Is the War chant of Sith too cheesy?

DJKajuru

jackjack

Lots of stuff makes this game easier, but personally, I've never found it too easy. War Chant of the Sith makes Bards viable, so I say leave it alone.

Lord_Tansheron

It's not even the best bard song (Skald's song is). Regeneration is honestly nothing I really cared about in either BG or IWD. There is practically no penalty for resting 99% of the time, so even if you spent ten years in those mountains by the end of the game it'll be exactly the same as someone spending ten days. I guess there is RP to consider with this, but when you're arguing about power levels I sort of assume RP is not part of the discussion to begin with, so...

The in-combat aspect of the regeneration is cute, but it's usually not enough of an impact to make a noticeable difference - and for that you give up offensive powers. I don't like going defensive on anything but tanks.

Also, I am all for good songs in general. Giving up practically all actions on one of your characters just to sing better come with a SERIOUS upside.

DreadKhan

Well, it was a gargantuan buff in HoW when it came out (suddenly resistance could get so high that slashing was likely worthless against your best tank), and was incredibly convenient in areas that had auto-respawns that were tougher, mostly to keep party healthy BETWEEN fights. Drowned Dead and Remorhaz were a pain in the butt if you didn't have this. Regeneration that low offers little during battle itself, even with the resistance, but after the fight? yeah, really nifty. IWD2 really made this song dubious in utility by dropping the regeneration outside battle, but it still wasn't out rightly bad.

With the option of using a Skald song instead now, its harder to say War Chant is really THAT good. Combining the Tymora song with Skald song might be a fun trick actually, but War Chant isn't exactly game breaking unless you are rocking a tank that manages to break 90% resistance to all damage, or are using a sub-optimal tank (IE a Kensai with defensive weapons to tank). Its not a bad thing to have though if you make liberal use of summoned fodder I imagine.

Most of the time, you will need to rest anyways to replenish used up abilities/powers, so the regen has less value, but the resistance itself would be more useful at max difficulty, to offset the higher damage. Of course, you ALSO take less damage if you just win faster. But, if you are using a Bard as one of your Arcane sources, I imagine having the Bard do all the healing too is reasonably handy, except there isn't many reasons to NOT load up on Clerics in IWD.

tldr Nope, not overpowered.

Jarrakul

Nah. It's extremely powerful if you're trying to minimize resting, but otherwise it's merely good.

Grum

I have one in an elven (and half-elf) party. On paper it sounded great, but I'm usually too impatient to sit around for the heal. In combat it is useful, but not 6th character useful. He's now there only for pre-combat buffs and fireballs, fllowed by being marignally useful while singing.

Lord_Tansheron

Jarrakul said:

Nah. It's extremely powerful if you're trying to minimize resting, but otherwise it's merely good.

But isn't that just an arbitrary choice? There is practically no penalty for resting. Calling something "extremely powerful" under self-imposed conditions seems a bit weird of a statement, don't you think? Though I get the QoL aspect of it, many people seem to dislike long rest numbers for some reason.

jackjack

Maybe it's because constantly camping in a frozen wasteland and not dying of hypothermia and/or exposure seems somehow… unrealistic?

DJKajuru

Lord_Tansheron said:

Jarrakul said:

Nah. It's extremely powerful if you're trying to minimize resting, but otherwise it's merely good.

But isn't that just an arbitrary choice? There is practically no penalty for resting. Calling something "extremely powerful" under self-imposed conditions seems a bit weird of a statement, don't you think? Though I get the QoL aspect of it, many people seem to dislike long rest numbers for some reason.

I avoid resting until I've completely finished a dungeon. RPwise , it doesn't make much sense to take a nap in the middle of a dungeon while there are enemies in the next room.

DreadKhan

jackjack said:

Maybe it's because constantly camping in a frozen wasteland and not dying of hypothermia and/or exposure seems somehow… unrealistic?

Has anyone done a mod that features cold damage to PCs over time in certain areas? Not everywhere in the IWD game is super-cold, but resting outdoors in the Vale of Shadows seems pretty absurd from a survival standpoint.

Obsidian

Vale of Shadows? How about Wyrm's Tooth? Or, worse, Gloomfrost or Icasaracht's island?

War Chant is awesome and should be left alone :P

ZanathKariashi

Compared to everything else in the game, Warsith is actually pretty tame, especially compared to the new stuff they've added.

While i would always advocate PnP accurate Bard/Skald songs (which DO NOT take your bard/skald out of action to do nothing but sing, but are a little less powerful), the current songs are ok....if they're going to make your bard sit around around and do nothing but sing, they BETTER make it powerful (And it does sort-of-kind help for all the other stuff they've short-changed bards on, though IWD is at least better in the spell-casting department then BG2 treated them).

Cluas

In the original it was more useful, as there were more places you couldn't rest ... : )

Jarrakul

Lord_Tansheron said:

But isn't that just an arbitrary choice? There is practically no penalty for resting. Calling something "extremely powerful" under self-imposed conditions seems a bit weird of a statement, don't you think? Though I get the QoL aspect of it, many people seem to dislike long rest numbers for some reason.

Well, yes. You'll note I voted that it's not overpowered. While minimizing rests is a fairly common way to play, it's clearly a self-imposed restriction, rather than something that comes from the game mechanics. It would indeed be very strange to base a general judgment of an ability on the ways in which players choose to handicap themselves. I don't feel that that's what I did. I registered my official judgment in the poll, and reiterated it in the post itself. But the reason I felt the need to make a post at all, rather than just voting, is that I had a comment to make on how the ability interacts with a common self-imposed handicap. I certainly didn't mean to imply I thought that judgment should reflect on the general assessment of the ability.