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New character, run-through.

Hello ladies and gents,

With the new DLC inbound, I am starting an new full run in BG. I would like to make a female "samurai' ish type character. She would use either a katana and/or other orient type weapons.

Any suggestions on which class/kit to use to build this character?

Comments

  • PK2748PK2748 Member Posts: 381
    A Samurai would be an unkitted fighter. Lawful neutral. If you just want oriental then you're talking Kensai I'd guess

    PhilhelmCamus34JuliusBorisov
  • PhilhelmPhilhelm Member Posts: 473
    @PK2748 I agree.

    If you want armor, then you'll need to go with Fighter, or perhaps even Wizard Slayer for a more exotic warrior (although the Wizard Slayer is considered to be lower tier due to item restrictions). The Kensai is "Oriental" flavored, but cannot wear any armor. However, a human Kensai may dual to Thief, so could eventually (in BG2) get the Use Any Item ability, overcoming that restriction (and the Wizard Slayer's restrictions for that matter).

    You could even select a Paladin for a more mystical "Samurai," but you would be restricted to Lawful Good alignment. It's worth noting that the Inquisitor cannot cast any normal Paladin spells, but can dispel magic.

    Another possible option would be a human Swashbuckler, dualed to Fighter at level 10, for some bonus to hit and AC, as well as some handy thieving abilities such as disabling traps and picking locks. You could even put your points into Detect Illusion (will dispel enemy mages illusion spells at will) if you don't like the other skills for RP reasons.

    JuliusBorisovCamus34
  • Camus34Camus34 Member Posts: 203
    edited March 2016
    I have to agree with PK, an unkitted fighter. A Ronin would be some from of neutral alignment. Lawful neutral is a good choice. You might also want to put a point into Scimitars & Wakizashi's & Ninja-to's; traditionally, a samurai carried a wakizashi on his person at all times (put it in your quick weapons lol). In fact, Miyamoto Musashi's two heavens style, involved duel wielding a katana and a wakizashi. It's up to you, but from an RP perspective, Philhelm's idea of a swashbuckler samurai is rather funny. Because it is the opposite of what a samurai is, samurai come from a society that is basically haunted by honor. Moreover, a samurai was basically a Japanese version of a knight. They wore a form of plate & scale armor, they followed Bushido instead of a code of chivalry, the main difference in their ethics being, Bushido (which did not look favorably upon stealing) was a bit more austere than what European knights followed. Watch the 1962 film Harakiri, I think it depicts the austere life and strictness of the samurai quite well. I would think that a swashbuckler/thief would suit a ninja more than a samurai, as ninjas don't have a strict code of ethics concerned with maintaining one's honor. The paladin idea is an interesting thought.

    JuliusBorisovBelgarathMTH
  • scorpiovascorpiova Member Posts: 87
    Very interesting discussion guys, and great suggestions.

    Would a Monk work out at all? I noticed that monks can use Katana's and focus on single-weapon proficiency. In DnD, I am not overly familiar with Monks, so not sure if it is a viable choice (class-wise), but Role-Playing wise would be reflective of the character I have in mind. (Concept wise she started as a Martial-Artist, not a "Monk" per say, then eventually learned to use the samurai sword). But sense, she was never a true "Monk" perhaps one of the other suggestions would be better.

    So would Monk work at all, or are they too strange a class to play in BG?

  • Camus34Camus34 Member Posts: 203
    scorpiova wrote: »
    Very interesting discussion guys, and great suggestions.

    Would a Monk work out at all? I noticed that monks can use Katana's and focus on single-weapon proficiency. In DnD, I am not overly familiar with Monks, so not sure if it is a viable choice (class-wise), but Role-Playing wise would be reflective of the character I have in mind. (Concept wise she started as a Martial-Artist, not a "Monk" per say, then eventually learned to use the samurai sword). But sense, she was never a true "Monk" perhaps one of the other suggestions would be better.

    So would Monk work at all, or are they too strange a class to play in BG?

    You would lose out on heavy armor, and I thought that monks don't use weapons? I've never played as a monk (they lose out in hitpoints and THAC0). Monks are more Kung-fu martial arts, than samurai knight.

