*SPOILER* What if Irenicus menaged to defeat you in hell? *SPOILER*

Brunachos

So, that always was a thing that intrigued me... what if? Would he come back to life? But what if the elves had destroyed his body? And, even if he somehow come back to the world of the living... he would be with your divine soul, so, how would he fit in Melissan's plans? Any guess?

CrevsDaak

I think that he'll use your soul to get out in some way... Or just stay there and make a tea party with the demons he summoned to kill the PC.
Probably the elves have done something, since they say that you were asleep for a week, maybe they just cage him until he dies... I can't be sure.

Zaor

"I cannot be caged!"

WebShaman

Well, he can in a cage with infinite boundaries...aka the Hells!

Get out of this one, Jon!

I just sort of like how he has an eternity of time to consider, ponder, and realize that beat the living tar out of him...bested him in every way.

Well, Dorn took his head off with the Silverblade...the first time. Neera's Mord. Sword cut him down in the Pocket Plane.

Should of had allies, Jon. Should of had allies.

bbear

WebShaman said:

Should of had allies, Jon. Should of had allies.

Well, he did have the drows plus some golem and troll underlings.

WebShaman

I said ALLIES, not underlings and tricked foes! Like Bohdi. But more.

A balanced party. Then he really would have been undefeatable. I still don't understand why he didn't use Simulacrum to create another Jon.

And the Drow, Golems, Trolls, Rakhashas, and Demons didn't join him at the Tree, did they?

The Drow provided a diversion for the Elves. Golems, Trolls (were there Trolls? I don't remember any Trolls...must have cut through them too quickly), Rakhashas and Demons were slaughtering what was left of the Elven population.

I guess ol' Jon really wasn't expecting to crash his Tree-of-Life-sucking party! I mean...leaving a few Elementals to "protect" the Parasites (whatever they were) was really lame (not to mention stupid) Jon! Epic fail!

Didn't Jon have any good HLAs? Should of had some Fallen Devas, Improved Alacrity, etc!

Brunachos

WebShaman said:

And the Drow, Golems, Trolls, Rakhashas, and Demons didn't join him at the Tree, did they?

They were killed by the avatar of the leaf lord you awoke in the temple, alongside with all his allies.

WebShaman

Not allies, servants!

The Raks I killed. Or rather, did.

Brunachos

Yeah, but even when you kill them all, if you don't awake the avatar they keep showing up every time you rest (or some nasty golems), what mean that they are still there somewhere... it is an army anyways.

Ploughed_Jester

Judging by the sequences where he repetatively houses Cowleds, crowds, and more in a rapidfire of spell slinging, he has Improved Alacrity permanenced.

meagloth

Wouldn't you just die like in any other point in the game? Isn't dnd "hell" just another place, a phisical plane that you can travel to?

elminster

I'd be surprised if he even has a body to go back to. Especially once the elves see his lifeless corpse. So even if he defeated you he'd probably be stuck there for a long while.

SionIV

With his powerful magic and getting the bhaal essence, i don't think it'll take long for him to get back.

Ploughed_Jester

Well, the "hell" at the end of SoA is more of a figurative spiritual hell, since your body remains at the Tree in this instance. Normal planar travel doesn't separate body from soul. The "hell" battle is a contest of wills.

meagloth

Ploughed_Jester said:

Well, the "hell" at the end of SoA is more of a figurative spiritual hell, since your body remains at the Tree in this instance. Normal planar travel doesn't separate body from soul. The "hell" battle is a contest of wills.

Which is why your party and gear comes along :P

MacHurto

Another theory:

You can imagine it like the Matrix. Your gear comes because you imagine yourself with it. Your essence pulls your allies minds with you to fight.

The whole thing can last just a couple of seconds and then you are left in a catatonic state for hours/weeks whatever they say when you wake up.

If Irenicus wins, his mind might be able to recover faster and he could awake quickly enough to avoid the elves defiling his body. So yeah, he would kick everyone ass if you dont stop him

MacHurto

Then, regarding ToB... Dunno, his essence would not go to the Bhaal Wars as he ascends in the Tree, right? You stop him, but once you are dead, he can do it again. Once he is a God, Melissan can ascend without that part, as it does not belong to Bhaal any longer.

Now the question would be: Without charname... Who would win in ToB? Melissan? One of the Five? Viekrag?

WebShaman

Yaga Shura would win, hands down.

Ploughed_Jester

Melissan could ascend without that part of Bhaal's essence, but would Irenicus stop there... I doubt. I assume he'd use his new-found divinity to strike at the other Bhaalspawn, cruch Melissan, and take Bhaal's portfolio as his own.

Those who seek power rarely stop at "some". He'd keep going. Rillifane Rallathil has Woods, Nature, Wild & Wood Elves, and Druids in his portfolio, which would not tide Irenicus over. Why not expand to include Assassination, Murder, and Violence. Priests of Irenicus the Exiled would be nuts. Shadow druids would flock to him, as would any evil elven mages. Priests would have the domains of Chaos, Elves, Evil (abandoned from Rillifane's Good domain since... well... Irenicus) Plants, Protection, Death, Destruction, & Retribution.

Another evil elven god might upset Lolth, but I suspect there'd be an uneasy truth, due to his working with drow to accomplish goals in his life. Drow male mages would likely creep over to his service in time as well.

Also, if he didn't, Balthazar would have won the Spawn Wars. Abazigal would have fallen to him, as would Sendai. Sendai would have been the one to sneak in and take Yaga Shura's heart and destroy him. As for Balthazar v. Melissan... unsure. I assume that army of monks has to make good cannon fodder.