Help me choose class for a new trilogy run!
jankiel
Member Posts: 127
I've played the series some time ago and I've played most of the powergamey type of charnames. This time I want to try something else. I'd like to try a crappy class with no attribute reloading. Suggestions? Wizard slayer, beastmaster, shifter, jester?
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Why not play something that doesn't require any particular attributes at all, like a Shaman or a Sorcerer? You can take what you get and it'll feel the same.
Hear me out. The best reason to choose humans is 1) dual classing, and 2) you can be any class (except dwarves defender). Among the non-humans, each has one place where they excel. Dwarves and half-orcs are excellent fighters, halflings are great thieves, gnomes can be illusionists (including cleric/illusionists) and elves excel as mages. Half-elves get minor resistance to sleep and charm, infravision, and THE best multiclass selection. So make a single-class half-elf. Fighter would be the most replaceable in all the games, I should think, or maybe cleric, but clerics do get awesome spells.
In addition, as long as you have slight fire protection and use only your spell offensively in the first half of bg1, you'll never fall under horrible wild surge
Beastmaster is probably the way since he wants a shit class. I think avenger aren't that great aswell. generic class are weaker, but generic mage remain super strong.
I have done a lot of online research into different classes before I finally decided on the Cavalier. On and off, I must have done months of research, (which eliminated many other classes before narrowing my final choices down to Cavalier and Sorcerer.) I still want to play a Sorcerer if I ever have the time and opportunity in the future.
I have been comparing the Sorcerer and its Dragon Disciple kit. Here is my conclusion:
In terms of the game's narrative, playing a Sorcerer makes the most sense, due to the main character's "heritage". The Sorcerer has innate powers inherited from her parent and bloodline. If you know anything about the series and its protagonist, playing a Sorcerer makes the most narrative sense. The class fits the protagonist's story. (Actually, a Sorcerer would make more narrative sense than a Dragon Disciple, but IMO Dragon Disciple would be easier and consistently strong throughout the series; i.e., consistently, not just near the end.)
The only disadvantage of the Dragon Disciple is that she would miss out on one spell casting per level per day, which supposely would matter more at higher levels. However, that disadvantage could be easily overcome with the high-level Wish spell and a Wisdom of 18+. And, based on what I have read, the spellcasting limitation had not been a problem for players who had played a Sorcerer and/or Dragon Disciple. They had never run out of spells at high levels.
Dragon Disciple uses the d6 hit dice, (i.e., he gains up to 6 HP per level,) which add up to be 20 HP at level 10, (after which Sorcerer and Dragon Disciple gain the same amount of HP per level.) 20 HP is equal to five levels worth of HP for a Sorcerer. (Notes: a normal Sorcerer uses d4 hit dice.)
Here is the biggest factor why I favor Dragon Disciple over Sorcerer: a human or half-elven Dragon Disciple (but not necessarily an elven one) who started out with 18 Constitution should be able to reach reach 20 CON in the first Baldur's Gate (BG1). (Actually, even an elven sorcerer can reach 20 CON by using a tome.) At 20 CON, a character gains health regeneration. That is huge advantage. In BG2, the sorcerer can regain her spells and full health after a Wish spell or rest.
Yet another consideration: a high-level Dragon Disciple has 100% natural resistance against fire, which is immunity to fire. She should be able to have over 100% fire resistance with the proper gear or spells. At over 100% fire resistance, she would regain health when she was attacked by or in fire. So, the Dragon Disciple can use a fire area-of-effect spell to wear down enemies while she is unaffected or even regains health inside the fire. That consideration opens up some interesting spell choices. Enemies that use fire attacks (which are common) would be useless against a Dragon Discple.
In BG1, a Sorcerer in BG1 with her very limited spell repertoire would be hard to play. A Dragon Disciple's dragon breath (and higher HP) would make playing through BG1 much easier. According to the HowLongToPlay website, the completionist walkthrough of BG1 would take 80 hours. Seige of Dragonspear takes 42 hours. The completionist of BG2 would take 120 hours. So one-third of the game series would be spent in BG1. I would rather have an enjoyable, fun experience throughout the entire series over a frustating experience for 80 percent of the game just to become overpowered for the last 20 percent.
Maybe a wild mage without chaos shild?
