Edwin Romance Mod, "that" fight with the Red Wizards. Spoiler.
UnderstandMouseMagic
Member Posts: 2,147
So there was I breezing through BG2 with Edwin (love of my life), Anomen and Vicky. Pretty OP as had been playing solo for a while at the beginning and only 4 or less in the party most of the time.
Finished all quests except Firkraag in chapter 2/3, and would be going to Spellhold straight after doing that.
And then WTF?
That fight is insanely difficult, talking WK final seals levels of hurt.
And no warnings anywhere as far as I can find.
So wondering, is it just me and I can't really play this game at all?
I had to use huge amounts of buffing potions, all the various items that summon anything, (genii bottle, spider thing, golum book, staff of fire control, berserker horn ect.), Anomen and Vicky hiding in the corner calling up a graveyard and the odd pitfiend, Edwin chucking out disabling and debuffing spells like there's no tomorrow, and that was just to deal with the guards.
Funnily enough, the mages weren't so bad as the S of TM made short work of them. And the Lich , well we just kept out of his way until the end.
Took a lot of attempts to keep us all alive to the end.
Just wondering what would have happened had it occured earlier when we were at much lower levels?
As it was, for the first time ever I turned down the level to "core rules" to finish it and carry on because I kept on losing at least one NPC and I'm not keen on resurrecting.
Mind you, the rewards were worth it, not least, another pair of BOS.
Finished all quests except Firkraag in chapter 2/3, and would be going to Spellhold straight after doing that.
And then WTF?
That fight is insanely difficult, talking WK final seals levels of hurt.
And no warnings anywhere as far as I can find.
So wondering, is it just me and I can't really play this game at all?
I had to use huge amounts of buffing potions, all the various items that summon anything, (genii bottle, spider thing, golum book, staff of fire control, berserker horn ect.), Anomen and Vicky hiding in the corner calling up a graveyard and the odd pitfiend, Edwin chucking out disabling and debuffing spells like there's no tomorrow, and that was just to deal with the guards.
Funnily enough, the mages weren't so bad as the S of TM made short work of them. And the Lich , well we just kept out of his way until the end.
Took a lot of attempts to keep us all alive to the end.
Just wondering what would have happened had it occured earlier when we were at much lower levels?
As it was, for the first time ever I turned down the level to "core rules" to finish it and carry on because I kept on losing at least one NPC and I'm not keen on resurrecting.
Mind you, the rewards were worth it, not least, another pair of BOS.
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Comments
I don't like Edvin, so he is never in my parties (just a personal taste), but probably he will be in one of my next runs, with the mod installed, I like "impossible" battles.
Yes, still interested so thanks for posting. Not getting any replies is disheartening as you tend to think it's your playing thats wrong.
Since the OP though I've done it a few times, played around with it ect. so now feeling a lot more confident. But if playing the "mod", I do play with the fight in mind so make sure to level up asap.
For me a few must do's.
Keep your party in the corner away from the lich initially, (just send Edwin to trigger the conversation and then get him out of there) send skellies with their magic resistance to surround the lich the initial ADHW is a killer.
Use summons constantly to seperate the guards so you can take them on one at a time, they hit super hard and will chop you to pieces very quickly. So not only do they kill, get it wrong and NPC are completely chunked.
Try and avoid the two mages (furtherest away from the door) as long as possible.
But most important, run around/away like headless chickens whenever you get too cornered (if you can).
Also having the best items, SOTM is vital for me to deal with the protected magii, and lots and lots of potions, "big" health, speed, invisibility.
I've only completed it with party of four though, not sure whether that makes it easier or harder because there is so much to do to keep them all alive. I think with six, though obviously stronger, I would lose a few as missed that one was surrounded and being "chunked".
@gorgonzola
It's the "romance" mod so you are going to have to grit your teeth if you don't like Edwin (I make no comment, no comment at all about your lack of good taste).
But if it's a complicated rewarding battle you are after, then really recommend trying this one.
