Party's (particularly protagonist) canon stats

Sage

While watching the last Siege of Dragonspear stream, it struck me how much effort is being made to make the games' cannon work with regards to party composition. Since BG1EE and BG2EE will be patched for consistency with the SoD content, this might be an opportunity for another fix?

I'm curious of whether this is being addressed: Abdel Adrian's (canon protagonist) pregen stats.

I've compiled them from various sources:

Abdel Adrian		TotSC		D266		MiBG		EE1		EE2
Strength		18/90		19		16		17		18/94
Dexterity		19		16		14		14		11
Constitution		19		18		15		16		18
Intelligence		7		10		10		10		10
Wisdom			6		9		11		12		9
Charisma		18		7		12		14		11
HP			?		82		22		12		98
Alignment		CG		CN		TN		CG		NG
level			?		7		3		1		7

D266 is Dragon magazine issue 266.
MiBG is the Murder in Baldur's Gate tabletop adventure, which is an exception in that it takes places many years later and uses 4th or 5th edition rules. The rest is all 2nd edition.

Abdel is always a human (kitless) fighter, although on the Beamdog stream he's a Fighter (Berserker). I think it'd be pretty damn cool if the pre-gen EE Abdel Adrian would be made consistent. Although some ability bonuses are available in BG1, it's impossible to make the changes that you see between the EE presets atm.

The same goes for many other party members who miraculously gain or lose stats. As far as I'm concerned the BG2 stats should just be used for the BG1 npc's though ideally their stats would be imported entirely, allowing you to give them tome bonuses and such and carrying over your weapon proficiency choices?

EDIT: Unfortunately, tables don't look nearly so neat after posting, as they do in the editor :').

Grum

Abdel Adrian is an abomination. He is not canon. He is merely the fevered dream of a sad, perverted hack of a "writer." Never speak of him being canon again.

elminster

If you use < pre > and < /pre> around the text it might help (just take out the spaces I put in)

lroumen

TotSC seems the earliest version. Then again dragon magazine is generally the canon.
Why not just take the mean or median?

Sage

Grum said:

Abdel Adrian is an abomination. He is not canon. He is merely the fevered dream of a sad, perverted hack of a "writer." Never speak of him being canon again.

Hehe, I get where you're coming from. A male human fighter is the most boring Bhaalspawn I could think of and I don't even accept the events of the books as canon myself, if only because Minsc's description doesn't match every other canon description. There's Dragon magazine and Murder in Baldur's Gate to consider tho! Abdel is canon, like it or not .

Sage

elminster said:

If you use < pre > and < /pre> around the text it might help (just take out the spaces I put in)

Thanks! I still had to shift some stuff around in edit/preview, this is much better.

Mikey205

I want imported stats and bg2 starting values but that might be a bit much.

Mikey205

Maybe not actually with all the set stat to x items they give in bg2 anyway.

Arcanis

I don't think you should consider the MiBG stats. The reason for his weakness there is that he *ancient* and most probably completly out of shape. Even his alignment could have changed, so I think that this one should be out

Then, I always assumed the Dragon magazin was not talking about the video game character but this hallucinating guy of the novels with the BG name (but who have nothing to do with them, just a name
confusion u_u).

That leaves the the TotSC and the EE ones..
Well, there is no Neera in TotSC and the Baldurs Gate comic confirmes that her existence is canon, so that
one is out too.

That leaves the EE ones...
Well Irenicus experiments injured him. His scalpels injured his arms/legs (resulting in the loss of 3 dex),
his magic made him loose parts of his expirience/cleverness (or 3 wisdom points) while the scars and
the expirience made him kinda unaproachable (which means he lost 3 cha points)
I assume the raise in strength results from the magical excercise book, the awakened Baahlpowers and
maybe even some effects of Irenicus experiments. (I assume he learns to appreciate the law more
during the course of late BG1EE & SoD)


That means the EE ones are *both* the actual canon ^_^

Sage

Arcanis said:

I don't think you should consider the MiBG stats. The reason for his weakness there is that he *ancient* and most probably completly out of shape. Even his alignment could have changed, so I think that this one should be out

Then, I always assumed the Dragon magazin was not talking about the video game character but this hallucinating guy of the novels with the BG name (but who have nothing to do with them, just a name
confusion u_u).

That leaves the the TotSC and the EE ones..
Well, there is no Neera in TotSC and the Baldurs Gate comic confirmes that her existence is canon, so that
one is out too.

That leaves the EE ones...
Well Irenicus experiments injured him. His scalpels injured his arms/legs (resulting in the loss of 3 dex),
his magic made him loose parts of his expirience/cleverness (or 3 wisdom points) while the scars and
the expirience made him kinda unaproachable (which means he lost 3 cha points)
I assume the raise in strength results from the magical excercise book, the awakened Baahlpowers and
maybe even some effects of Irenicus experiments. (I assume he learns to appreciate the law more
during the course of late BG1EE & SoD)


That means the EE ones are *both* the actual canon ^_^

I completely agree with you on that we discount older stuff like TotSC as canon.

I don't agree on the construed explanations for stat differences, since none of these things actually happen when you play BG1 EE and import into BG2 EE. I'd really like to see the BG2 EE Abdel to be made consistent with BG1 EE by giving them the same stats, possibly corrected for stat increases in BG 1 EE (tomes).

Dee

I can't comment on specific decisions, but I suspect the reason there's a difference is that the pregens for BGII:EE were designed independent from the pregens for BG:EE, and then their names and portraits were appended later.

If it's something you'd like to see changed, though, definitely post a Feature Request.

Arcanis

Sage said:

I completely agree with you on that we discount older stuff like TotSC as canon.

I don't agree on the construed explanations for stat differences, since none of these things actually happen when you play BG1 EE and import into BG2 EE. I'd really like to see the BG2 EE Abdel to be made consistent with BG1 EE by giving them the same stats, possibly corrected for stat increases in BG 1 EE (tomes).

Well, I admit that I just tried to justifiy the different stats (though I believe my idea isn't bad =P),
but I always thought that it is weird that Irenicus experiments have no after effect et all on CHARNAME.

Sage

Arcanis said:

Well, I admit that I just tried to justifiy the different stats (though I believe my idea isn't bad =P),
but I always thought that it is weird that Irenicus experiments have no after effect et all on CHARNAME.

Yes, that is a bit odd. It was a great way to explain any character behavior changes between canon BG1 and your BG2 playthrough though. I anyways found that pretty elegant. How else to justify protagonist instantly abandoning Imoen, Jaheira and Minsc?

In any case, thanks for the responses. I'll see about that feature request.