@ktchong
I am still not completely convinced of the Dragon Disciple's supremacy. Sure Fire Protection is helpful but even if you have a fire resistance of 127%, every fire attack will interrupt your spell casting.
Regeneration is nice in Baldurs Gate 1 (there are many ways to regenerate in BG2) but it feels rather like a comfort bonus to me.
I think the reason why a lot of people prefer the sorcerer over Dragon Disciples is the more offensive bias due to the extra spell per level which becomes very important if the spellcaster uses timerstop + improved alacrity. In this situation, it doesn't matter if the spellcaster can cast wish to regenerate the spells. The sorcerer can use all spells without leaving the timestop and he/she has more of them. This means more 'firepower'.
So I would prefer the Dragon Disciple in IWD and maybe in BG1 but not in BG2.
The OP asked for crappy classes, though. Not sure if they wanted genuinely bad, or just not completely badass, or something more quirky. Any of the Bard classes can be interesting and quirky, and not totally badass (well a fully buffed Blade can be). A wizard slayer might be more what you're looking for in a crappy class, I just can't bring myself to pass up all the shiny loot, but that's me. An Avenger Druid might be an interesting, but not totally badass class. A single class cleric might qualify for crappy too, although the Lathander and Helm kits have abilities that give you extra attacks, and make them less craptastic. Monks can be quirky and crappy in the early game, but once they hit the mid-teens, level-wise, they do become completely badass.
As for non-straight clerics, ... boy, that's a great setup for a punchline, isn't it?
A Sorcerer is more powerful than a Dragon DIsciple in mid-to-late BG2, but not quite so in BG1. A Dragon Disciple's power is more consistent throughout the whole series. In BG1, the Sorcerer is meek as a kitten, has a very limited spell selection, and is difficult to keep alive and play. The advantages of the Dragon Disciple kit - i.e., its fire breath that is very useful at low-to-mid levels, higher hit dice, AC bonuses, fire resistance/immunity/heal/regeneration, potential health regeneration via Constitution bonuses - improve a sorcerer's playability and survivability in BG1 and early BG2.
A Sorcerer may become extremely overpowered in, let say, the last 20 to 30 percent of the BG saga, (i.e., Thrones of Bhaal.) However, the Sorcerer is not quite as powerful in first 70 to 80 percent of the series. A Dragon Disciple may not be as powerful as a pure Sorcerer in the last 10 to 20 percent, but he is consistently strong throughout the series. According to HowLongToBeat.com, BG1:EE takes about 80 hours to complete. BG2:EE takes about 120 hours. So: is it worthwhile to suffer through about 150 hours of the series as a weakling to become overpowered in the last 50 hours?
When people discuss some "uber-powerful" class or kit, they often consider only the last 10, 20 or 30 percent of the series. They ignore the early 80 to 90 percent, from BG1 to early-to-mid BG2. A famous example of such a class/kit is the Kensai/Mage. The "Kensage" certainly becomes unstoppable in Throne of Bhaal. However, the Kensage in BG1 - or really just a Kensai in BG1 - is a glass cannon. A Kensai is very difficult to keep alive and a real pain to play in BG1.
Similar to a Kensage, a Sorcerer is weak in the beginning so he can be quite unenjoyable to play in BG1. The Dragon Disciple kit alleviates that problem by boosting a Sorcerer's playability and survivability in the beginning, at the expense of slightly less spell power. The Dragon Disciple would still be very powerful at the end - just not as powerful as a pure Sorcerer, and only for the last 10 or 20 percent of the series.
Most importantly, this is the BG1 subforum after all. So, here is my point again: a pure Sorcerer becomes very powerful in the final act of the BG saga, but he could be a pain to play and keep alive in BG1. A Dragon Disciple may not be as powerful as a Sorcerer at the end, but he would be more consistently strong and useful throughout the series. In my book, that makes a Dragon Disciple more powerful than a Sorcerer, on average.
I actually find Sorcs to be pretty much super-powered in BG1 because they can output more sleeps than any other mage type which, thanks to the bg2 engine's change to sleep, makes that spell super OP. If you *don't* use sleep you still have access to some great spells far more often than a regular mage - since it's pretty rare you'll actually use more than a few spells per level anyhow it doesn't hurt that badly to miss out on random, rarely used, utility spells. Having a sorc that simply picks blind as their level 1 spell should be able to compete with any other mage since they can output more blinds per day lol.