  • lunarlunar Member Posts: 3,409
    At low levels, a monk will do okay with a katana and single weapon proficiency. +1 ac, better damage, and a better critical hit chance.

    At higher lvls, a monk's unarmed attack becomes better as he gains extra attacks, but is forever locked to a 1 attack/round with a weapon. You won't use weapons unless you need a higher enchantment level weapon.

    Kensai is excellent choice for an oriental fighter master of swords, however early bg1 can be a bit rough because no armor.

    JuliusBorisov
  • thelovebatthelovebat Member Posts: 218
    lunar wrote: »
    At low levels, a monk will do okay with a katana and single weapon proficiency. +1 ac, better damage, and a better critical hit chance.

    At higher lvls, a monk's unarmed attack becomes better as he gains extra attacks, but is forever locked to a 1 attack/round with a weapon. You won't use weapons unless you need a higher enchantment level weapon.

    Kensai is excellent choice for an oriental fighter master of swords, however early bg1 can be a bit rough because no armor.

    Yeah pretty much. For both a Kensai and a Monk, BG1 will be rough going for each one because they don't get to wear armor, but will be noticeably better by their later BG1 levels.

    Unfortunately, the Monk suffers from the fact that the experience cap stops them one level short from their fists being considered magical weapons, meaning most of the game they can't contribute all that much to combat especially against certain enemies. They don't get some of the same benefits of stat allocation that a Fighter would get, and don't really get equipment to help them out. The draw of being a Monk in the first game aside from getting to experience the game itself with a full runthrough, is getting the tomes and raising your character's stats that way which will carry into the 2nd game. Most of their useful abilities you don't get until the 2nd game like their magic resistance and fists being magical weapons, though being a Sun Soul Monk kit does give you a few abilities to deal some damage with during the 1st game at least.

    The Kensai won't be able to wear armor which hurts early on, but with a good enough Dexterity your AC can be decent, and there are some non armor equipments you can get to help aid your AC. Your offensive abilities overall will be much better than the Monk and dual wielding is a huge asset with their offensive bonuses, and you'll get more hit points to tank damage. In BG2 the Monk becomes really good when they finally get their useful abilites, but the Kensai is more of a slow and steady class in terms of improvement. It's one of the ideal kits for dual classing though, and if you think a Samurai type character would wield some Thief/stealth abilities similar to a ninja then a Kensai dual classed to Thief could be a legitimate option. I don't remember if you can backstab while dual wielding, but if you pick weapons that a Thief could use for backstabbing during your Kensai levels then you could have a Samurai/Ninja type character moving in and out of different situations to deal all sorts of damage.

    AerakarJuliusBorisov
  • Camus34Camus34 Member Posts: 203
    It really boils down to if head canon (based off of the historical samurai) dictates your build. A monk is a religious warrior who specializes in hand to hand, and in BG:EE they can hold a katana. The monks main focus will be his or her hands, and they do not wear armor. A samurai's main focus will be the katana itself, and possibly the Wakizashi, they also wear armor (full plate would be your best choice) you will also put points into either dual wield or single weapon. If you want to think about it like a realist, a samurai in BG is basically a knight (pure fighter) without a shield, however he specializes in what is the best sword in the game.

  • PK2748PK2748 Member Posts: 381
    A samurai is a heavily armored mounted infantry unit. Unarmored kensai and monks are not really suitable, at all. If you just want to play a vaguely eastern swordsman, go nuts with either but long term monks don't get competitive attacks per round with a sword

  • scorpiovascorpiova Member Posts: 87
    Awesome, thanks guys!

    I have decided to go with a Kensai, it seems to fit best with the character I have in mind. Concept wise she would not wear armor. The idea of her being a "vaguely eastern swordsman" would be pretty accurate, so a fighter type would be best.

    Now to choose a portrait! :)

    BelgarathMTHAerakarCamus34thelovebat
  • thelovebatthelovebat Member Posts: 218
    edited March 2016
    scorpiova wrote: »
    Awesome, thanks guys!

    I have decided to go with a Kensai, it seems to fit best with the character I have in mind. Concept wise she would not wear armor. The idea of her being a "vaguely eastern swordsman" would be pretty accurate, so a fighter type would be best.

