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Beamdog Future Projects - Toolset Suggestions

nlyhnlyh Member Posts: 18
edited April 2016 in General Discussion (Spoiler Warning!)
We have no idea what they might be planning for the future, but one aspect I would really like them to include would be a full Toolset and necessary infrastructure to be able to create servers/persistent worlds.

I have ran/built persistent worlds for NWN2, and would love to see a new medium like it for any future games. Hopefully Forgotten Realms, which would be my own preference.

A toolset of course would not be well suited to a game based on pre-drawn backgrounds like the infinity engine.
Post edited by nlyh on

Comments

  • EdithKEdithK Member Posts: 1
    I would love a full-featured toolset for a game in the Forgotten Realms settings. The fact that so many people are still active on nwn2 custom servers (a game from 2006) is a strong indication that many more would like it.
  • nlyhnlyh Member Posts: 18
    Neverwinter Nights 1 still has a very active community too, and that is older still. It just goes to show what a big impact something like this would have on lengthening the shelf life and expanding a game.
  • nlyhnlyh Member Posts: 18
    It would be nice if any staff were to comment on this with their thoughts.
  • Red_ValorRed_Valor Member Posts: 3
    Persistent Worlds was one of the most groundbreaking experiences in NWN2, the game itself was not really that well made, but I've spent thousands of hours role playing in persistent worlds. It would be really great to see a new game, provide that same unique online playing experience, but with a better engine.
  • illathidillathid Member Posts: 320
    Honestly, I see the toolsets and persistent worlds stuff as a waste. It takes up a lot of development time and funds, and I'd rather see that used for more content or better polish. :neutral:
  • nlyhnlyh Member Posts: 18
    The benefits gained from a toolset justify the toolset development time and costs. If you search for both games in terms of singe player modules, servers of various kinds etc it's absolutely huge. Expanding and extending the life of a game this way is financially sound for a company.
  • illathidillathid Member Posts: 320
    nlyh said:

    The benefits gained from a toolset justify the toolset development time and costs. If you search for both games in terms of singe player modules, servers of various kinds etc it's absolutely huge. Expanding and extending the life of a game this way is financially sound for a company.

    Not according to some of the interviews I've read from Obsidian.
  • nlyhnlyh Member Posts: 18
    Which ones? Obsidian released a partially completed game with NWN2 in the first instance. So generally all around they seemed to have problems with development. To me, it seemed more like they were pushed to rush it out, and not given the time they wanted. If a developer can manage it's own time within reason, then a toolset makes sense.

    There must be hundreds, if not thousands of people having got these games just for the modding and server potential. I've heard loads of comments from people saying they have not even played the OC.
  • znancekivellznancekivell Member Posts: 58
    I used to run around in those Persistent Worlds years ago; very fond memories. It may be tougher with something using the IE, but it's a very nice idea. +1
  • illathidillathid Member Posts: 320
    nlyh said:

    Which ones? Obsidian released a partially completed game with NWN2 in the first instance. So generally all around they seemed to have problems with development. To me, it seemed more like they were pushed to rush it out, and not given the time they wanted. If a developer can manage it's own time within reason, then a toolset makes sense.

    There must be hundreds, if not thousands of people having got these games just for the modding and server potential. I've heard loads of comments from people saying they have not even played the OC.

    I'll see if I can dig them up. But you identified the issue I remember most clearly. By putting the time in resources they did into the toolset they had to leave the main campaign only partially completed.

    And I'm not saying there's not many people who would pay for toolset support, I just doubt it's as many who would want those same resources used for more content. Plus toolsets don't mean you'll have better mods. The best mods I've played have been for games where there's no toolsets to create content (The infinity engine games, Paradox games, etc.).
  • nlyhnlyh Member Posts: 18
    edited April 2016
    I don't think Beamdog will be using IE moving forward. They will want something newer. If they do use a modern isometric engine like Pillars of Eternity did, then it will make a toolset much less likely. I do really like isometric approach for single player games, but I also like 3D for the extra possibilities for modding and custom content.

    Personally I would like them to have a 3D engine, with a similar approach to NWN2, but much more refined.
  • nlyhnlyh Member Posts: 18
    edited April 2016
    illathid said:

    nlyh said:

    Which ones? Obsidian released a partially completed game with NWN2 in the first instance. So generally all around they seemed to have problems with development. To me, it seemed more like they were pushed to rush it out, and not given the time they wanted. If a developer can manage it's own time within reason, then a toolset makes sense.

