MBTI / Jungian types vs. D&D Alignments. What's your type?
This topic started in connection with NPC as real life friend discussion and I think it deserves a separate thread.
The Myers-Briggs Type Indicator (MBTI) is a tool used to assess psychological preferences when it comes to perception and decision-taking. In more complex form, it's used professionally, but I find its simplified and widely available versions quite useful when describing fictional characters. It's very different from what we're familiar with the most, meaning, Ethics/Morals double duality, since it doesn't indicate how the individuals perceive the world and what decisions they make (subjective/interpretation). It's more about the methods engaged in perception and decision-making, so the result says more about personality than alignment, but there's obviously some correlation.
Here's a pretty good test with no registration required, here's a shorter one and here you can read more about each type.
So. Is this method of describing characters useful? What's your favourite BG NPC's type? And what about yours?
The Myers-Briggs Type Indicator (MBTI) is a tool used to assess psychological preferences when it comes to perception and decision-taking. In more complex form, it's used professionally, but I find its simplified and widely available versions quite useful when describing fictional characters. It's very different from what we're familiar with the most, meaning, Ethics/Morals double duality, since it doesn't indicate how the individuals perceive the world and what decisions they make (subjective/interpretation). It's more about the methods engaged in perception and decision-making, so the result says more about personality than alignment, but there's obviously some correlation.
Here's a pretty good test with no registration required, here's a shorter one and here you can read more about each type.
So. Is this method of describing characters useful? What's your favourite BG NPC's type? And what about yours?
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My favorite NPC is Xzar. I don't think I can peg his type.
ESTP by both, strangely, given how uncharismatic I am.
Favorite NPC is Viconia, and I believe she is INTJ.
Anyway, I'll paste again what I said about Aerie:
For Aerie I got INFJ. I won't bore you with the reasoning behind every answer. As a mage, I'd say she likes to prepare and plan things in advance. She seems like she'd be quite a neat person, and definitely most the more shy and introverted answers, preferring to mix with small groups rather than crowds. But she obviously does get concerned and is sympathetic to those around her. As a mage she analyzes things, and seems to spend a lot of time pondering stuff, but then often wastes no time just acting on her emotions if she feels strongly about something. Does she find it hard to talk about her feelings? Not with the bhaalspawn, but the bhaalspawn is the only one she does talk to... but, in the end I answered that she didn't. Anyhow, it ended up looking like this:
You have strong preference of Introversion over Extraversion (78%)
You have moderate preference of Intuition over Sensing (25%)
You have moderate preference of Feeling over Thinking (50%)
You have slight preference of Judging over Perceiving (22%)
Myself incidentally, came up INTJ. But then I knew that; I've done these tests before.
Also, I'm convinced that I'm an INTJ myself, getting this result so many times. Paradoxically, manipulating the answers to get this particular outcome is also the proof that it's the correct one, but still, a bit disturbing. I'm not sure if Viconia makes it even worse, or quite the opposite. Probably the latter. :] See? :]
I have to admit that I'm particularly fond of INTP type. I guess that Candlekeep is full of these - calm, maybe even a bit phlegmatic scholars, slightly absent-minded and impractical, but impossibly focused and sharp-witted when it comes to their favourite topic or simply something they find particularly important. Gorion, Firebead and Phlydia - all of them could be/have been INTPs.
ENTPs are usually verbally as well as cerebrally quick, and generally love to argue--both for its own sake, and to show off their debating skills. ENTPs tend to have a perverse sense of humor as well, and enjoy playing devil's advocate. This sometimes confuses, even angers, those who don't understand or accept the concept of argument as a sport.
ENTPs are as innovative and ingenious at problem-solving as they are at verbal gymnastics; on occasion, however, they manage to outsmart themselves. ENTPs can be prone to "sharp practice" – especially cutting corners without regard to the rules if it's expedient – or, their juggling acts may simply be so over-ambitious they collapse.
Both at work and at home, ENTPs are very fond of "toys" -- physical or intellectual, the more sophisticated the better. Once these have been "solved" or become too familiar, however, they’ll be replaced with new ones.
ENTPs are basically optimists, but in spite of this (perhaps because of it?), they can become petulant about small setbacks and inconveniences. (Major setbacks they regard as challenges, and tackle with determination.) ENTPs have little patience with those they consider wrongheaded or unintelligent, and show little restraint in demonstrating this. In general, however, they are genial, even charming, when not being harassed by life.
