How can I improve Haer Dalis?
drumcooler
Member Posts: 239
I recruited for the first time Haer Dalis. At first I didn't like him so much but I think, with the correct equipment and the correct proficiences, he'll be a great npc in melee thanks to protection spells.
Any advice about his optimisation?
About prof. i think to give him 3 points in 2 weapons and give the others in long sword and bow. Do you think other weapons are better for him?
About equipment i think to give him:
- Melodic Chainmail +3. Are there other better armors wich allow to cast spells?
- Girdle of Fortitude
- In Tob the Wonderous Gloves but in SoA i don't know... Gauntlets of Ogre Power or Gauntlets of Weapons Skill?
- Weapons... mmm. There are many long Swords, probably have a collection of them and use according to circumstances would be an interesting option.
- Kundane as off-hand weapon
Any advice about his optimisation?
About prof. i think to give him 3 points in 2 weapons and give the others in long sword and bow. Do you think other weapons are better for him?
About equipment i think to give him:
- Melodic Chainmail +3. Are there other better armors wich allow to cast spells?
- Girdle of Fortitude
- In Tob the Wonderous Gloves but in SoA i don't know... Gauntlets of Ogre Power or Gauntlets of Weapons Skill?
- Weapons... mmm. There are many long Swords, probably have a collection of them and use according to circumstances would be an interesting option.
- Kundane as off-hand weapon
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Comments
Melodic Chain is the best you can give him, let's him cast and gives him a decent armor.
You'll want to trade the Girdle of Fortitude for something else, preferable a strength one if you don't have anyone else that wants it. He shouldn't be taking damage to start with, so those extra 20-30 HP won't help him.
Wondrous gloves are great to have in ToB. I'm using BG2 tweak that lets cromwell upgrade ToB stuff so that i can make the gloves in SoA.
Long sword is fine but you'll want to go for Scimitar and Short swords. Get Kundane or Belm in his Off-hand and you can get Short sword of Mask +4 very early (Watcher's keep vendor) and quite cheap for his main. The good thing with Blades is that you'll have a lot of proficiency points to spend so you can pretty much get every 'good' weapon without having to sacrifice anything.
The key to playing a good Haer'Dalis is in his magical abilities, you want to turn him into a tank.
The base protection spells you use should be.
Blur (Level 2 arcane spell)
Mirror Image (Level 2 arcane spell)
Stoneskin (Level 4 arcane spell)
Improved Invisibility (Level 4 arcane spell, use it last in your buff order)
Red/Blue Fireshield (Level 4 arcane spell)
Contingency (Level 6 arcane spell)
Globe of Invulnerability (Level 6 arcane spell)
Just using Blur and Improved Invisibility on him will grant him +7 AC and +5 saving throws. Mirror Image and Stoneskin is there to protect him against the few attacks that get through. The Fireshield is great when you got 5+ enemies trying to kill him. Contingency is there to throw up a new stoneskin/mirror image instantly if he ends up losing the initial ones. Globe is there to make him immune to spells up to level 4 which lets you use skull trap and fireballs on top of him to clear enemies around him.
And you'll have these for special situations.
Spell shield (Level 5 arcane spell)
Spell Immunity (Level 5 arcane spell)
Protection From normal weapons (Level 5 arcane spell)
Mislead (Level 6 arcane spell)
Spell Deflection (Level 6 arcane spell)
Protection from Magical weapons (Level 6 arcane spell)
Tenser's Transformation (Level 6 arcane spell)
Improved Haste (Level 6 arcane spell)
Spell shield is a great spell against beholders and mage fights, spell Immunity Abjuration will make him immune to most spells that remove his protection spells. Protection from normal and magical weapon depends on what you're fighting, it can be a life savior for him while tanking. Spell Deflection can be useful in some of the mage fights and if you're not against a bit of cheese mislead will truly make him powerful. Tensers Transformation will make him unable to cast spells but give him the Thac0 and damage of a fighter of equal level.
You'll want to use Offensive spin early on but once you get to level 13+ with him and have Belm/Kundane you'll want to go over to Improved Haste instead. You can't have both at once and Improved Haste is better.
Buff him up with spells and send him into the middle of combat, he'll be a dervish of destruction with the girdle of strength and offensive spin/Improved haste and he'll be close to indestructible with your protection spells.
Skull trap (Level 3 arcane spell) Is great to use on him to clear big packs around him. He'll be immune to it with his globe so you can target yourself and everyone around you will take heavy damage.
I normally split up his spell levels like this.
