Party without thief?

Azagio

Hey together,
I'm new to the game and have a few questions. I just completed the quest where i get Dynaheir. Now i saw that Dynaheir and Minsc work the same way as Khalid and Jaheira - either you take both or none. The members of my party atm are my sorcerer, kagain as tank, imoen with a bow and minsc with a two-handed sword. I want to have only 4 party members because of the faster leveling. So i need to kick one member because i really want to keep minsc and thought of Imoen. My question: Is a Party without a thief possible? Is this party constellation good?

And another short question about a different issue: Minsc is a Ranger and can only get specialized with weapons. But he can invest 3 points in two-weapon-style? Is this a exception?

I hope someone can help me with my questions

Greets,
Azagio

Pingwin

Thieves are pretty much essential. They are the only class that can disarm traps. You can complete the game without a thief but it will be a struggle.

If you really want a party of 4, you could sack Kagain. He is evil and will get upset if your party gets a very high reputation. Or take Dynaheir along as a party of 5 and let her stray into the claws of some passing monsters.

elminster

Azagio said:

And another short question about a different issue: Minsc is a Ranger and can only get specialized with weapons. But he can invest 3 points in two-weapon-style? Is this a exception?

Yes. Rangers and Paladins can get *** in two-weapon style.

elminster

I would ditch Kagain as well.

Musigny

It is also good to know that the XP cap is set at 161000 points. If you like to explore all the areas and manage all the quests then a 6 member team will hit that limit (long) before the end of the game.
I don't want to dissuade you from running a 4 member team, this is just for your information.

Azagio

Thanks for the fast answers.
I didn't know the fact with the XP cap and the effects of low/high reputation until now. If i'm gonna ditch Kagain, are there any good tanks except khalid?

Heindrich

Khalid and Kagain are the natural tanks, in that they can do a good job without much effort. Beyond them, Dorn is a combat monster, thought not strictly a tank, and he is also evil. Yeslick can be a very good tank if you give him the Dexterity guantlets (without it he is a reasonably good frontliner anyway), but he is not available right at the start of the game.

If you are interested in carrying on your game into BG2, and you care about the plot, I recommend you keep Imoen around. She is the most important NPC in terms of relevance to the main story, though it won't become apparent until BG2.

Gallowglass

Ajantis is also a pretty effective tank, and you can get him early.

Actually, in BG1ee, many of the joinable NPCs are viable as tanks if you give them suitable equipment. For example, it may be a more instantly-obvious use for a Cleric to stand back and use a Sling or cast spells, but Clerics can be out front in heavy armour if you wish, and they're fine.

FrdNwsm

I like having clerics able to stand in the front line should the occasion require it. I have four folks in heavy armor; MyChar, Khalid, Branwen and Jaheira all have either full plate or Ankheg plate, with ACs -4 to -6. Two mages (Neera and Imoen) with AC 0. Gear is important (robes of the archmagus ... there's one set of each alignment available at High Hedge).

Early on, I think decent thieves are essential, simply because you don't have anyone who can take a serious pounding from traps. I decided to dual class Imoen into a mage at level 7 however, so I have been doing without a thief since that time; she's up to level 7 mage now. One more level and I'll have her thief skills back, just in time for the end game run. Locked boxes/doors can be forced open, or if that fails both my mages pack one knock spell apiece. Branwen and Jaheira each have one find traps spell memorized. MyChar (half-orc berserker) has become a total beast, so the method of disarming traps right now is this: everybody else ducks out of sight around a corner while MyChar, holding Spider's Bane, runs through it in a berserk frenzy. With 105 HP, having free action in effect, and being immune to mental attacks such as dire charm, this is pretty safe. Also has the boots of speed, so he can run back for healing really really fast if needed

FrdNwsm

And yes, you can do side quests, like steal the telescope from the Hall of Wonders, without a thief in the party. You can even be recruited by the Thieve's Guild to do stuff like act as lookout. I leave the details to your ingenuity.

Grum

Thieves are not necessary. I've gone through BG1 without a thief. In my current BG2 run I don't have a thief either. I've got a mage who casts knock, sure...and traps do hurt. But what doesn't kill you can be healed.

FrdNwsm

>> In my current BG2 run I don't have a thief either.<<

You dumped Imoen? In favor of whom?

Bejogo

This is all good advice, but I do feel that if this is your first playthrough, you should avoid metagaming too much. A big part of the charm of Baldur's Gate is figuring out the world yourself; the rules, the quirks of the engine, what you can and can't get away with, what you can do without and what is indispensible.

If you're curious, try the game for a while without a thief and see how you get on. If you find yourself struggling, recruit yourself another thief—you definitely aren't short of choices. This game is so full of NPCs that you can use them as ammunition.

DreadKhan

If you aren't knowledgable about where all the traps are, I would bring a thief. Imoen is a pretty handy Archer as a thief, so she isn't dead weight. There are VERY strong magic ammo for bows, though you won't be tripping over it early In the game its worth having a dedicated bow user.

Ranged attacks are really useful, especially in BG1. Minsc should consider getting a Composite Longbow, if only to use until enemies get up close. The +1 version is available at Feldeposts, and is a great bargain.

Archaos

I would advise against making a party of four if you're new.

It doesn't matter that you're levelling up faster. You will reach the cap sooner and the you will be short of more firepower or muscle.
Especially in the expansion and the final battle.

Generally, you would want two warriors, one thief, one priest and two mages.
Since you're a Sorcerer, you can have Minsc (offense warrior), Imoen (Thief), Jaheira (Priest), Khalid (Tanking) and someone else. You could put Yeslick or Adjantis there.

Also a first timer without a Thief is bad.
Play the game naturally, don't powergame. Especially for your first time.
Nevermind that in BG2, you will miss on ton of dialogue and banter if you make a party of four.

matrice

To ditch duo, you can kill one person of the duo, and then reform party, the 2nd dude will not leave

FrdNwsm

>>Ranged attacks are really useful, especially in BG1<<

Absolutely; everyone in my group has some missile weapon or other. Those pesky kobold commandos drop fire arrows +2, there are 4-5 magic slings and various types of magical bullets available, and +1 bows of all types. Missiles whittle down melee fighters while they are closing, and take mages under fire at a distance while your fighters run at them.

FrdNwsm

If you ARE thief-less, for whatever reason, and your clerical types detect a trap in a small enclosed room, cast protection from lightning on whomever you send in to trigger it. Good chance it's a lightning trap, with the bolt intended to rebound off the walls and hit the victim 4-5 times before it dissipates.