In terms of their relationships with others, ENTPs are capable of bonding very closely and suddenly with their loved ones. Some appear deceptively offhand with their nearest and dearest; others are so demonstrative that they succeed in shocking co-workers who've only seen their professional side. ENTPs are also quick to spot a kindred spirit, and good at acquiring friends of similar temperament and interests.
ENTPs may sometimes give the impression of being largely oblivious to the rest of humanity except as an audience: good, bad, or potential. In general this is unfair – but it can be difficult to get an ENTP’s attention when they’re not immediately aware of you, especially for an Introvert.
The best approach in communicating with an ENTP is to be straightforward. No games – they’ll win. No "pulling rank" – they’ll just want to put you in your place. No apologies – you’ll undermine yourself. Try "I need/want to talk to you."
(ENTP stands for Extravert, iNtuitive, Thinking, Perceiving and represents individual's preferences in four dimensions characterising personality type, according to Jung's and Briggs Myers' theories of personality type.)
Yeah that's me. According to winters I'm iron man.
Loub'a test
According to Myers-Briggs, INFPs focus much of their energy on an inner world dominated by intense feeling and deeply held ethics. They seek an external life that is in keeping with these values. Loyal to the people and causes important to them, INFPs can quickly spot opportunities to implement their ideals. They are curious to understand those around them, and so are accepting and flexible except when their values are threatened.
According to Keirsey, based on observations of behavior, notable INFPs may include Princess Diana, George Orwell, Aldous Huxley, Audrey Hepburn, Richard Gere, Albert Schweitzer and Isabel Myers.
The polite, reserved exterior of INFPs can at first make them difficult to get to know. They enjoy conversation, however, taking particular delight in the unusual. When INFPs are in a sociable mood, their humor and charm shine through. Disposed to like people and to avoid conflict, INFPs tend to make pleasant company.
Devoted to those in their inner circle, INFPs guard the emotional well-being of others, consoling those in distress. Guided by their desire for harmony, INFPs prefer to be flexible unless their ethics are violated. Then, they become passionate advocates for their beliefs. They are often able to sway the opinions of others through tact, diplomacy, and an ability to see varying sides of an issue.
INFPs develop these insights through reflection, and they require substantial time alone to ponder and process new information. While they can be quite patient with complex material, they are generally bored by routine. Though not always organized, INFPs are meticulous about things they value. Perfectionists, they may have trouble completing a task because it cannot meet their high standards. They may even go back to a completed project after the deadline so they can improve it.
INFPs are creative types and often have a gift for language. As introverts, they may prefer to express themselves through writing. Their dominant Feeling drives their desire to communicate, while their auxiliary intuition supplies the imagination. Having a talent for symbolism, they enjoy metaphors and similes. They continually seek new ideas and adapt well to change. They prefer working in an environment that values these gifts and allows them to make a positive difference in the world, according to their personal beliefs.
@Loub while taking the test I thought it had some good questions, but the result is some bull. Winter's test is much more like me than this. Its not completely off, but it's pretty far.
Edit: BTW I'm a chaotic good sorcerer, for comparison.
:P
INTJs are analytical. Like INTPs, they are most comfortable working alone and tend to be less sociable than other types. Nevertheless, INTJs are prepared to lead if no one else seems up to the task, or if they see a major weakness in the current leadership. They tend to be pragmatic, logical, and creative. They have a low tolerance for spin or rampant emotionalism. They are not generally susceptible to catchphrases and do not recognize authority based on tradition, rank, or title.
Hallmarks of the INTJ include independence of thought and a desire for efficiency. They work best when given autonomy and creative freedom. They harbor an innate desire to express themselves by conceptualizing their own intellectual designs. They have a talent for analyzing and formulating complex theories. INTJs are generally well-suited for occupations within academia, research, consulting, management, science, engineering, and law. They are often acutely aware of their own knowledge and abilitiesas well as their limitations and what they don't know (a quality that tends to distinguish them from INTPs). INTJs thus develop a strong confidence in their ability and talents, making them natural leaders.
