[Exploit/Bug] "Talking" Enemies to death

Winthal

More of an exploit than a bug really. I'm not 100% sure that this works in BG1, but it definitely works in BG2. Take one of the dragon fights for instance, when the dragon is non-hostile to you, you can initiate the fight by talking to it, or by simply attacking it, and the fight plays out as it should - But, if you have your character stand out of range, just within line of sight and press the Dragon to go an speak to it, then pause and order everyone else to attack the Dragon, and every few seconds, keep pressing the dragon to talk to it with the character out of range (move him back after he walks forward towards the dragon, so he doesn't actually reach the dragon and initiate the conversation), the dragon will simply keep standing still, waiting for the character to come talk to it, while the party hacks away all of its HP eventually killing it. This way, a low level party can kill the dragons in BG2. The only drawback of this is you get lower XP from killing the dragon non-hostile than hostile.

Most people probably wouldn't abuse this, since its cheesy and boring, but i'd like to see it fixed nonetheless.

smeagolheart

I'd say just don't do it. It's possible to hack the game in many other ways like giving yourself huge XP boosts, using scrolls or items when you aren't supposed to be able to or it's possible to console in whatever items you want in whatever quantity and open up a savegame editor and modify all you stats and proficiencies.

The exploit you describe requires repeated effort that you have to do on purpose to complete, just like those and many other exploits that are possible. I think this one is avoidable with self control. I would rather the Devs work on other stuff and if they have a bug free game with everything else added that is great then maybe get to stuff like this.

lansounet

Reported in ToBEx fixes, labeled A64_47 in the pdf Ascension64 made for the developpers.

AndreaColombo

@lansounet beat me to it by four minutes ;-)

Winthal

I'd say just don't do it. It's possible to hack the game in many other ways like giving yourself huge XP boosts, using scrolls or items when you aren't supposed to be able to or it's possible to console in whatever items you want in whatever quantity and open up a savegame editor and modify all you stats and proficiencies.

The exploit you describe requires repeated effort that you have to do on purpose to complete, just like those and many other exploits that are possible. I think this one is avoidable with self control. I would rather the Devs work on other stuff and if they have a bug free game with everything else added that is great then maybe get to stuff like this.

I agree with you, there are more important stuff absolutely. Just thought I'd add this in case no one had caught it yet ^_^

nulspace

I may be wrong, but is this still doable since the latest ToB patch? I thought they had fixed this.

sarevok57

@nulspace, i think it is actually, because one time i did it by mistake with the shadow dragon and i always have ToB with the latest patch on

AndreaColombo

ToBEx definitely fixes this. I know 'cause I used to abuse it and ToBEx took this subtle pleasure away from me LOL Kidding, it definitely had to be fixed :-)

Ward

Why take it out? This is one of those things that makes the game easier that pros argue should be removed, but it is a personal choice to do that. I found the trick very useful in my first run through. If it isn't a bug and you can choose not to abuse it, why remove it?

Winthal

Why take it out? This is one of those things that makes the game easier that pros argue should be removed, but it is a personal choice to do that. I found the trick very useful in my first run through. If it isn't a bug and you can choose not to abuse it, why remove it?

While not technically a bug, it's certainly a design flaw that was overlooked, and definitely not how the developers intended those fights to play out. But yeah, at the end of the day, its no biggie.

Razor

wow... if this is possible I agree it should be fixed. never used or knew about this tactic

Ward

Basicly the only way this can give you an unfair disadvantage is if you talk, pause, then attack. But when do you ever need to do things in that order? Unless you're purposely using it for your benefit, it doesn't hurt your game.

Well, if they fix it I won't really care, but it doesn't hurt anyone so why remove? It just gives you a bit of extra power on lazy days.

nulspace

Why take it out? This is one of those things that makes the game easier that pros argue should be removed, but it is a personal choice to do that. I found the trick very useful in my first run through. If it isn't a bug and you can choose not to abuse it, why remove it?

There's a difference between making a game easier by introducing OP weapons/OP new races/OP class kits, and removing an exploit that took advantage of an oversight in the game engine that allowed users to kill anything without a fight.

There are better and more fulfilling ways of conquering tough fights (lowering the difficulty settings, leaving and coming back at later levels, trying different strategies) that new players should learn how to do

AndreaColombo

There are better and more fulfilling ways of conquering tough fights (lowering the difficulty settings, leaving and coming back at later levels, trying different strategies) that new players should learn how to do

That, or if you really feel the urge to cheat you can always CTRL+Y any enemy within sight for an instant kill.

Drakhgard

I wonder if this will be fixed (hopefully it will!)

Short explanation: You pause the game, click on friendly NPC. He turns into your direction, stands still for like ~5 seconds and waits for you to actually talk to him. Now if you unpause and attack him while he is waiting, he won't do anything. Repeat this over and over (just pause again, talk to him, then attack him again) and you will be able to kill any friendly NPC ridiculously easy.

AndreaColombo

Already requested as part of ToBEx fixes (not sure it's been already implemented).

Bhryaen

Good exploit to undo, however...

ichaos1985

I remember I used this "strategy" to kill the red dragon (Lord Firkraag) and the shadow dragon, because my group was not strong enough. That was more than 10 years ago, so I would now want that to be fixed.

Bhryaen

Merged two identical threads...

kszatan

Problem: It is possible to kill Firkraag,Thaxll'ssillyia, Adalon and other monsters by simply clicking on a monster to talk to it and then attacking it with the other NPC. The monster stays neutral forever, waiting for the first player to come closer (which never happens) and start the conversation. Eventually it gets killed by the attacking NPC.
Resolution: The monster should instantly turn hostile when attacked.

I know it's depriving yourself of a pleasure from really fighting a dragon but it's just annoying it's possible. This is the biggest bug for me in BG2. I checked the list of fixed and submitted bugs and I haven't seen this one.

Ascension64

Listed as bug A64_47 in TobEx bugs thread.

kszatan

Also referenced here: http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/562/exploitbug-talking-enemies-to-death
Sorry for duplicating.

Bhryaen

@kszatan
Sorry- had to merge the duplicate post...

I'm surprised no one has mentioned yet the similar bug of being able to kill enemies by avoiding talking to them. For ex., if you let Tarnesh see you, you can run away from him, pelting him with arrows, for as long as you need to kill him. This doesn't work with every enemy NPC, but many, many of them. Also works with friendlies- like Gatewarden. That's being addressed already, however...

Roller12

Bhryaen said:

I'm surprised no one has mentioned yet the similar bug of being able to kill enemies by avoiding talking to them. For ex., if you let Tarnesh see you, you can run away from him, pelting him with arrows, for as long as you need to kill him. This doesn't work with every enemy NPC, but many, many of them. Also works with friendlies- like Gatewarden. That's being addressed already, however...

Its a well known way of killing Tazok and helping yourself for an extra pair of gauntlets of weapon expertise. The reason noone? told it is probably because the list of fixed bugs isnt very clear, so known bugs, like OP's one probably gets reported multiple times on a daily basis, while lesser known never.

Balquo

@Tanthalas I feel this has been fixed but can't test right now. Do you know?

Tanthalas

@Balquo

I think this one is actually a work in progress. Its been fixed for some encounters only.

bbear

May as well fix other bugs too that concern dragons such as setting spike traps directly in front of them (fix only for tob dragons) or repeatedly cast blindness on them since blindness does not trigger hostility.

DivineBlood

Lol this used to be my most abused design flaw.