Level 1 spells - Offensive
Level 2 spells - Defensive
Level 3 spells - Offensive
Level 4 spells - Defensive
Level 5 spells - Offensive/Defensive
Level 6 spells - Defensive
Also remember that while the blade might not have as many spells or get as high level spells as a mage, he'll be a higher level making his spells more efficient. A level 20 blade has the same experience as a level 16 mage, making him 4 levels higher when it comes to his spells.
Spells like Stoneskin, Mirror Image, Skull trap will be more powerful as you level up. This means that a blade will have more stoneskins than a mage, same with mirror images and his Skull trap will deal more damage as well. Your spells won't improve anymore after you're level 20, so it's first at that point a mage will catch up to the blade. So for most of the game your blade will have more powerful spells.
Haer'Dalis is not an easy character to use, but if used right, he is able to match up with the best characters. I assume you are inviting comments on how to equip him, so I will comment accordingly.
1. For starters, you need to be sure about what you want him to achieve. He is not a fighter. Neither is he a fighter/mage. He is a bard with some special abilities from his kit that helps him in combat. The complaints about him often arise because he's expected to perform as a fighter or fighter/mage when he's not.
Remember: just because he can tank does not mean that he is designed to be a tank. He can tank if needed, but that is underutilizing his bard abilities.
2. For defense, in the SOA part of the game, sadly, there isn't much in available armors. But he has Stoneskin, and he can cast it at high levels. In a pinch, use the Defensive Spin. Once he gets UAI, he can use Robes of the Archmagi, regardless of alignment. For fun, you can also get him to use Jan's armor.
3. Girdle of Fortitude is not very important for him. All that it offers is 20HP at best. If you have it, use it, but it is not a big deal. If you want him to be at the front, a Strength belt is better since it adds to his THAC0 and damage. Otherwise, girdle of piercing (protects him from stray missiles) or some other AC girdle.
4. Gauntlets of Ogre Power only if you want him to be at the front line or if you want him to use slings, you do not have any more girdles of giant strength, you are willing to give up Crom Faeyr. Otherwise, Gauntlets of Weapon Skill or Expertise are fine.
5. Once you get Enhanced Bard Song for him, consider not using him at the front line at all. His THAC0 is Rogue THAC0 and will not be as good as a pure fighter's and he does not get extra attacks or grandmastery, but singing the enhanced bard song boosts all allies' THAC0 and damage tremendously (+4).
Note that the enhanced bard song, even without the clone-singing exploit, is extremely strong for melee-oriented parties. If you have three front-liners with a combined 15 attacks total, the enhanced bard song adds a full 15x4=60 damage, and better hit rate too. If Haer'Dalis cannot hit for this damage by himself, sing.
6. If you do want him to be at the front line, you can use Short Sword of Mask +4 (you can buy it at Watcher's Keep early) with Kundane +2 (if no one else is using it). In TOB, you can also use Answerer +4 and Angurvadal +5. If no one else can use it, Haer'Dalis can use the Scarlet Ninja-To +3.
No scimitars in main hand. Base THAC0 for bards cap at 10. You will need all the THAC0 bonuses you can get, else he will not be able to hit consistently. Long Swords are different because they do offer a better spread of bonuses as compared to scimitars, so it is okay.
7. If you want him to fight in the middle ranks (fighting behind the front-liners with two-handed weapons), and no one else is using Carsomyr... he can use it. The purpose of Carsomyr is to dispel magics on enemies, so he does not really need to hit as often. Else, any other good two-handed weapon will work.
8. If you are happy with him at the back, his high number of weapon proficiencies should allow you to be proficient in any missile weapon with proficiencies to spare. Tuigan Bow +1, Gesen Bow, and Fire Tooth +4 (you can buy this at Watcher's Keep too) are all good.
9. He is great with wands. Keep the best ones with him (wand of spell striking, rod of reversal, rod of resurrection) and let him fire off from behind while your fighters at the front are busy hitting and swigging potions. Note that you need UAI for some of these wands.
EDIT: edits for grammar/clarity
The moment you give him Kundane or Belm he'll sit with 4 APR while using offensive spin. That's 4 APR with max damage on every hit. With Improved haste you'll be sitting on 6 APR. This isn't as much or as powerful as a 10 APR whirlwind warrior. But you have to remember that it takes time to get a warrior to 10 APR, and even when he does the bard will not only be dealing a decent amount of damage, he'll survive like a champ. Throw in a skulltrap or two in the middle of a pile of enemies and you'll have very high damage there as well.