In forming relationships, INTJs tend to seek out others with similar character traits and ideologies. Agreement on theoretical concepts is an important aspect of their relationships. By nature INTJs can be demanding in their expectations, and approach relationships in a rational manner. As a result, INTJs may not always respond to a spontaneous infatuation but wait for a mate who better fits their set criteria. They tend to be stable, reliable, and dedicated. Harmony in relationships and home life tends to be extremely important to them. They generally withhold strong emotion and do not like to waste time with what they consider irrational social rituals. This may cause non-INTJs to perceive them as distant and reserved; nevertheless, INTJs are usually very loyal partners who are prepared to commit substantial energy and time into a relationship to make it work.
As mates, INTJs want harmony and order in the home and in relationships. The most independent of all types, INTJs trust their intuition when choosing friends and mateseven in spite of contradictory evidence or pressure from others. The emotions of an INTJ are hard to read, and neither male nor female INTJs are apt to express emotional reactions. At times, INTJs seem cold, reserved, and unresponsive, while in fact they are almost hypersensitive to signals of rejection from those they care for. In social situations, INTJs may also be unresponsive and may neglect small rituals designed to put others at ease. For example, INTJs may communicate that idle dialogue such as small talk is a waste of time. This may create the impression that the INTJ is in a hurryan impression that is not always intended. In their interpersonal relationships, INTJs are usually better in a working situation than in a recreational situation.
INTJs are perfectionists, with a seemingly endless capacity for improving upon anything that takes their interest. What prevents them from becoming chronically bogged down in this pursuit of perfection is the pragmatism so characteristic of the type: INTJs apply (often ruthlessly) the criterion "Does it work?" to everything from their own research efforts to the prevailing social norms. This in turn produces an unusual independence of mind, freeing the INTJ from the constraints of authority, convention, or sentiment for its own sake.
INTJs are known as the "Systems Builders" of the types, perhaps in part because they possess the unusual trait combination of imagination and reliability. Whatever system an INTJ happens to be working on is for them the equivalent of a moral cause to an INFJ; both perfectionism and disregard for authority may come into play, as INTJs can be unsparing of both themselves and the others on the project. Anyone considered to be "slacking," including superiors, will lose their respect -- and will generally be made aware of this; INTJs have also been known to take it upon themselves to implement critical decisions without consulting their supervisors or co-workers. On the other hand, they do tend to be scrupulous and even-handed about recognizing the individual contributions that have gone into a project, and have a gift for seizing opportunities which others might not even notice.
In the broadest terms, what INTJs "do" tends to be what they "know". Typical INTJ career choices are in the sciences and engineering, but they can be found wherever a combination of intellect and incisiveness are required (e.g., law, some areas of academia). INTJs can rise to management positions when they are willing to invest time in marketing their abilities as well as enhancing them, and (whether for the sake of ambition or the desire for privacy) many also find it useful to learn to simulate some degree of surface conformism in order to mask their inherent unconventionality.
Personal relationships, particularly romantic ones, can be the INTJ's Achilles heel. While they are capable of caring deeply for others (usually a select few), and are willing to spend a great deal of time and effort on a relationship, the knowledge and self-confidence that make them so successful in other areas can suddenly abandon or mislead them in interpersonal situations.
This happens in part because many INTJs do not readily grasp the social rituals; for instance, they tend to have little patience and less understanding of such things as small talk and flirtation (which most types consider half the fun of a relationship). To complicate matters, INTJs are usually extremely private people, and can often be naturally impassive as well, which makes them easy to misread and misunderstand. Perhaps the most fundamental problem, however, is that INTJs really want people to make sense. :-) This sometimes results in a peculiar naivete', paralleling that of many Fs -- only instead of expecting inexhaustible affection and empathy from a romantic relationship, the INTJ will expect inexhaustible reasonability and directness.
Probably the strongest INTJ assets in the interpersonal area are their intuitive abilities and their willingness to "work at" a relationship. Although as Ts they do not always have the kind of natural empathy that many Fs do, the Intuitive function can often act as a good substitute by synthesizing the probable meanings behind such things as tone of voice, turn of phrase, and facial expression. This ability can then be honed and directed by consistent, repeated efforts to understand and support those they care about, and those relationships which ultimately do become established with an INTJ tend to be characterized by their robustness, stability, and good communications.
(INTJ stands for Introvert, iNtuitive, Thinking, Judging and represents individual's preferences in four dimensions characterising personality type, according to Jung's and Briggs Myers' theories of personality type.)
