You can hit them with a staff - bam! - and then dance away before they can strike back. But it's not worth it if you're just going to stand still and whirlwind them to death, which is probably what you'll be doing as a fighter/mage. Your buffs don't last forever but make you untouchable for a short while. As they say, why should I dodge blows that I do not fear?

kryptix

I'm playing this right now but with a gnome instead because I find extra spells and better saves to be way better than 1 thac0 to longswords but I went with axes and longswords first. Axes in bg 2 let you ignore a ranged weapon because I just equip azure edge when I really need ranged (almost never since you can get boots of speed early. Then I just offhand belm and go to town. Axe is the first thing you get a good +3 with elemental damage to go through stoneskin.

Flail of ages is always good too though.

maxi

kryptix said:

I'm playing this right now but with a gnome instead because I find extra spells and better saves to be way better than 1 thac0 to longswords but I went with axes and longswords first. Axes in bg 2 let you ignore a ranged weapon because I just equip azure edge when I really need ranged (almost never since you can get boots of speed early. Then I just offhand belm and go to town. Axe is the first thing you get a good +3 with elemental damage to go through stoneskin.

Flail of ages is always good too though.

that's a good idea too, I like axes and I never used azuredge... it's a very good sobstitute as a renged weapon. I will adopt it for my ranger, I am playing it using axes and katanas. But for a change with my mage I think I will go at the beginning with 2 katanas and then switch to staff or a 2 handed sword, like nano said.
the point is: I find ToB much more challenging than the rest of the saga, so what's the best weapon choice for ToB? it seems that celestial fury doesn't work so well at that point, so what about weapons like silver sword, staff of the magi, staff of power or staff of the ram?

kryptix

@maxi I think celestial fury works on non-bosses in TOB so at least it will help you clear trash...

It takes a bit of micromanaging but with boots of speed and azuredge, you can easily kill any undead in SOA. You can even one shot liches.

Stealing it is possible with 3 potions and a bit of reloading too.


On an aside,
I actually find that on hexxat I have way more points than what I know to do with so she is nearing 160 pick pockets after getting everything else already. What should I do with thief points after that? I'm still in the under dark...

[Deleted User]

@kryptix On the topic of Hexxat: Not much to do at that point, though if your hide and move silently aren't up to ~200 each you can throw points into those to make her stealth more reliable in lit conditions. You could also take a look at her skills with the cloak on and improve some of those in case you actually need to disarm a trap or pick a lock with it on.

kryptix

Kaigen said:

@kryptix On the topic of Hexxat: Not much to do at that point, though if your hide and move silently aren't up to ~200 each you can throw points into those to make her stealth more reliable in lit conditions. You could also take a look at her skills with the cloak on and improve some of those in case you actually need to disarm a trap or pick a lock with it on.

I'm trying to make her a better fighter, 30-80 damage backstabs with celestial fury aren't bad but her thac0 and number of attacks leave a lot to be desired... Should I give her kundane?

[Deleted User]

@kryptix Kundane/Scarlet Ninja-to (with UAI) aren't bad as general use weapons for her, given the bonus attacks and her strength, but you'll need to keep a separate weapon around for backstabbing. If backstabbing with Celestial Fury isn't enough damage for you, there's always quarterstaves and two handed style. After all, a single class thief gets so many pips without specialization that there's little reason not to make them a jack of all trades when it comes to weapon use.

With my Hexxat I've been using a speed weapon generally, switching to Usuno's Blade/CF for backstabbing, and using Tuigan when she has to fight with the cloak on.

kryptix

@kaigen

I've been too lazy to carry ammo so I've been using a boomerang dagger but Tuigan is what I give her for mage fights and arrows of dispelling.

I haven't gotten staff of the ram yet but I think I'll put that on her when the time comes.

Are you giving her scarlet ninja-to AND kundane for 4 APR or main handing a regular weapon?

Asking because I forgot to buy the ninja-to before going to spellhold and she will have UAI very soon.

[Deleted User]

I've been using SNT/Kundane in her main hand. The fact that she can't get more than one pip in two weapon fighting has put me off from dual wielding with her, even though with her strength she'd still be ahead of your average thief. Ammo laziness was taken care of by doing the first level of Watcher's Keep early for the unlimited quiver.

Back on topic: The best two-handed weapon in ToB is the Ravager +6. Two handed swords kind of fall off in the late game unless you can use Carsomyr. Staffs are kind of niche in the late game: Staff of the Ram has magnificent damage, but it's cut into by the fact that you'll waste time chasing enemies you've knocked back all over the place. Staff of the Magi has great equip effects and a Carsomyr-style dispel on hit, but it's not very damaging. My suggestion would be two handed swords early in the saga, picking up halberd proficiency in time to use the Dragon's Breath in the Underdark or Wave after getting back to Athkatla. That gives you plenty of pips in the meantime for ranged weapons and other utility options (like staves).

nano

maxi said:

kryptix said:

I'm playing this right now but with a gnome instead because I find extra spells and better saves to be way better than 1 thac0 to longswords but I went with axes and longswords first. Axes in bg 2 let you ignore a ranged weapon because I just equip azure edge when I really need ranged (almost never since you can get boots of speed early. Then I just offhand belm and go to town. Axe is the first thing you get a good +3 with elemental damage to go through stoneskin.

Flail of ages is always good too though.

that's a good idea too, I like axes and I never used azuredge... it's a very good sobstitute as a renged weapon. I will adopt it for my ranger, I am playing it using axes and katanas. But for a change with my mage I think I will go at the beginning with 2 katanas and then switch to staff or a 2 handed sword, like nano said.
the point is: I find ToB much more challenging than the rest of the saga, so what's the best weapon choice for ToB? it seems that celestial fury doesn't work so well at that point, so what about weapons like silver sword, staff of the magi, staff of power or staff of the ram?

I would go for a +6 weapon, because the only +6 weapons are two handers and you might as well take advantage. +6 will pierce absolute immunity, not the most common spell but the ToB boss loves to use it.

Off the top of my head there's Carsomyr (not an option :c ), Ravager (nice!), staff of the ram (great damage but it knocks people back which can be a pain, also you give up a nice helmet), and Ixil's spike (ahahaha... but seriously this weapon has a big drawback in the free action and also relies on a failed save to do damage which means the really tough enemies will laugh it off). Did I miss any? Among those go with staff or ravager IMO.

amftron

I still like Impaler

Spears don't get enough love.