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Two Handed Weapon Balance Mod?

cwf1986cwf1986 Member Posts: 11
Is there a mod that helps close the gap between two handed weapons and dual wielding? In BG2, for a fighter there's only 2 weapons I think of off hand that even come close to dual wielding and that's Carsomyr and the Soul Reaver and you have to have either a Paladin or have an evil warrior for those. The silver sword can be pretty situationally decent too, at least any warrior can use that one. I suppose there's also Joril's dagger but I still can't compare that to a celestial fury/defender of easthaven combo or flail of ages/belm, or a combo with crom faeyr.

I don't really care how the balance is done. It could be an item mod, something that changes the benefits for two weapon style, or whatever.

Comments

  • DreadKhanDreadKhan Member Posts: 3,859
    If you have EE, the Staff of the Ram is pretty much the hsrdest hitter by a tiny margin, but the knock away can be a huge hassle.

    I'm not sure you really need to improve THS to compete... usually easier to find good immunities on them or they are eady to get. CF and FotA +5 are both straight up overpowered. CF is just straight up the best BG2 weapon, and FotA pretty much rules ToB.

    DWing should probably have worse THAC0 or damage. Thst would be better, but make Blades and Swashies very weak.

  • TJ_HookerTJ_Hooker Member Posts: 2,438
    I'm not sure FotA+5 is really the best option, as you can't use it with Improved Haste.

  • DreadKhanDreadKhan Member Posts: 3,859
    TJ_Hooker said:

    I'm not sure FotA+5 is really the best option, as you can't use it with Improved Haste.

    Its best used without DWing and using GWW. Sws helps obviously, but not required. You can dw with a speed weapon when not GWWing still. Or even use something else mainhand until you want to use it.*shrug* the slow effect is huge, and 10 elemental damage of vsrious types means something gets through. SotR can't get around Stoneskin!

    TJ_Hooker
  • cwf1986cwf1986 Member Posts: 11
    I've already though about a build in SOA that uses two handed weapons and because of all the different offensive or defensive effects of single handed weapons, I still can't think of anything that compares.

    Shield of harmony is fairly easy to get and that does what Lilarcor does and more leaving you room to use one of the many weapons that has a nifty offensive attribute like slow, or sleep, or stun, or chance of extra elemental damage, and the list just goes on and on. And some of those weapons are easy to get early. Flail of ages does nearly as much damage and has an effect nearly as good Joril's Dagger and arguably better depending on your build. The equalizer is actually pretty decent because it's like a one hand lilarcor but you do get it pretty late and I'm more of a believer in a strong offense.

    Unless you fit certain tight criteria (Carsomyr for Paladin, Staff of the Magi for fighter/mage is at the very least as good as Carsomyr, Soul Reaver if you have an evil warrior), the only two hander that compares is the Vorpal Sword and there are some situations where it really isn't all that useful. I will give that there are situations your very happy to have it for sure.


  • DreadKhanDreadKhan Member Posts: 3,859
    Okay, if you're gonna be difficult...

    FotA is a grest SoA weapon, sure. Impaler +3 does a heck of a lot more damage though. It also has reach, and is very low speedfactor. There is a +4 Staff purchaseable right outside Chateau Irenicus, which can hit about anything in SoA, FotA can't, nor can CF.

    The Harmonium Halberd gives an str boost, meaning depending on your str, thats pretty significant. Purchaseable early. Joril's Dagger hits hard, 9.5 average, and can cause confusion. Confusion is a show stopper when it works, especially for Mages. FotA does 10.5 aversge, but 1 rank in THS will equalize them. There is Warblade, averages 10.5 and is +4. Deals 11.5 with THS, better than FotA, and can hit about anything.

    Dragon's Breath has 5 elemental damage of 5 types, 10.5 damage average. Blackmist can blind foes, very useful, and is +4. Wave isn't bad, 11.75 damage average. Spears get Impaler (16.5 average before profs!) and Spear of Withering (11.5) in SoA, but you're stuck with so-so spears until then. Spear of the Unicorn gives to nice immunities, but damage is unimpressive. That save bonus is good for non-shorties.

    2h has some gems in ToB too, several solid 2h swords, Ravager, Ixil, SotR, etc.

