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The fully developed Flail of Ages is crap - was it always like this?

xzar_montyxzar_monty Member Posts: 631
in Baldur's Gate II: Enhanced Edition
So, after defeating Abazigal, I was able to develop my beloved Flail of Ages even further at Cespenar's Forge. And, it turns out, the fully developed flail is crap: it gives you Free Action, which means you cannot be hasted. Improved haste is an essential component of my berserker/cleric main character, so I'll be ditching the flail from now on.

What a disappointment! But, the question is: was it always like this? Or did something change between vanilla and EE?

Comments

  • SkaffenSkaffen Member Posts: 709
    EE only but there was a workaround for your override folder here

    https://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/comment/424015#Comment_424015
  • elementelement Member Posts: 833
    It always gave free action and the debate about whether its worth upgrading or not is an old one

    I think that perhaps they changed the behaviour of the free action in the EE I may be wrong but I think they made it so you cant exploit it as you used to be able to
  • xzar_montyxzar_monty Member Posts: 631
    Ok, thanks. I won't be bothering to use any workarounds at this point: I'm at Sendai's Enclave, and after that there's only Balthazar and Melissan left. Nothing can beat me now, Flail of Ages or not.
  • WebShamanWebShaman Member Posts: 490
    EXCEPT the Bug Monster!

    Mwuhahahahaha!
  • xzar_montyxzar_monty Member Posts: 631
    Yeah. If they make a game that doesn't frigging work, you've got no chance.
  • SkaffenSkaffen Member Posts: 709
    They changed free action effect in general to prevent haste, quite a few discussions on that.
  • powurzpowurz Member Posts: 28
    I threw the items into my game to see what would happen, and much to my chagrin it does appear that the flail no longer allows boots of speed's bonus. Previously, I'm pretty sure the boots gave a haste buff that did not include APR (supposedly, it did provide some bonuses that it wasn't supposed to if I recall). However, the coding in the Free Action buff is supposed to prevent hasting effects as well as movespeed bonuses (like the armors that give movespeed, which I also tested and found incompatible with FoA+5).

    I personally agree that it can be an unfun choice to make, but in the hands of a character with fighter HLAs it still does amazing things.
  • FenghoangFenghoang Member Posts: 160
    edited February 2014
    Flail of the Ages +5 PREVENTS haste; it doesn't remove it.

    So if you want to use it with haste, you:

    1. unequip FotA+5 or swap to another quickslot weapon
    2. cast (Improved) Haste
    3. reequip FotA+5
    4. blood. everywhere.

    Boots of Speed still doesn't work however.
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,315
    That workaround will be fixed by the next patch (whenever it comes out officially)
  • JLeeJLee Member Posts: 650
    edited February 2014
    Apparently someone has decided that the FoA was not to be "enhanced" with the rest of the game. Someone seems to have felt very strongly about it. It doesn't really bother me as I haven't really used it that much.

    Since it has so many fans, was there ever any consideration to making its free action work like the Spider's Bane version? I'm clueless about the process involved, but am curious about it nonetheless.
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,315
    edited February 2014
    JLee said:

    Apparently someone has decided that the FoA was not to be "enhanced" with the rest of the game. Someone seems to have felt very strongly about it. It doesn't really bother me as I haven't really used it that much.

    Since it has so many fans, was there ever any consideration to making its free action work like the Spider's Bane version? I'm clueless about the process involved, but am curious about it nonetheless.

    I believe the issue comes down to description. Particularly the phrasing of the free action spell vs say the description of the spiders bane. I'm not near a computer but as I recall though spiders bane gives the symbol of free action the actual item itself only specifies that it makes the user immune to hold (and web). Whereas the free action spell says something around the lines of making the spells target immune to all movement affecting spells.
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    Based on the description I'd say it's working as intended. TBH I'm happy the weapon has a downside.
  • powurzpowurz Member Posts: 28
    I think my preference would be to say "screw the description" and concede movespeed increases. Haste I can understand as part of the "can't be hasted, can't be slowed," but changing boots of speed to give 10 movespeed (the same way grandmaster's armor and monks work" seems like something that could pass below the radar of "free action." Either way, if it's getting fixed I'm down.
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,315
    Yea so it looks like I was right. Spiders bane specifically only says that it protects against "adverse" effects. Whereas a ring of free action states that you are immune to everything that affects mobility in any way. The spell Free Action says it provides immunity to anything that affects movement, but then goes on to list a few things as examples that are all adverse conditions. So its more debatable. Still, not as easy a thing to address as it first appears.
  • booinyoureyesbooinyoureyes Member Posts: 6,164
    edited February 2014
    Someone linked a fix for this that you can just unzip into your override folder. I'll try to find it for you

    here it is: http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/26458/free-action-do-you-use-it

    Also a mod that fixes it: http://www.shsforums.net/files/file/888-pnp-free-action-v2/
  • ARKdeEREHARKdeEREH Member Posts: 531
    The same thing happened to me. I opened my game in original BG2 and found that free action was a part of the original description, however, in the original game this did not counteract the effects of the boots of speed or the cheetah amulet. Unfortunately in the EE, both of these are worthless for characters using the flail of ages. Now I have a character with high flail proficiency and no weapon to use.
  • jackjackjackjack Member Posts: 3,251
    Haha, I still hear that free action thread title in Samuel L. Jackson's voice.
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