Help with Fighter/Mage build (Not a newbie)

Ken

Hey hey, I have spent (way too much time) wondering how to make my BG character.

What I want:
Grand Mastery in Darts (Maybe it's better to only have specialitation?)
Single weapon specialition (Am going to use the old Monk animation, so dualwield is a no go)
Dualing to Mage later on
Going through BG1 - TOB

What I am wondering about:
Having a thief class first, and then dual. (Would like to open lock, disable traps) but it seems that no thiefclass can get more than 1 star in darts?

A mage will get 3 stars to use. If my first Fighter class had 4 stars in Darts, would I then be able to put the 1 mage star (after dualing) into darts again to gain 5 stars?

If not, then I'll probably just spend all fighter proficiencies on darts and single weapon style. And have the last 3 mage stars on dagger, staff and sling.


What level should I dualclass at? A pure fighter class don't really have any great bonuses after lvl 7 or 9. I will probably go with lvl 9 for that extra proficiency.

Oxford_Guy

BTW single weapon specialization doesn't help your AC or Crit chance when chucking darts, in case you were wondering

Oxford_Guy

Ken said:

Hey hey, I have spent (way too much time) wondering how to make my BG character.

What I want:
Grand Mastery in Darts (Maybe it's better to only have specialitation?)

If they'll be using BG2 rules for weapon mastery in BGEE, three pips in darts (or even just two) is probably enough for you

Ken said:

Single weapon specialition (Am going to use the old Monk animation, so dualwield is a no go)

Not sure of the point of that (see my previous post), except to give an AC boost when holding your dagger and casting spells?

Ken said:

Dualing to Mage later on
Going through BG1 - TOB

What I am wondering about:
Having a thief class first, and then dual. (Would like to open lock, disable traps) but it seems that no thiefclass can get more than 1 star in darts?

No, Swashbucklers can put 2 pips in melee weapons, but not missile.

Ken said:

A mage will get 3 stars to use. If my first Fighter class had 4 stars in Darts, would I then be able to put the 1 mage star (after dualing) into darts again to gain 5 stars?

I think so, but only after you've got your fighter levels back. DON'T put any stars in *any* proficiency you would share with your fighter levels until after you've levelled back, otherwise I think you lose them. Best bet is either to go for sling (so you have something to do whilst waiting for your fighter levels to get back) or staff (as there are some decent staves later in the game).

Ken said:

If not, then I'll probably just spend all fighter proficiencies on darts and single weapon style. And have the last 3 mage stars on dagger, staff and sling.

Daggers are not great for a mage, no magic throwing ones in BG1, and you don't want to get into melee if you can avoid it, so what's the point of the other ones? In BG2 the +3 firetooth throwing dagger is good, but you'll have to wait a while to get it. They're also heavier and harder to stack than darts.

Ken said:

What level should I dualclass at? A pure fighter class don't really have any great bonuses after lvl 7 or 9. I will probably go with lvl 9 for that extra proficiency.

7 or 9, but 9 is probably way more than you need with this build, by level 7 you will have 6 proficiencies, though you'd get more HP at lvl 9.

Ken

...Okay, so that means I'm back to square one!

Flaw 1 = Darts do not work in conjunction with Single Weapon specialization.
Flaw 2 = Seemingly using the BG2 standerd of Grand Mastery.

Might go with:
Lvl 10 Swashbuckler, dual to Mage
+1 Darts
+ 1-2 Single weapon
+ 1 Daggers/short swords/Scimitar

Or Thief/Mage, same setting, but Thief levels become a nuisance in the end.

Oxford_Guy

Ken said:

...Okay, so that means I'm back to square one!

Flaw 1 = Darts do not work in conjunction with Single Weapon specialization.

No, I tested this recently. Not sure about throwing daggers, I'd be surprised, though and they're a bit rubbish

Ken said:

.
Flaw 2 = Seemingly using the BG2 standerd of Grand Mastery.

Well, its not really known what BGEE will use yet, there's a recent discussion about this here: http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/6316/fighter-proficiency-question/p1

Ken said:

.
Might go with:
Lvl 10 Swashbuckler, dual to Mage
+1 Darts
+ 1-2 Single weapon
+ 1 Daggers/short swords/Scimitar

Or Thief/Mage, same setting, but Thief levels become a nuisance in the end.

