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Lowest thac0

haniatri72haniatri72 Member Posts: 25
in New Players (NO SPOILERS!)
Just a random question, but does anyone know what the lowest thac0 possible is for charname?

I'm sure it's possible to get much lower but I got a -2 with an elven archer ( I can't remember what bow and arrows I had).

Comments

  • joluvjoluv Member Posts: 2,137
    Let's say you play an Elven Archer with 19 dexterity and you're at level 8 (max for BGEE). Then with a basic longbow and arrows, you could get

    13 (base THAC0) - 3 (weapon mastery bonus) - 3 (dexterity bonus) - 2 (Archer bonus) - 1 (Elf longbow bonus) = 4

    With some magical equipment, you can get lower:
    - 3 (Long Bow of Marksmanship) - 4 (Arrows of Piercing) - 2 (Bracers of Archery) = -5

    After that, you can get temporary buffs from spells and potions. Potions of Power, Heroism, and Mind Focusing will all improve your ranged THAC0.
  • JarrakulJarrakul Member Posts: 2,029
    You forgot the Helm of Balduran, @joluv. That brings the total before buffs to -6. If it can be stretched farther than that, I don't know how.
  • MetallomanMetalloman Member, Moderator, Translator (NDA) Posts: 3,975
    Too bad that raising to 20 (like with DEX tome) gives no bonuses... one should reach 21 DEX to gain another AC and THAC0 bonus; next step is 26 DEX.

    Excerpt from the BG:EE manual:

    image
  • joluvjoluv Member Posts: 2,137
    A good reason to give that manual to Coran.
  • DexterDexter Member Posts: 253
    someone would like to do the maths for lower mele thac0 before buffs?
  • reedmilfamreedmilfam Member Posts: 2,808
    Coran can't go to the next game; best bang for buck is manuals for CHARNAME.
  • joluvjoluv Member Posts: 2,137
    edited April 2015
    @Dexter: In BGEE, a level 8 unkitted fighter with 18/00 strength, a +3 weapon with high mastery, Gauntlets of Weapon Expertise, and Helm of Balduran has base THAC0 13 - 3 (strength) - 3 (weapon) - 3 (proficiency) - 1 (gauntlets) - 1 (helm) = 2.

    I'm probably missing something, but I don't see how to improve this. Having 19 or 20 strength won't help. A Kensai could match it without wearing the gauntlets or helm. An Elf could switch out the +3 weapon for Varscona because of the racial long sword bonus.

    EDIT: @reedmilfam: That depends on whether they actually help CHARNAME.
  • JarrakulJarrakul Member Posts: 2,029
    Swashbuckler 5 (or 6) -> fighter 8 dual gives another +1 to hit, bringing the total to 1. An elven character can also get to 1 by using the shortsword +3, but elves can't dual class, so as far as I can figure, 1 is the best we can do.
  • GoturalGotural Member Posts: 1,229
    Drink a Potion of Power / Potion of Heroism and some Str Potion, then use the innate ability Draw Upon Holy Might to reach 25 STR, this should get you a THAC0 in the negatives.
  • JarrakulJarrakul Member Posts: 2,029
    Definitely, but the question was about unbuffed THAC0. If we're allowing buffs, I bet we can get another 10 points at least.
  • joluvjoluv Member Posts: 2,137
    @Jarrakul: I'm calling you buff bluff.
  • GodGod Member Posts: 1,150
    Half-orc.
  • joluvjoluv Member Posts: 2,137
    @God: ?
  • GodGod Member Posts: 1,150
    Half-orc is the lowest thac0 for a mêlée-oriented Charname.
  • TJ_HookerTJ_Hooker Member Posts: 2,438
    edited April 2015
    God said:

    Half-orc is the lowest thac0 for a mêlée-oriented Charname.

    19 STR is no better than 18/00 in terms of THAC0, so a half-orc won't have a better THAC0; you'll just have an easier time rolling the character. Going to 20 STR doesn't improve THAC0 either, so even the STR tome won't change anything.
  • JarrakulJarrakul Member Posts: 2,029
    joluv said:

    @Jarrakul: I'm calling you buff bluff.

    I honestly have no idea if that was a bluff or not, but let's find out.

    Okay, so our character is an elven berserker with the Shortsword of Backstabbing. That gives us our starting THAC0 of 1. We rage for +2. We drink a Potion of Power to set our base THAC0 (13) to 80% of its normal value (10), giving us an effective +3. We drink a Potion of Cloud Giant Strength and then use our DUHM innate power, bringing our strength to 25, which gives an additional +4 above our current bonus. We then use the Sandthief's Ring to make ourselves invisible, giving us +4 to hit for one attack. That's +13, in total, or a final THAC0 of -12. Admittedly, only for one attack, but we're not including supporting casters, either. A Bless and a Chant would give us another +2, and a mage could cast Improved Invisibility to make us invisible for longer.
  • GoturalGotural Member Posts: 1,229
    Considering the section of the forum, the title and the OP, I'm not sure the original question was about unbuffed THAC0, maybe more about lowest THAC0 in general.
  • JarrakulJarrakul Member Posts: 2,029
    Let me rephrase. The inquiry about melee weapons was without buffs. I assumed that's what you were referring to, since you mentioned strength buffs. You're right that the initial question didn't mention buffs either way.
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