What's use any item compared to timestop / improved alacrity?
Improved Alacrity is not over-powered by itself, because it doesn't lasts very long and doesn't benefit spells with a long casting time (which includes the most powerful ones). Only the combination with the Robe of Vecna is OP, because well, everything in combination with Robe of Vecna is OP. TL;DR: The robe is the problem, not the spell...
Timestop is powerful, but once you get to the high-level content with SCS installed, it's not such an easy "win" button anymore, either. E.g. many SCS enemies like to buff themselves with Improved Invisibility, among other things. So when you start the battle with a Timestop, you can't dispell the enemy's Invisibility and then target them with an anti-magic or offensive spell during the same timestop, because he's still considered invisible until the timestop ends.
I think a salient consideration re: UAI isn't just how it makes the thief stack up vs. wizards, but also how it itself compares to other thief HLA's. Also, how it stacks up vs. Fighter/Cleric/Druid HLA's. Personally, I'd pick it over any one of the cleric or druid choices, and most of the fighter ones.
we all know the most powerful class by end of game are the mages
They're probably the most effective class for soloing, because they're so versatile. And also the most effective class for beating many bossfights.
But when it comes to cutting through endless trashmobs and mini-bosses quickly and without rest-spamming with a party, the warrior classes are much more effective.
So it really comes down to how you define "power".
On my last BG2 playthrough, I had a trio consisting of:
Fighter/Thief – PC
Fighter/Druid – Jaheira
Cleric/Wildmage – Neera, multi-classed using SK
And by the end of the game, the Fighter/Thief had the highest kill count by far.
When comparing power/effectiveness, you can't just look at a single boss fight where everyone is allowed to spend all their per-rest abilities. You have to average it out over the whole adventuring day. And while the level 9 mage spells are powerful, they are also in very limited supply.
Again, that's assuming you don't engage in rest-spamming. I personally try to rest as little as possible; ideally only once per in-game 24-hour period.
I do not hate HLAs, I just find them not varied enough. Why do paladins, rangers, fighters, barbarian and monk get the exact same HLAs? (Paladin gets deva, but that's it. Oh and rangers get tracking. Not sure that was worth mentioning) Paladin should get some holy might (3.5) like ability. Barbarian should get an epic rage, and monk should have special kicks. I love the way Beamdog gave special abilities to Shadowdancer, but this should definitely be expanded to all classes
@subtledoctor Yes, and I wanted to clarify to anyone reading that there is no mechanical disadvantage to "rest-spamming", because was he also talking about effectiveness in objective terms.
Yes, never liked HLA in bg2 as it made learning all those spells rather redundant at times. It would have been better for a more normal progression of skills based on class/kits rather than things that you would be allowed to pick as it gave a customization of character skill that bg2 should not really have.
Allowing these HLA really made it more of hack and slash or high powered spell game where really all the grind and pain of learning spells and leveling up a little less important.
I never really like the degree that HLA allowed classes to customize the way classes would fit - as you would only use these HLA instead of the hard earned skills that made going through the trilogy that much more satisfying.
I remember the thrill of getting that first level 5 or 6 level spell as a mage or cleric; or the ability to attack 3 times around or a thief with 100+% in skills and never really failing unless you got that dreaded horrible throw. With HLA we lose a lot of those thrilling moments of class advancement.
So yes - I would have liked a mod that would end this or at least a revision of these so you could not pick them as you do now and make it more class specific rather than generic for all warrior classes for example.
I've played BG and BG2 a ton of times but really only played ToB once because of HLA.
SR buffs fiends, so these spells are a lot better than in vanilla. And SCS has a component to buff fiends, and aTweaks has a component to buff fiends...
I recently did an install with SCS and aTweaks, and spell revisions until I got worried and started over, and one issue I never did resolve was what was the best way, given these two or three mods, to set up fiends (for challenge and sensible balance — you're right that some fiends should be wickedly powerful, more so than a planetar, but I hate cheese, on either side). I haven't played with this install yet and may redo it, and your advice on this question would be appreciated.
Comments
For a Wizard Slayer→Thief dualclass, it's downright crazy. The WS's kit disadvantage is negated, and he can wield Carsomyr... Improved Alacrity is not over-powered by itself, because it doesn't lasts very long and doesn't benefit spells with a long casting time (which includes the most powerful ones).
Only the combination with the Robe of Vecna is OP, because well, everything in combination with Robe of Vecna is OP.
TL;DR: The robe is the problem, not the spell...
Timestop is powerful, but once you get to the high-level content with SCS installed, it's not such an easy "win" button anymore, either.
E.g. many SCS enemies like to buff themselves with Improved Invisibility, among other things.
So when you start the battle with a Timestop, you can't dispell the enemy's Invisibility and then target them with an anti-magic or offensive spell during the same timestop, because he's still considered invisible until the timestop ends.
And also the most effective class for beating many bossfights.
But when it comes to cutting through endless trashmobs and mini-bosses quickly and without rest-spamming with a party, the warrior classes are much more effective.
So it really comes down to how you define "power".
On my last BG2 playthrough, I had a trio consisting of:
- Fighter/Thief – PC
- Fighter/Druid – Jaheira
- Cleric/Wildmage – Neera, multi-classed using SK
And by the end of the game, the Fighter/Thief had the highest kill count by far.When comparing power/effectiveness, you can't just look at a single boss fight where everyone is allowed to spend all their per-rest abilities. You have to average it out over the whole adventuring day. And while the level 9 mage spells are powerful, they are also in very limited supply.
Again, that's assuming you don't engage in rest-spamming. I personally try to rest as little as possible; ideally only once per in-game 24-hour period.
Why do paladins, rangers, fighters, barbarian and monk get the exact same HLAs? (Paladin gets deva, but that's it. Oh and rangers get tracking. Not sure that was worth mentioning)
Paladin should get some holy might (3.5) like ability.
Barbarian should get an epic rage, and monk should have special kicks. I love the way Beamdog gave special abilities to Shadowdancer, but this should definitely be expanded to all classes
Allowing these HLA really made it more of hack and slash or high powered spell game where really all the grind and pain of learning spells and leveling up a little less important.
I never really like the degree that HLA allowed classes to customize the way classes would fit - as you would only use these HLA instead of the hard earned skills that made going through the trilogy that much more satisfying.
I remember the thrill of getting that first level 5 or 6 level spell as a mage or cleric; or the ability to attack 3 times around or a thief with 100+% in skills and never really failing unless you got that dreaded horrible throw. With HLA we lose a lot of those thrilling moments of class advancement.
So yes - I would have liked a mod that would end this or at least a revision of these so you could not pick them as you do now and make it more class specific rather than generic for all warrior classes for example.
I've played BG and BG2 a ton of times but really only played ToB once because of HLA.