Ambush

ilduderino

I find the ambushes where you start in the middle of the map surrounded by bandits firing at you really weird. I am travelling with two rangers and most of my party can stealth and somehow I get surrounded by a circle of bandits. Wtf? Do your job Minsc and Kivan! Likewise the ambushes where you start in a dead end. Well done scouts

Francois

Your rangers are low level after all... But I also don't like how the ranger class is implemented in BG.

I like rangers in the game Temple of Elemental Evil. For random encounters your Survival skill affects whether you will be ambushed or if you will do the ambushing. In that game Tracking also use your Survival skill check to detect what type of creatures are nearby.

randomhero890

Pure class rangers are pretty frustrating in bg1

Their move silently/hide in shadows skill grows pitifully slowly, preventing them from being reliable stealthers for me. I just ignore their stealth and have them wear heavy armor when I play one. May as well not even have the stealth option. Maybe in Bg2 it can get high enough to be reliable

They don't unlock their Druid spells until level 8, which even for a pure class they don't hit all that quickly, at least not compared to other pure classes. By the time you get them, you should be near the end of the game. And quite a lot of the low level Druid spells aren't very useful at the end of the game. They don't get grandmastery in their weapons, which that part I understand, but with all those other factors they are just meh. I always much prefer to give up the bow and go with ranger/cleric

Thels

It's easy to get dualwield on them, due to the 2 free pips. However, considering they can only go 2 pips in any specific weapon, there's not much to gain from that. The only advantage is that at level 3, you can have 3 pips in TWF, 2 pips in one melee weapon, and 2 pips in one ranged weapon. Or pip out two different melee weapons to keep your options open.

SirBatince

The 11-bandit waylaid is one of my favorite in the game. it's one of the only instance where the real threat of banditry is fleshed out directly in-your-face. Though I can see how bad it is for noreloads.

The lesser basilisk waylaid is pretty fun aswell

former_customer

I'm especially impressed with how they manage to surround you without detection in completely open ground. I can only assume they were disguised as chipmunks, allowing them to take up positions before BAM! revealing themselves as murderous bandits.

ilduderino

former_customer said:

I'm especially impressed with how they manage to surround you without detection in completely open ground. I can only assume they were disguised as chipmunks, allowing them to take up positions before BAM! revealing themselves as murderous bandits.

This is, like, exactly what I was trying to say man! This will not stand!

former_customer

ilduderino said:

former_customer said:

I'm especially impressed with how they manage to surround you without detection in completely open ground. I can only assume they were disguised as chipmunks, allowing them to take up positions before BAM! revealing themselves as murderous bandits.

This is, like, exactly what I was trying to say man! This will not stand!

The Voice is not to be questioned. If you have been waylaid by enemies, you must defend yourself. If you want to venture forth, you must gather your party. If the Voice tells you the dawn is especially cruel, there's nothing to do but loot your dead foster father.

Heed the Voice.

filcat88

If we really want ot find a wrinkle in the perfection that is the whole BG Saga, I would say it is the lack of ability check (of course, aside from the thief skills, which are a way to emulate them). There is no Perception check to do in th game, so an ambush is just random.

dunbar

But there must be some sort of check, how else would the game know to ambush me every time I'm encumbered/slowed, or down to 1Hp, or when my fighter/mage has forgotten to put his bloody armour back on after casting a spell?

former_customer

dunbar said:

But there must be some sort of check, how else would the game know to ambush me every time I'm encumbered/slowed, or down to 1Hp, or when my fighter/mage has forgotten to put his bloody armour back on after casting a spell?

One of the truly brilliant bits of game design in the original Baldur's Gate series is its simulation of tabletop dice. As PnP gamers all know, the dice are only random when they want to be.

Grond0

randomhero890 said:

Pure class rangers are pretty frustrating in bg1

Their move silently/hide in shadows skill grows pitifully slowly, preventing them from being reliable stealthers for me. I just ignore their stealth and have them wear heavy armor when I play one. May as well not even have the stealth option. Maybe in Bg2 it can get high enough to be reliable

I usually play solo (which makes a big difference), but I find stealth extremely useful even in BG1. A ranger wearing the boots of stealthing has an ability of around 100% by the end of BG1 without having sacrificed anything (while thieves could only do that at the expense of other skills). The amount of light makes a huge difference to stealthing success, so if you're struggling with that you might want to routinely rest until dark before exploring maps.

If you want to be a bit cheesy then walk a stealthed ranger up to an enemy and change into plate in front of them! Change of armour is allowed by the game engine so long as combat has not actually started.

Thels

The Ranger (at least temporarily) sacrifices the ability to wear heavy armor. Unless, of course, you use one of their kits.

Grond0

The restriction is the other way round. Basic rangers can wear any armour they want (though can't stealth in heavy armour), but the standard ranger kits all have armour restrictions.

Thels

Yes, but you have to be in light armor to Stealth. So... if you're a vanilla ranger, and you want to stealth, you have to equip light armor, and thus forego the benefits of heavy armor, albeit temporarily.

Francois

You can use light armor to scout and locate enemies, then change into full plate & shield to kick ass. Unless you are being waylaid of course...

Another problem with this 2nd edition game is that heavy armor don't impose limits on dexterity bonuses. In 3.5 for instance a character with super-human Dex may have better AC in light armor compared to full plate.

Thels

Actually, in 3.5 it's set up so that Padded Armor (+1 AC, +8 Max Dex) and Full Plate (+8 AC, +1 Max Dex) are at the top, and that none of the other basic armors beats that combination of 9 AC.

Of course, there's Mithral, which is a lot cheaper on light armor than heavy, and a Mithral Chain Shirt would offer (+4 AC, +6 Max Dex) for only 1100 gp, less than a regular Full Plate. A Mithral Full Plate would offer (+8 AC, +3 Max Dex), but is insanely pricy. A +2 Full Plate (+10 AC, +1 Max Dex) would be cheaper than that, but then, a +2 Mithral Chain Shirt (+6 AC, +6 Max Dex) would be slightly cheaper than that.

Alternatively, you could not wear any armor and go with Bracers of Protection, which permit full Dex bonus.

Zilber

Francois said:

You can use light armor to scout and locate enemies, then change into full plate & shield to kick ass. Unless you are being waylaid of course...

Another problem with this 2nd edition game is that heavy armor don't impose limits on dexterity bonuses. In 3.5 for instance a character with super-human Dex may have better AC in light armor compared to full plate.

A properly tailored suit of mail is not really restricting, though the padding under it can be quite bulky (that's the gambeson, the thing D&D states protects poorer than leather, and moves easier than it, reality turns those around), and while a full suit of fitted plate does restrict movement, it does so a lot less than you'd think:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hlIUrd7d1Q

Though the mathematical equasion is a thing of beauty, and good for game balance.

Thels

Though it's pretty clear from the movie why you don't want to sneak in it. That makes a lot of noise!