Nope! Hehe, I guess I don't know xan very well.
ENFPs are initiators of change, keenly perceptive of possibilities. They energize and stimulate others through their contagious enthusiasm. They prefer the start-up phase of a project or relationship, and are tireless in the pursuit of new-found interests. ENFPs are able to anticipate the needs of others and to offer them needed help and appreciation. They bring zest, joy, liveliness, and fun to all aspects of their lives. They are at their best in fluid situations that allow them to express their creativity and use their charisma. They tend to idealize people, and can be disappointed when reality fails to fulfill their expectations. They are easily frustrated if a project requires a great deal of follow-up or attention to detail.
A little too kiss-ass of a description for my taste, but the test itself was unique and, it seems, accurate.
INFJs are deeply concerned about their relations with individuals as well as the state of humanity at large. They are, in fact, sometimes mistaken for extroverts because they appear so outgoing and are so genuinely interested in people -- a product of the Feeling function they most readily show to the world. On the contrary, INFJs are true introverts, who can only be emotionally intimate and fulfilled with a chosen few from among their long-term friends, family, or obvious "soul mates." While instinctively courting the personal and organizational demands continually made upon them by others, at intervals INFJs will suddenly withdraw into themselves, sometimes shutting out even their intimates. This apparent paradox is a necessary escape valve for them, providing both time to rebuild their depleted resources and a filter to prevent the emotional overload to which they are so susceptible as inherent "givers." As a pattern of behavior, it is perhaps the most confusing aspect of the enigmatic INFJ character to outsiders, and hence the most often misunderstood -- particularly by those who have little experience with this rare type.
Due in part to the unique perspective produced by this alternation between detachment and involvement in the lives of the people around them, INFJs may well have the clearest insights of all the types into the motivations of others, for good and for evil. The most important contributing factor to this uncanny gift, however, are the empathic abilities often found in Fs, which seem to be especially heightened in the INFJ type (possibly by the dominance of the introverted N function).
This empathy can serve as a classic example of the two-edged nature of certain INFJ talents, as it can be strong enough to cause discomfort or pain in negative or stressful situations. More explicit inner conflicts are also not uncommon in INFJs; it is possible to speculate that the causes for some of these may lie in the specific combinations of preferences which define this complex type. For instance, there can sometimes be a "tug-of-war" between NF vision and idealism and the J practicality that urges compromise for the sake of achieving the highest priority goals. And the I and J combination, while perhaps enhancing self-awareness, may make it difficult for INFJs to articulate their deepest and most convoluted feelings.
Usually self-expression comes more easily to INFJs on paper, as they tend to have strong writing skills. Since in addition they often possess a strong personal charisma, INFJs are generally well-suited to the "inspirational" professions such as teaching (especially in higher education) and religious leadership. Psychology and counseling are other obvious choices, but overall, INFJs can be exceptionally difficult to pigeonhole by their career paths. Perhaps the best example of this occurs in the technical fields. Many INFJs perceive themselves at a disadvantage when dealing with the mystique and formality of "hard logic", and in academic terms this may cause a tendency to gravitate towards the liberal arts rather than the sciences. However, the significant minority of INFJs who do pursue studies and careers in the latter areas tend to be as successful as their T counterparts, as it is *iNtuition* -- the dominant function for the INFJ type -- which governs the ability to understand abstract theory and implement it creatively.
In their own way, INFJs are just as much "systems builders" as are INTJs; the difference lies in that most INFJ "systems" are founded on human beings and human values, rather than information and technology. Their systems may for these reasons be conceptually "blurrier" than analogous NT ones, harder to measure in strict numerical terms, and easier to take for granted -- yet it is these same underlying reasons which make the resulting contributions to society so vital and profound.
Beneath the quiet exterior, INFJs hold deep convictions about the weightier matters of life.Those who are activists - INFJs gravitate toward such a role - are there for the cause, not for personal glory or political power.
INFJs are champions of the oppressed and downtrodden.They often are found in the wake of an emergency, rescuing those who are in acute distress.INFJs may fantasize about getting revenge on those who victimize the defenseless.The concept of 'poetic justice' is appealing to the INFJ.