And his Thac0 won't be a problem as Tensers will give him the same Thac0 as a fighter of equal level.
But i agree that if you're looking at the classes on their own, the F/M/T is more powerful. But if you're running with a party of 4,5 or 6 the Blade will be better.
Solo -> F/M/T
Party -> Blade.
That much is true, though the Enhanced Bard Song is that powerful, even without using the clone-singing exploit. The song scales up in effectiveness as you have more party members. @SionIV makes a sound conclusion here.
@SionIV
If you want to use him as a F/M, then you need to consider what @Gotural pointed out - F/M/Ts are just about superior in every aspect except for song, so if you are using a bard, not milking his bardic abilities for what they are worth is a waste.
And the fact that F/M and F/M/T are over the top powerful doesn't make the blade bad. Haer'Dalis will outperform pretty much every single other NPC's out there if you know how to play him.
I Keep Korgan because i like him so much but i want other fighters able to cast stoneskin, mirror image, ecc..
A word of caution though, if you are using Haer'Dalis as a fighter/mage, you may be underwhelmed. His THAC0 is really terrible, and not enough to deal with the late-game monsters.
Tenser's will disable spells, at least in vanilla. I will grant you this point, but I am not one who fancies building houses out of cards
When the F/M/T reach level 12 mage the blade will be level 20.
Let's look at their spell casting.
[Mage]
Level 1 - 4
Level 2 - 4
Level 3 - 4
Level 4 - 4
Level 5 - 4
Level 6 - 1
[Blade]
Level 1 - 4
Level 2 - 4
Level 3 - 4
Level 4 - 4
Level 5 - 4
Level 6 - 3
So not only does the blade have MORE spells than your F/M/T he'll also cast with 8 levels higher. You'll notice an even bigger difference on earlier levels.
I am referring to the micromanagement that is required to make Haer'Dalis viable as a tank, and even after setting him up to be a viable tank, he requires more care to manage. In no way am I saying your argument is unsound, but I will say there is a safer, easier way to use him effectively.
As i said i agree 110% with what you say if we talk about any other bard. I just feel that it's a shame to play with a blade and not use him to his most, even if it requires a shit load of micromanagement.
I will admit that the real reason why I use Haer'Dalis often is... I hate micromanaging a full party of six. I get him to go invisible and sing, then hide him far away from any battle, so that I only need to manage five characters XD
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=195278341
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As a blade Haer'Dalis is a very effective character in combat. From a stats standpoint his two biggest downsides are low constitution and poor intelligence. If someone else isn't using it you may want to have him use of Girdle of Fortitude (you can pick this up during the Unseeing Eye quest) to improve his constitution and overall health (upon activation). Also you may want to have a Potion of Genius or Potion a Potion of Mind Focussing for when he wants to scribe scrolls (unless you are going to reduce the game difficulty whenever you want to learn spells).
As a Tiefling he has 15% inherent physical damage resistance, 25% fire and electricity resistance, and 50% cold resistance.
From a proficiency standpoint he is going to do quite well with short swords (including the swords he starts out with). If you give him Kundane on his Off-hand that will help. Short swords are likely going to be the only weapon he is specialised in for you (unless you pick him up late). Ultimately there are a lot of different weapons in the game and once he gains access to the higher level ability Use Any Item you will certainly want to consider what weapon is best for him in your circumstances.
One BG2EE specific hint that is useful for Haer'Dalis is if he has 80 in Pick Pockets (which you can get by being above level 10 and using a Potion of Master Thievery) its also possible to steal a cloak that will further improve Haer'Dalis's offhand Thac0 (its held by an NPC called Treya who you run into in Trademeet). The cloak is possible to grab but it is not easily grabbed.
Spells
Haer'Dalis is an effective character in combat because of spell buffs and his special abilities. A few spells that you may want to consider having him memorize include Blur (level 2), Mirror Image (level 2), Ghost Armor (level 3), Stoneskin (level 4), Improved Invisibility (level 4), Mislead (level 6), Continguency (level 6), Protection From Magical Weapons (level 6), and Tenser's Transformation (level 6).
Of these Tenser's Transformation probably deserves the most mention. Tenser's is an excellent bard spell. It will set Haer'Dalis's Thac0 to that of a fighter of his current level (bard's level up fast so this means you'll have the Thac0 of a high level fighter), gives him bonuses to Thac0 and damage, doubles his hit points, and lowers his armour class. The downside is he loses the ability to cast spells while it is active. At the moment this also includes the ability to use Offensive and Defensive Spin.
