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Hide in Shadows OR Move silently on magic items?

So, I picked up the Ring of shadows and it gives +15% to Hide in Shadows. Makes sense, right? But it got me to thinking on who to give it too. I have a Ranger in my group as well as a Mage/Thief. Now, rangers get a stock percentage increase on level up to both HiS and MS, thus keeping things equal. My Mage/Thief on the other hand, has a chose to spend (or not) on either or both.

Considering that the net chance to remain hidden is a combination of both scores, it seems that giving the ring to my Ranger means that I am taking the ring at half efficiency unless I find another item that gives the other piece of the equation.

I am not saying the item is of no value, merely that it is of lesser value to someone who can't tailor their scores to the items that they receive.



  • CaptRoryCaptRory Member Posts: 1,660
    Doesn't Hide improve your chances of stealthing in the first place? When swiping things sometimes you just need to hide for a few seconds to reach the stairs and dodge the guards.
  • the_spyderthe_spyder Member Posts: 5,018
    I could be wrong, but as I understand it (as with the BG games) the ability to remain unseen is a function of HiS and MS averaged out. So if you have a 60 HiS and a 40 MS, it works out to be 50 on your roll. Thus a bonus of +15 to one, when they are both at 50 it takes your chance to "hide" from 50 ((50+50)/2) to 57.5 ((50+65)/2).

    On the other hand, if you plan around this (either before or after you get the item) and are a thief, you can simply put all 15 points into the reciprocal ability and thus realize a +15 benefit instead of a +7.5 benefit. Rangers, on the other hand, are SOL and only ever get the +7.5 because their ability scores progress at a static rate.

    Now, racial benefits may alter this slightly so....

    Again, unless I am mistaken about the way it works.
  • WowoWowo Member Posts: 2,058
    I'm pretty sure that the stealth skill is just a combination of the two scores so it doesn't matter if one is higher than the other.

    Though I have heard a rumor that it's better to increase move silently first.
  • jackjackjackjack Member Posts: 3,251
    Agreed ^ ^
    Six of one, half a dozen of the other.
  • the_spyderthe_spyder Member Posts: 5,018
    TJ_Hooker said:

    I don't follow your reasoning. Regardless of who wears the ring, they're going to get a +7.5% increase to stealth chance. It doesn't matter what there skill levels are or whether the skill levels are matched. In that example, yes thief will be better at stealth, but only because they've already invested additional skill points into their stealth abilities. They got +7.5% from the skill points they invested, and +7.5% from the ring. The bonus they get from the ring is the same as it would be for the ranger.

    Actually, not true. If my thief invests points such that her HiS is 50 and her MS is 65, she gets the full +15 lift as 65+65/2 = 65. Rangers, on the other hand, don't have that option and will always only get 7.5

    And that is the essence of my point. From a real world RPG perspective, my thief gets the ring and spends the next few levels working on the reciprocal skill set exclusively and gets the 'Full' bonus. That means that the thief has those 15 points to spend elsewhere with no "penalty". Granted, if they do keep the 'base' skills equal, they lose out just the same way as Rangers, but why then would they?

    At the end of the day, it is a small lift, but mathematically, it is not zero. Just wondered if people had given it much thought and if anyone cared that much.
  • the_spyderthe_spyder Member Posts: 5,018
    edited December 2014
    So, to make it clear, their percent goes up by 7.5, but they have 15 points to put elsewhere. Meaning that a thief actually gets a 22.5 bump whereas the ranger gets the 7.5.

    And before this becomes another math lesson, clearly no one thinks it is an issue, so let's just drop it entirely.

    Thanks for the feedback folks.
  • BelanosBelanos Member Posts: 968 seems that giving the ring to my Ranger means that I am taking the ring at half efficiency unless I find another item that gives the other piece of the equation.

    Which you are most likely to. I usually find both that ring you mention plus some bots to balance things out. Not always, as the boots are a random drop, but they do exist in the game.

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