    Now to choose a portrait! :)

    I have a portrait I made for myself which seems to fit with an unarmored samurai type you're envisioning. Hope it's alright for me to post it here, thought you might like it.

    hrapvinwidqm.bmp

    Source:

    http://dsillustration.deviantart.com/art/Moon-Shadow-175567475

    BelgarathMTH
  • PhilhelmPhilhelm Member Posts: 473
    edited March 2016
    Camus34 said:

    It's up to you, but from an RP perspective, Philhelm's idea of a swashbuckler samurai is rather funny. Because it is the opposite of what a samurai is, samurai come from a society that is basically haunted by honor. Moreover, a samurai was basically a Japanese version of a knight. They wore a form of plate & scale armor, they followed Bushido instead of a code of chivalry, the main difference in their ethics being, Bushido (which did not look favorably upon stealing) was a bit more austere than what European knights followed. Watch the 1962 film Harakiri, I think it depicts the austere life and strictness of the samurai quite well. I would think that a swashbuckler/thief would suit a ninja more than a samurai, as ninjas don't have a strict code of ethics concerned with maintaining one's honor. The paladin idea is an interesting thought.

    I suggested Swashbuckler/Fighter as a possible option since it gives a bonus to hit, damage, and AC, similar (although weaker) to the Kensai's bonuses but without the severe armor restriction. He could simply put all of his points into Detect Illusion and ignore the other thieving abilities in order to satisfy RP. Once he duals to Fighter he will be able to wear heavy armor and achieve grandmastery, etc. The build is essentially a Fighter with a bonus to damage and AC, and with the option for some additional skills.

    Also, keep in mind that a Thief, regardless of its name, isn't necessarily a thief; 3rd edition did right by renaming the class and allowing LG alignment. In fact, Van Richten (Van Helsing knock-off for those who might not be familiar with the character) from the Ravenloft setting used to be classed as a LG Thief with high INT and WIS, and otherwise mediocre stats, despite being a doctor by profession. Even in 2nd edition, the Thief can have a LN or LE alignment, so there is nothing inherent about the class that precludes a strict personal code. How about a LN Bounty Hunter that serves lawful authorities rather than the criminal underground?

    But overall, I think that a pure, unkitted Fighter with grandmastery in katanas and longbows, and pips in single-weapon style, would be the most appropriate. The Paladin would be my second choice for a fantasy, mystical version, or perhaps even a Blackguard for an evil fantasy samurai. I personally wouldn't choose the Kensai because of the lack of armor, since as you say, they are essentially Eastern knights.

    Camus34
  • JarrakulJarrakul Member Posts: 2,029
    Really, "samurai" is (very) roughly analogous to "knight", and as with knights, there are a number of possible classes that fit them. Unkitted fighter and any paladin are the most obvious, depending on how idealistic/spiritual they are. Kensai makes sense for an Edo-period samurai, focused more on duals and honor than on actual warfare. Archer or unkitted ranger fits more of a warring-states-period samurai, with their focus on bows and their less-than-stringest adherence to rules of honor and fair play. Berserker could also fit a more cynical view of warring-states-period samurai, although the restriction on bow proficiency makes that not fit quite as well.

  • scorpiovascorpiova Member Posts: 87



    scorpiova wrote: »

    Awesome, thanks guys!



    I have decided to go with a Kensai, it seems to fit best with the character I have in mind. Concept wise she would not wear armor. The idea of her being a "vaguely eastern swordsman" would be pretty accurate, so a fighter type would be best.



    Now to choose a portrait! :)


    I have a portrait I made for myself which seems to fit with an unarmored samurai type you're envisioning. Hope it's alright for me to post it here, thought you might like it.



    hrapvinwidqm.bmp



    Source:



    http://dsillustration.deviantart.com/art/Moon-Shadow-175567475

    It's a nice portrait, looks very cool. I have selected the one I will use. A blonde female which is reflective of the character I have in mind. It's by Isandir. He/she also have a bunch of nice portraits, so I have set up an entire set for the entire npc cast. Here is a link to their work...

    http://isandir.com/

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