"There's something rotten in Denmark." Accurately suspicious about others' motives, INFJs are not easily led.These are the people that you can rarely fool any of the time.Though affable and sympathetic to most, INFJs are selective about their friends. Such a friendship is a symbiotic bond that transcends mere words.
INFJs have a knack for fluency in language and facility in communication. In addition, nonverbal sensitivity enables the INFJ to know and be known by others intimately.
Writing, counseling, public service and even politics are areas where INFJs frequently find their niche.
Yeah, a lot definitely does sound like Aerie. Deep convictions, high degree of empathy, forming exremely close friendships with a select few. And I'd always pegged as the NPC most likely (in other circumstances at least), to become a novelist since she does have a poetic way of speaking sometimes, but I suspect would find it much easier expressing thoughts on paper. Nalia could be this too, although I've not tried filling in the test for her.
On the INTJ front, which I am, it seems I'm grouped with famous fictional characters like Gandalf, which is nice... also Professor Moriarty and Hannibal Lecter. But don't worry; I don't eat human flesh. It tastes like pork, and I don't really like pork.
"INTPs thrive on systems"
"One of the tipoffs that a person is an INTP is his or her obsession with logical correctness."
@CrevsDaak
Lord of chaos?
I'm going to give a full explanation tomorrow when I have the time, I make kind acts but I am also someone who enjoys making others feel bad (a sadist) and does not even care about money nor laws.
This seems to suggest a remarkable accuracy.
According to Myers-Briggs, INFPs focus much of their energy on an inner world dominated by intense feeling and deeply held ethics. They seek an external life that is in keeping with these values. Loyal to the people and causes important to them, INFPs can quickly spot opportunities to implement their ideals. They are curious to understand those around them, and so are accepting and flexible except when their values are threatened.
According to Keirsey, based on observations of behavior, notable INFPs may include Princess Diana, George Orwell, Aldous Huxley, Audrey Hepburn, Richard Gere, Albert Schweitzer and Isabel Myers.
The polite, reserved exterior of INFPs can at first make them difficult to get to know. They enjoy conversation, however, taking particular delight in the unusual. When INFPs are in a sociable mood, their humor and charm shine through. Disposed to like people and to avoid conflict, INFPs tend to make pleasant company.
Devoted to those in their inner circle, INFPs guard the emotional well-being of others, consoling those in distress. Guided by their desire for harmony, INFPs prefer to be flexible unless their ethics are violated. Then, they become passionate advocates for their beliefs. They are often able to sway the opinions of others through tact, diplomacy, and an ability to see varying sides of an issue.
INFPs develop these insights through reflection, and they require substantial time alone to ponder and process new information. While they can be quite patient with complex material, they are generally bored by routine. Though not always organized, INFPs are meticulous about things they value. Perfectionists, they may have trouble completing a task because it cannot meet their high standards. They may even go back to a completed project after the deadline so they can improve it.
INFPs are creative types and often have a gift for language. As introverts, they may prefer to express themselves through writing. Their dominant Feeling drives their desire to communicate, while their auxiliary intuition supplies the imagination. Having a talent for symbolism, they enjoy metaphors and similes. They continually seek new ideas and adapt well to change. They prefer working in an environment that values these gifts and allows them to make a positive difference in the world, according to their personal beliefs.
That sounds about right. Age has a way of tempering personality.
EDIT: the result earlier is for the test posted by @winters. Taking the test posted by @Loub, I got ISTP. Not that it's very different. The I and T are consistent, and I attribute the changes on the S-N and J-P axes to weak preferences.
As a side note, I have gone horribly wrong with my trance routine, which has now driven me to psychosis.
Brain fart, ignore me, I am currently experimenting with hiperfocus so my judgement may be a little clouded.
Though I suppose there are alternatives.
@Dee ?
I admit, I brainfarted, but I cleaned the smears with Vanish, you see?
Ech... I just hope the kid didn't see that, my madness is contagious enough as it is.
I didn't quote you because I'm not trying to "tell on you", and I appreciate you rethinking your words. Hell, I appreciate the impetus to rethink words.
The thing is, I count @CrevsDaak among my friends, and while I apologize for pouncing, I'm prone to defending my buddies, and I have no compunctions about that.
I think it behooves all of us to remember that we were all drawn here here by the one thing, irrespective of our myriad differences, that we have in common: the love of the game.
