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Anyone dual from mage to figher?

[Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
edited April 2014 in General Discussion (Spoiler Warning!)
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  • LoubLoub Member Posts: 471
    edited April 2014
    Any "duel" between a Mage and Fighter would be pretty much a curb-stomp battle favoring the latter, unless the Mage pre-buffed beforehand.

    Also, I do not think it is possible for there to be a duel between a Fighter and a Mage outside Shar-Teel and Edwin/Baeloth/Quayle/Mage!Charname or those in the Drow Tavern, since a "duel" by its very definition is governed by a set of rules and formalities (see below under spoilers), which most fights in the series eschew. So your question is highly nonplussing, to say the least.


    NOUN

    chiefly • historical
    1 A contest with deadly weapons arranged between two people in order to settle a point of honor.
    1.1 (In modern use) a contest or race between two parties.

    Origin

    late 15th century: from Latin duellum, archaic form of bellum 'war', used in medieval Latin with the meaning 'combat between two persons', partly influenced by dualis 'of two'. The original sense was 'single combat used to decide a judicial dispute'; the sense 'contest to decide a point of honor' dates from the early 17th century.

    Source: Oxford's Online Dictionary of American English


    I also believe the only proper "Duel Class" in the entire series is the single classed Swashbuckler, so if you want to make a "duel classed" character, I highly suggest you to try it.

    Take care.
  • jackjackjackjack Member Posts: 3,251
    To add:
    In retrospect, I would have greatly preferred higher level spells as opposed to more hp, which can be partially made up for with a familiar. A kitted mage would've been cool too in this instance, for the extra spells.
  • BlackravenBlackraven Member Posts: 3,486
    It allows you to create a fighter who's able to cast a few spells from his spellbook, cast all kinds of spells from scrolls, use wands and certain mage-only items (Staff of the Magi). These perks almost give this fighter the feel of a kit. Although I never tried it, I like the idea.
  • Contemplative_HamsterContemplative_Hamster Member Posts: 844
    edited April 2014
    Thia is just something I wrote during an idle moment the other day:

    ----

    Guide: The many benefits of a Mage dualled to a fighter in BGEE and BG2EE


    Requirements: Mage level 2, Intelligence 15, Strength 17.

    Benefits:
    - May use all equipment restricted to mages, including robes, wands, spell scrolls, even while wearing heavy armor
    - May use all equipment restricted to warriors
    - May achieve grand mastery in weapons

    All those excess spell scrolls that your mages don't have time to use in between casting their own spells now become one-off magical items much like potions.

    In BG2EE especially, there are a few weapons that are restricted to mages but would benefit from fighter bonuses. Imagine a 15th level fighter with grand mastery in quarterstaves wielding the Staff of the Magi in combat. Now stop drooling.


    Hindrances:
    You lose a litle bit of THAC0 and the hit points difference between 2 levels of fighter and two levels of mage, 16 points total assuming maximum hit point rolls and a Constitution of 18. This can be mitigated somewhat by summoning a familiar.


    Further points for consideration:

    A: Generalist mage or specialist?

    A generalist mage is the better choice here. Consider very carefully what you want your Mage 2/Fighter X to achieve. Your CHARNAME will never cast many spells. If a specialist, he will have 3 first level spells. IF a generalist, he will have 2 first level spells. Neither will be able to cast spells while wearing armor. However, he will be able to cast spells from scrolls while wearing armor - but only spells that are not from his School of Opposition. This can be a serious debilitation. (Oh, and for the record, apparently spell scrolls are always cast at level 10 unless a tweak from the BG2 TweakPack is installed).

    The BG2 TweakPack introduces the option of allowing Wild Mages to dual-class. This offers +1 spell, no opposition school, while also allowing a role-playing reason why the character dual-classed: he found that, try as he might, he could not channel magic through himself without disastrous results, and for the sake of public safety he became a fighter instead with a few tricks (wands) up his sleeve.

    B: mage 2/kensai X (mod)
    This at least saves you from buying and recharging the Shield Amulet by allowing you to cast Shield or Armor 2/day from memory.

    C: druid 2/fighter X
    Gives you access to a few druid-only items such as staves, and all cleric items. Does not appear to be as useful as the mage/fighter, but could be a specialist build for experienced players.
  • FinaLfrontFinaLfront Member Posts: 260
    I may also add, if all you are concerned about is your appearance, you can change that with EEKeeper if you'd rather play a Fighter/Mage and look like a mage. (I may actually change my Fighter/Thief into a thief appearance now that I think about it)

  • bbearbbear Member Posts: 1,180
    Why not dual class at level 1? The only mage spell necessary is the Find Familiar Spell. This excatly compensates the HP difference between a fighter and a mage AND allows the fighter to use all perks of the mage.
  • CrevsDaakCrevsDaak Member Posts: 7,155
    Dualing to a fighter will change your appearance to that of a fighter, you can of course change this with EEKeeper if you want :)
    I think that Cleric->Mage is better than the Cleric/Mage combination because Clerics don't get really good spells past level 6, and Mages don't need much XP to reach level 12, plus you can use LOTS of Cleric spells and LOTS of mage spells, it's a win-win!
  • MacHurtoMacHurto Member Posts: 731
    edited April 2014
    I know it is like feeding the troll but @Loub‌ what is the point on your answer? I know you claim to have aspergers or something like that but you must have understood the question. Or didn't you? :-?
  • LoubLoub Member Posts: 471
    edited April 2014
    jackjack said:

    Not to speak for him, but I'm pretty sure he understood the question -was pretty straightforward. I'm guessing he was just having a laugh.