Swashie thief>mage is better than straight thief>mage, due to AC bonus, if nothing else. You're probably not going to be backstabbing, or are you?

If you want to chuck out lots of darts, fighter>mage is still better from that point of view

CaptRory

Speaking of hrowing darts and daggers, some spells and magical items give you things to throw. Minute Meteors, Cloak of the Stars, etc. What proficiency do they use?

Oxford_Guy

CaptRory said:

Speaking of hrowing darts and daggers, some spells and magical items give you things to throw. Minute Meteors, Cloak of the Stars, etc. What proficiency do they use?

I don't think they use a proficiency (maybe Cloak of Stars, as it produces darts), but give you a large to-hit bonus to make up for it, think this is one of the reasons a fighter/mage is better for MMMs, for example, because the don't get penalised so much for not being proficient in a weapon (I think...). At least this is how it works for the Cleric magic weapons.

CaptRory

I didn't think Meteors used a proficiency, but I've been wrong before and no one has given me a straight answer before haha.

Brude

@Ken Since your first impulse was darts, it sounds like you're looking to play a Mage that has a little more ranged utility during downtime (ie, they have some physical damage capabilities or special skills to use when not casting).

If that's the case, I'd probably go for a Fighter dualed at level 13 or a Swashie dualed at level 10. The other option is to take a longer look at Skalds, which give you a similar play style, fast leveling, and a few niche skills to boot.

If you're not looking to play a melee powerhouse caster (Kensai/Mage or Blade) then I'd definitely go for Shortbows or Crowssbows as your primary proficiency and forget about the extras from Weapon Specializations. None of them are any good for ranged toons.

Ken

What a shame.. Sounds like I'm forced to just go the simple Kensai/Mage route, although I shall fight my way to be a swashbuckler/mage!

Dogmatix

If one is a patient reader, the following site is of great help when planning how to use mage/cleric spells (or how to choose which spells to take for sorcerer). Just remember that you can't get mage spells for levels 6-9 until Baldur's Gate 2.

http://www.sorcerers.net/Games/BG2/SpellsReference/Main.htm (choose non-scripted menu if the menu doesn't work correctly)

Fish

@Ken Swashbuckler>mage can offer some advantages over kensai>mage. For 1.1M XP a Swashbuckler will be at level 15 or 0.16M at lvl 10. This will give a +4 AC bonus (+3 at lvl 10), +3 to damage (+2 at lvl 10) and a THACO of 9 (12 at lvl 10) (Plus DEX bonus). A Kensai will take 1.25M XP to get to lvl 13 0 AC bonus but will have a much lower THACO and saving throws. Add to this that a Swashbuckler thief skills include "Detect Illusion" (very helpful for even high level mage misdirection spells.) If you use daggers as your weapon, you can specialize (+2 slots) and enabled two weapon style (both daggers) to maximize slot usage and also use throwing daggers.

Ken

Yea, except I will use a old character animation (monk) from BG1 so dualwielding is out of the question.

Think I'll just go Thief/Mage, then I can look forward to UAI

Oxford_Guy

BTW a gnome Thief/Illusionist gets a bucketloads of spells (and the shorty saving spell/wandthow bonuses and racial thief bonuses), which could be an alternative? The don't get access to Necromancy spells though (so no Abi Dalzim's Horrid Wilting...), nor the +1 bonus to swords/bows and 90% charm resistance that an elf thief/mage multi-class would get.

Ken

I shall never be a gnome! Tiny freaks. Maybe a half-elf, but I like the roleplaying of being human! Being nearly immortal (aging wise) as a halfelf, elf seems demotivating to me..

Oxford_Guy

Ken said:

I shall never be a gnome! Tiny freaks.

That's a bit gnome-ist, LOL! :-)

Ken said:

Maybe a half-elf, but I like the roleplaying of being human! Being nearly immortal (aging wise) as a halfelf, elf seems demotivating to me..

Why demotivating?

Ken

Well, as an elf you live like.. Forever!

As a fragile human, gaining "immortality" or godly powers just seems so much more worth fighting for!

A bit of roleplaying

Oxford_Guy

Ken said:

Well, as an elf you live like.. Forever!

Unless something kills you...

Ken said:

As a fragile human, gaining "immortality" or godly powers just seems so much more worth fighting for!

A bit of roleplaying

Fair enough! :-)