It's also in quite a restricted area so unlike the WK seal, you don't have the option of hiding/regrouping though enough room to prebuff and prepare in the corner before it starts.
About tastes I appreciate that you don't comment about. Let me only say that my experience with him is with a localized version of the original and the voice has a big part in appreciate or dislike an NPC. Think about how the voice of English speaking Irenicus adds flavor to the character, the Italian voice actor of Edwin maybe did not as good, but his voice hurts my nerves bad. And I don't like to be called monkey by anyone, not even in a CRPG.
Also, and this is far more important, for me is almost impossible to RP evil, the closest I can get is to RP a "Jaheira like" neutral, that is really close to good. I feel really uncomfortable playing an evil one, just as I would feel uncomfortable in RP a pedophile, the first has no problem in killing so quitting other people life, the latter ruins the life of children, they are both so far from what I appreciate in human beings in RL that even in a game I can not RP to act like that. *
About the hints thanks, I will make a good use of them. Even if in the WK seal usually I don't prebuff or run away, with my typical parties and strategies I don't need it.
* in RL one of my friends was assassinated and more than one had been victim of pedophiles, one of them was abused by her own father almost each day for a long time, I have my reasons to tell what I am telling, even if it can sound strange. The one assassinated had 3 sons, the younger still teen, imagine the damage in their life. The one abused while teen did manage to have a life, 2 children and now is an happy grandma. I don't tell that it was easy, or that she still don't carry moral scars that she will never heal in her life, also for her there was a lot of damage, but at least she had a chance to at least partially recover the damage.
Appreciate the reply, it's entirely possible the English speaking Edwin voice actor (who is American BTW) gets the nuance correct and that simply doesn't translate.
I never play "evil" either but find Edwin and Virconia my favourite/go to NPC, far less prejudiced than some others and more reliable.
And "monkey" is often seen as a term of endearment when you get to know people, maybe that doesn't translate either?
It's a great shame the fight is part of a "romance" mod otherwise it would get a lot more praise I think. Unlike other big fights, it's not possible to learn the "trick" of how to win (thinking KanGaax, Guarded compound, Twisted Rune) because you are shut in a room, no escape, with a lich, 3 mage and very, very tough, buffed, magic resistant fighters who chase you.
And the loot is fantastic.
As now I play both the original, for better compatibility with Tactics mod and some old mods that I like, and EE, that is voiced in English, after knowing that monkey can also have that different color may be I will finally succeed in having a run with the red mage. You helped me in seeing him under a different light, thanks!
However, the way in which Edwin uses "monkey" (or "simian") is exactly as @gorgonzola understands the Italian translation: he is calling you sub-human, it is a deliberate insult ... but that's how Edwin is, habitually insulting.
It happens after the Nether Scroll, after Edwin is turned back into a man. It's based on a fanfic so there's quite a lot of backstory involved.
You meet Dekaras in the bridge district, the battle is set in "the house of the horn" just up from the Five Flagons.
So I suppose it might be possible to spawn him and get the assignment?
And I agree, I think if you could stall that battle, this mod would get a lot more praise. I certainly would have put it off to a higher level. But it forces you to do it in a short window, no way around it that I could see. Otherwise, this is one of my favorite romance mods. (And the loot is awesome!)
@gorgonzola Yeah, language barriers are hard to cope with. Sometimes things just don't quite translate right. But I felt that the mod really softened the insults. You get the option to call Edwin out when he's being obnoxious. Personally, I like to insult him back. It becomes a sort of game. Who can come up with the cleverest insult? And eventually the insults stop altogether - at least towards the PC.
Also, for all that Edwin is an evil character, he doesn't go around doing evil things, so he's not a hinderance to a good aligned party. He just complains alot, tho you can use BG2 Tweaks to turn that off if it annoys you. Also, as i recall, the mod eventually gives you the option to change Edwin's alignment to neutral. I tend to play CG, and it's funny to me that 2 of my 3 favorite romance mods are with evil NPCs - Edwin & Tsujatha. (Kelsey is the 3rd.)