At the end of the day, this is a community, and we all benefit from it so long as we make a point of respecting each other.
Sorry for bloviating.
My own hyperfocus is currently damaged as a result of trance gone wrong, and as such I am incapable of sound judgement, as should be obvious from the conduct unbecoming uncharacteristic of my current iteration.
The thing is, my skin is smelling of cocoa butter and because of that mosquitos are drawn to me, as I am allergic to them, their bites create pustules that must be pierced to get the pus out. I have also decided to buy a new mouse since my touchpad fried due to things you'd rather not know. I am also thinking of taking alignment tests again, including this one, to see how much my personality changes due to psychosis.
Edit: No patience for the tests, moving on.
@Blackraven know that I also consider @CrevsDaak to be a good person, although the concept of friendship is alien to me, as you should be familiar with my actions towards others, he is, like I said, intelligent, but often errs on his own judgement - his preconceptions are familiar, given that in his innocence, he has not faced much opportunity to exercise real, alignment changing actions, which mark me as the Madman from Baumschneis. He is a high/middle school student from Argentina who slacks off during Portuguese classes by playing with his iPad, which I am not sure I am hoping to add with these facts, but they're interesting. He also sleeps during class due to the fact that he is a night owl. He also has to take quite a trip from his house to school. He is also 14. He is also male. He also acts like he was much older at times. He also lacks advanced phonetical knowledge of the English language.
@Blackraven hates me due to my distate for poisons, weepee! I don't need them, nor should anyone, since it is entirely possible to replicate their madness with trance, which I also accidentally did now. Blackraven is also a teacher. Blackraven teaches English. Blackraven is not a Bachelor of the Letters. Blackraven didn't study linguistics. Blackraven lives in a Spanish-speaking country. Blackraven is Dutch.
@jackjack is a bard. jackjack likes arts. jackjack's favorite word is 'philistine'. jackjack is older than most people in the forum. jackjack also seeds deceit. jackjack is chaotic. He is not an actor.
@meagloth is.
@jacobtan is an adult. jacobtan likes plushes. jacobtan's plushes are not named after political figures. jacobtan doesn't know Charlotte Corday nor Max Weber. jacobtan studied mathematics. jacobtan was an English teacher. jacobtan is a mystery. His plushes are dirty. His race is indeterminate. He wears glasses. His glasses are frameless. He has a buzz cut. He has a receding hairline. He is capable of growing a beard. His hair is gray. His eyes are brown.
@Loub is insane. Loub has Asperger's. Loub is a teacher. Loub has a plush beluga named after the assassin of Marat. Loub has a plush frog named after a german capitalist sociologist. Loub's favorite word is 'cotyledon'. Loub sleeps on a futon. Loub's futon is dirty. Loub smells of cocoa butter. Loub has cystic acne. His hair is brown. His eyes are black. He is incapable of growing a beard. Loub's epithet is 'The Madman from Baumschneis'. Loub doesn't do drugs. Loub is drugs.
Allow me to fire one last parting shot my friend. I will help bring the topic back on track thereafter.
@meagloth
Some things... are better not seen, even if they have been recorded for posterity or if they had already left their marks on the memories of witnesses. In life, there is no such thing called "undo the damage" or "unsay the words". And there is no "un-break my heart" too
@Loub
I do not usually speak up so openly, but I am glad you caught my drift even if I did not refer to you directly, and removed the paragraph accordingly.
There are unspoken ground rules in any community regarding interactions with one another. Those words you said, they are uncalled for. This is a community where people from disparate walks of life are drawn together by a game, a virtual place where we can indulge in some fantasies, if only to make RL just a little more bearable.
As people, we all have our quirks. Some are playful, some sarcastic, some blunt, but most of the regulars here observe the aforementioned ground rules. Regardless of intelligence, life experience or beliefs, there is no need to elevate oneself on a pedestal and put down another, whether it is through a superfluous use of bombastic vocabulary, a pedantic display of grammatical accuracy, or presumption of wisdom that supposedly grants one the authority to speak down to another.
And no, I do not believe there is such a thing called "misspeak". I believe in "out of the overflow of the heart the mouth speaks". I would like to believe that you are a much better person than you initially appear to be based on the faux pas that I have seen from you
For RP purposes, do you actually do an MBTI test and try matching it to your alignment?