    Indeed. As an English teacher, it is my duty to pick on everyone's lack of eloquence or grammatical misguidance in a matter similar to my own evaluations, although I must admit I am not accostumed to doing so in a verbal manner due to facts that were made transparent in my previous posts. But yes, I do so to "have a laugh" as you say, although my own autistic sense of humor might be a little alien to the neurotypicals that make up the majority of members of these forums. And in case you're wondering, the first part of this paragraph was a joke too.

    I am also clapping my hands with excitement over the fact that someone understood my own whimsical trails of thought, and that is not a metaphor, since clapping hands (or rather, the first and second joints of my fingers) is my personal tic that happens when I'm excited.
  • MacHurtoMacHurto Member Posts: 731
    Must have misunderstood the tone, then. Apologies
  • LoubLoub Member Posts: 471
    MacHurto said:

    Must have misunderstood the tone, then. Apologies

    The taste of tears in the morning is delectable. And by "tears" I mean the cracks in my mouth which form due to dryness caused by high doses of the antipsychotic Periciazine and the antidepressant Sertraline as well as the occasional injection of Diazepam when I'm particularly psychotic. Their delectability is also meant to be sarcastic, unless one happens to have a taste for rust or Irn-Bru.

    The depiction of Patricia Tannis' Asperger's from the Borderlands series is very accurate to describe my own manifestation of it.
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,317
    edited April 2014
    Anywho...back to the topic at hand.

    I like fighter/mage multiclasses more. You don't get grandmastery but I've never been a fan of dual classing. From an RP standpoint I like being able to progress in both classes.

    That said I'd probably do it at level 3. Stoneskin is nice but I'd view the class more as a fighter with minor spellcasting abilities. To that end I don't really want to have to give up so much health to get Stoneskin. Level 3 at least gives a number of interesting options, like Mirror Images, Find Familiar, and Blur, while still giving your character a fair bit of health (at late game).
  • jackjackjackjack Member Posts: 3,251
    I also prefer multiclassing - over dual-classing in general, but particularly in this case.
    Those mage HLAs are O_o
  • LoubLoub Member Posts: 471
    jackjack said:

    I also prefer multiclassing - over dual-classing in general, but particularly in this case.
    Those mage HLAs are O_o

    I often find multiclassing to be superior due to the fact that Multiclass characters get HLAs from all of their classes - and let's face it: Casters' HLAs are all very situational excepting the Deva/Planetar, Energy Blades and Improved Alacrity - and casters even run out of HLAs to put points on, making all of their levels beyond a certain point useless - Warriors and Thieves, on the other hand, can always have more of the ever-useful Greater Whirlwind Attack, Critical Strikes, Spike Traps and Time Traps, and that's discounting the one-time or passive abilities such as Use Any Item, Smite (good for separating dangerous mobs so they can be faced alone later) and Assassination (which F/M/Ts can abuse to oblivion with Improved Haste, Dual Wield + Scarlet Ninja-To, Gauntlets of Extraordinary Specialization and 2 pips in whatever you fancy, for a total of 10 f***ing attacks per round at a 5x multiplier (tee hee)).
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited April 2014
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  • LoubLoub Member Posts: 471
    edited April 2014
    jackjack said:

    thespace said:

    CrevsDaak said:

    Dualing to a fighter will change your appearance to that of a fighter, you can of course change this with EEKeeper if you want :)

    If this is the case then why doesn't Imoen change when dueled to a mage in BG1?

    Because she's a terrible person.
    Actually it is because there is a priority on Paper Dolls for Multi and Dual classed characters, which is as follows:

    Warrior>Priest>Rogue>Mage

    Whichever class is the most dominant gets the prize of depicting CHARNAME.

    Also, Imoen can't be "dueled to a mage" until Ust Natha in BG2 SoA, but even then only because she is also a mage, so again your statements prove to be nonplussing.

    ...And CrevsDaak beat me to it.

    Actually, I don't think Imoen is a terrible person at all, and her boobs only seem bigger in the Thief Paper Doll because the outfit is incredibly tight, unlike the Mage's, where the garments are loose and the females are obviously freeboobing - which just begs for a wardrobe malfunction to happen, revealing their tit-buttons.
  • LoubLoub Member Posts: 471
    @Blackraven‌
    I see your point. But the cause for my... adversity here stems from a frequent grammar fault which often shows up on these forums. Furthermore, judging by his linguistic fluidity, the OP is either a so called "native speaker" (which does not mean what you think it means, but more on that later) or eloquent enough in the English language to fool my "linguistic metrics". Although I have to agree that my abrasiveness towards these matters sometimes gets annoying.
  • jackjackjackjack Member Posts: 3,251
    Just to add - you can, as others have said, change your sprite back to a mage, but the fighter wearing mage robes looks totally badass.
  • GoturalGotural Member Posts: 1,229
    I really like the idea of a mage dualled to fighter. The more I hear you guys talking about it the more I think my next character is going to be a mage2>fighter(with a kit).

    Another good point is that you can use the 2 level 1 spells per day to cast Identity which could prove to be very useful in a solo run for example.
  • Demonoid_LimewireDemonoid_Limewire Member Posts: 424
    edited April 2014
    You can do it. But it is a very poor, idea... First off, you loose the fabulous fighter HP pool up to level 9. Then, you cannot hit max mage level, or 28 mage level (the level in which you get max spell slots), because you won't be able to reach the same fighter levels and surpass it... Like, the worst idea ever, sorry... I feel really sad for those who did that, especially those who kept playing till the end with this messed up character...

    To go correctly in creating a fighter mage, you have to start off as a fighter, and:
    1) Dual at 8 level to hit max mage...
    2) Dual at 9 level to get max hp and more weapon proficiency slots...
    3) Dual at 13 level to get second attack and a pretty powerful melee character...

    Everything else is a no go. Seriously.
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    What a terrible case of simplistic thinking.
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