  • cwf1986cwf1986 Member Posts: 11
    Oh the hell with it, I'll just go with a two-handed weapon character build and see how it goes. See if I can make it work so I have experience to compare instead of theoreticals.

    DreadKhan
  • DreadKhanDreadKhan Member Posts: 3,859
    Probably easiest to not use a GM build unless you know exactly which weapon type you'll be sticking with.

    Also, 1 rank in 2hs is usually plenty, -2 speed factor is helpful mostly in BG1 halberd users relying on melee kiting.

    Feel free to talk about your findings later!

  • cwf1986cwf1986 Member Posts: 11
    I've never been able to do melee kiting, but I love ranged kiting with rangers. Hide in shadows behind a door or rock or tree or whatever, lay down a round of arrows, hide again and find another spot to repeat haha.

    Anyway, how do you melee kite effectively?

    DreadKhan
  • DreadKhanDreadKhan Member Posts: 3,859
    Well, ideally you want a fast reach weapon, so a staff or spear, and if all goes well, as soon as you make an attack roll you move away. Most enemies will prove unable to hit back. Halberd really needs better speed for this to work reliably, but 2hs ** is -4, and with a +1 halberd thats speed 5, which may still not swing first. If you had GM you'd be 3 faster, which IS good. Anyways, you want to have the To Hit roll feedback on, so you know when you actually swung! Great for Kensai in early BG1.

    Staves are strictly better than spears in BG1, but in BG2, spears get very competetive, but the best are in the Underdark, so go down under early, do the harder quests later.

    I enourmously enjoyed a Berserker to thief that GMed th swords, but Kensai would be 'better', if you don't need the immunities.

    If you were to mod THS, I'd give something extra for the 2nd pip, or allow 3 pips, and make the 3rd pip do something. +1 to hit might be worth a 3rd pip, without being great. You should similarly improve sws though, or it'll suck!

  • The user and all related content has been deleted.

    DreadKhan
  • cwf1986cwf1986 Member Posts: 11
    I can't find the item revisions mod for BG2EE. Do you happen to have a link or is it a mod where I could use a pre-EE version and just copy and paste into the override?

  • cwf1986cwf1986 Member Posts: 11
    edited November 2014
    Yeah... after playing two-handed style for a while it just doesn't compare to dual wielding in SOA because of not just the dps but the special effects of some of the offhand weapons like defender of easthaven or belm for just a couple of examples. To add to that, both of those weapons are easy to get early and can take you through TOB. To make them comparable, I'm doing go into that near infinity file and nerf two weapon style and boost the other styles.

    I'm going to add damage to 2 handed and increase the crit chance once notch for 2 proficiency points with that one. I'll kick everything back one notch for 2 weapon style. I'll add thaco for 1-hand style. One handed should be especially good for thieves and mages since they need all the thaco improvements they can get. I'll also give a straight AC bonus for shield and sword. I think these changes will make any style comparable from the start to the end.

    I did find item revisions mod... maybe after a couple playthroughs but not for now, but thanks for the suggestion.

    Post edited by cwf1986 on
  • The user and all related content has been deleted.

  • cwf1986cwf1986 Member Posts: 11
    I hadn't thought about an AC penalty! I like that even better than a steeper thaco penalty. It makes great roleplay sense and even with a steeper thaco penalty it still will mostly not matter through mid-late SOA and TOB with the crazy thaco warriors get.

  • jimmysdabestcopjimmysdabestcop Member Posts: 74
    Really noticeable in IWD EE where you create all the characters there is almost no reason not to dual wield all of your melee characters. Even ranged characters and just manually switch weapons.

    I actually think creating a 3rd Pip for Two Handed style would work. Allow it to make an extra attack. And another +1 to hit and damage cumulative with 1st Pip. And maybe critical on 18 now too.

    I do agree all 2 handed weapons should be 1d12 for damage. Or actually would prefer 2d6.

    So many weapons especially if most of your party uses a different kind. It pretty easy to dual wield two +3 weapons, or a +5 and +4.

  • cwf1986cwf1986 Member Posts: 11
    I've been thinking hard about getting IWD:EE. I barely played IWD back in the day, I can't even remember why I lost interest.

    It's my understanding that it's a bit more hack and slash oriented with well built dungeons with really cool backgrounds. Is that about right?

    Kilivitz
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