    There must be hundreds, if not thousands of people having got these games just for the modding and server potential. I've heard loads of comments from people saying they have not even played the OC.

    I'll see if I can dig them up. But you identified the issue I remember most clearly. By putting the time in resources they did into the toolset they had to leave the main campaign only partially completed.

    And I'm not saying there's not many people who would pay for toolset support, I just doubt it's as many who would want those same resources used for more content. Plus toolsets don't mean you'll have better mods. The best mods I've played have been for games where there's no toolsets to create content (The infinity engine games, Paradox games, etc.).
    That is not the direct fault of adding a toolset though. Even if they said they would not be doing a toolset, the noose would have been tightened even more. The game would have still been incomplete. Essentially the same thing happened with KOTOR 2 and that had no toolset.

    Neverwinter Nights 1 also had no issues to speak of with wasting development time on a Toolset. (From what I recall)

    Thousands of people have played that game alone over the years purely on online servers. That game's reputation would not be as grand as it is today if it had no toolset capability that led to all the additional content. (It's OC was certainly not "great", especially coming off the back of BG:SoA)
  • illathidillathid Member Posts: 320
    nlyh said:

    illathid said:

    nlyh said:

    Which ones? Obsidian released a partially completed game with NWN2 in the first instance. So generally all around they seemed to have problems with development. To me, it seemed more like they were pushed to rush it out, and not given the time they wanted. If a developer can manage it's own time within reason, then a toolset makes sense.

    There must be hundreds, if not thousands of people having got these games just for the modding and server potential. I've heard loads of comments from people saying they have not even played the OC.

    I'll see if I can dig them up. But you identified the issue I remember most clearly. By putting the time in resources they did into the toolset they had to leave the main campaign only partially completed.

    And I'm not saying there's not many people who would pay for toolset support, I just doubt it's as many who would want those same resources used for more content. Plus toolsets don't mean you'll have better mods. The best mods I've played have been for games where there's no toolsets to create content (The infinity engine games, Paradox games, etc.).
    That is not the direct fault of adding a toolset though. Even if they said they would not be doing a toolset, the noose would have been tightened even more. The game would have still been incomplete. Essentially the same thing happened with KOTOR 2 and that had no toolset.

    Neverwinter Nights 1 also had no issues to speak of with wasting development time on a Toolset. (From what I recall)

    Thousands of people have played that game alone over the years purely on online servers. That game's reputation would not be as grand as it is today if it had no toolset capability that led to all the additional content. (It's OC was certainly not "great", especially coming off the back of BG:SoA)
    Video Game Development is a zero sum game, by devoting time energy and resources to one area or feature you will have less to devote to others. That's a fact. And yeah, it is direct fault of the toolset. Had the Toolset been left on the cutting room floor there would've been more resources for other areas in the game. That's also true of other features as well, like the stronghold (had they cut crossroads keep, there would've been more resources for the toolset and other features).

    And I'm not saying the toolsets are bad for everyone. I'm sure you, and many others, have enjoyed them immensely. What I'm saying is that they make games worse for me. And so when on a public forum people ask for them to be included I'm going to make my own voice be heard as well. I offer no disrespect, it's purely a preference thing.
  • deserkdeserk Member Posts: 35
    I think many seem to judge NWN1 badly entirely over the merits of it's single-player campaign, when that's not what made it the game truly great (although I personally liked it, especially the HotU campaign). It offered an innovative and almost MMO-like multiplayer where the players could create content with the toolset and host their own servers, and as a DM lead other players in an independent online adventure rather than having the developers control everything and create mechanics that sort of try to replicate that experience without a DM (the rate of success of which is somewhere between extremely difficult and impossible imo). The developers made great tools for the community to make great content. And that equaled in you as a player having an endless supply of different experiences in each Persistent World you played in. And of course with the toolset of NWN1 there were many great and well written single-player modules that were made as well.

    Personally as long diehard fan of the NWN franchise I think it would be unspeakably awesome if Beamdog does an Enhanced Edition of either NWN1 or 2, to upgrade and expand those games with new content. Just imagine how much it could revitalize the old community and bring in lots of new people too, just like the Enhanced Editions of the Infinity engine games have done thus far.
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