Mislead can be good for a number of reasons but one of them is that you can use the decoy to use a bard song. The normal bard song will only give you basically a remove fear and protection from fear. However, its useful for the enhanced bard song (HLA) because you can have it active while Haer'Dalis is fighting.
You can also pick up Improved Haste (level 6) particularly if you are using weapons like Belm or Kundane that increase the number of attacks you do per round. Just remember that like Haste (level 3) Improved Haste can't be active at the same time as Offensive Spin.
Otherwise you may want to consider Polymorph Self (level 4). As someone with access to mage spells levels 1-6 you can get some interesting combinations going with it, especially when you have access to both Continguency and Minor Sequencer. If you use the Minor Sequencer for instance you can actually use it while transformed. For the two spells you pick (as one example) you could go with both Ghoul Touch (level 2) and Strength (level 2). Once you are transformed into a spider you can then activate the sequencer, which would then set your spider's strength to 18/50 and give you the chance to paralyze an enemy on hit. You would however have 5 attacks per round and you'd be immune to Web (meaning you could cast Web on enemies beforehand and then proceed to attack them in your spider form). The other good thing about the Ghoul Touch/Sequencer example is that once Ghoul Touch expires you'll revert to Haer'Dalis's weapons but you will stay with 5 attacks per round. Polymorph Self's Mustard Jelly form is another great option because it has 100% magic resistance.
Abilities
Haer'Dalis gets two special abilities; Offensive Spin and Defensive Spin. Offensive Spin is great because it will increase your attacks per round by 1, increase your damage and hit rolls, and guarantees that for its duration when Haer'Dalis hits an enemy it will do maximum damage. Basically when combined with either short swords or another weapon of your choosing he will become a very effective melee damage dealer.
An alternative to Offensive Spin (you can't have both active at the same time) is Defensive Spin. Defensive Spin gives him -10 to his AC and grounds him in that spot. Its a fantastic ability if you need him to hold off enemies in a doorway or other area where enemies can't just walk around him. Defensive Spin however will not work if Haer'Dalis has a Free Action spell active on him (or an item that gives him it). You can however have either Haste or Improved Haste active on him when you are using it.
As a bard Haer'Dalis also can use a wide variety of wands. The wands you hopefully picked up in the starting dungeon for instance can be used by him. Of that bunch the Wand of Cloudkill (which you can also find in Mekrath's base) is probably going to be the best purely because the wand's cloudkill effect will last longer than the Cloudkill mage spell. If its low on charges you'll want to sell it and then buy it back so that it is at full charge. The Wand of Cloudkill is a good option to have around if you are in need of a ranged item (other than say a bow) for dealing with enemies.
Finally Haer'Dalis will get the chance to pick a number of higher level abilities that are useful in their own way. Of these Use Any Item, Set Spike Trap, Set Time Trap, Avoid Death, and Greater Evasion (you'll have to pick Evasion first) are all good choices.
The Enhanced Bard Song is very good ability that can serve as an alternative to the higher level abilities I've already listed. You can't be singing while you are fighting so you may want to consider what your priorities are for. That said look over each HLA (including the ones I haven't listed) and consider how it compliments the particular play style you are using with Haer'Dalis.
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I'll also add that you should probably decide if you want him to take a more defensive or offensive approach before any battle with him. If you want him to be more of an offensive melee fighter then having him use Tensors probably won't hurt if you aren't so worried about attacks being made on him (since you lose access to Protection from Magical Weapons, Defensive Spin, and the ability to recast Stoneskin). Its also better in this kind of an approach to use a strength belt on him and to cast Improved Haste in advance (or if you can't cast level 6 spells then obviously just use Offensive Spin).
For a more defensive approach obviously he has his Defensive Spin as well as various spells like Stoneskin and PFMW. With this approach the Belt of Fortitude is better because by melee character standards he tends to start with a very low amount of health. To give you an idea his level 10 form starts out with 44 health, which is actually less than Edwin's (once constitution bonuses are considered) and Viconia's (as well as a number of the warrior characters).
The problems with Haer'Dalis and all other Blades, are that their lore and song suffer greatly, but both of these issues are nullified toward the end of the game, with the enhanced Bard song HLA, along with an obscene amount of gold, allowing you to identify anything your party can't figure out on its own.
I've also once pitted Haer Dalis against Minsc with just a tensor's buff beforehand and poor Minsc didn't stand a chance.
I have to say that i don't like playing with a too much patched game.
Traps are not a problem, another thief is in my party.